The pedestal fans place boxing on is weird

[BigMuffler]

People often complain about how MMA fighters lack boxing technique compared to pro boxers. While this is true - logically an MMA fighter shouldn't be able to have equal boxing to a pure boxer of similar standing while having to train many other things - most MMA fighters also don't have the clinch striking technique of pure Muay Thai fighters or the kicking technique of pure kickboxers, yet it's much rarer to see complaints about a lack of kicking or clinch striking technique in MMA. Also, a big deal is often made about the idea of a top boxer coming into MMA with people saying they would be a champion with a year of training or some such, while top kickboxers and MTists coming into MMA are just viewed as interesting prospects but generally not hyped to the moon.

I know some will reply with 'boxing has a much deeper talent pool therefore those who reach the top are true A level athletes', but looking at how much padding many boxers' records have and their limited percentage of legit opponents, I'm not sure how much it really rings true that boxers who get to the top are so much more proven than MMA fighters. Also how much larger a talent pool does boxing actually have than wrestling? There are tons of people who wrestle but even top wrestlers aren't given the mythic status that some attribute to boxers.

Is it mainly the fact boxing is a big money sport whose fighters rarely cross over to MMA in their prime due to the financial incentives of sticking with boxing that gives it its mystique over other striking (and grappling as well) sports?

 

[Fig4threadlock]

I would take a MMA fighter with clinch work (striking/grappling) allowed over a boxer in a Boxing match any day,I would never bet on a Boxer in a MMA fight against someone who is not Tim Sylvia.

 

[Bokelj]

I think for older boxers it's exposure (more boxing gyms), for newer boxers it's gonna be money. I do see a shift happening because the real star power in boxing is left to a happy few, Golovkin, Klitschko and Ward are exceptions, not the rule.

The lesser known boxers don't make that much more than MMA fighters and the money involved in MMA is increasing. In time I believe the boxers that lack the star power or the rise to greatness will choose MMA and deepen the MMA pool. The reason for crossing over in sports will always be contracts. There is too much to lose and too little to gain to take risks.

 

[soulsstealer]

mma fighters are lowest rung of the barrel, deal with it.

 

[MechMA]

My boxing is shite and I went against a Russian boxer of my weight class in MMA and... I got tooled for all of 10 secs before I got ahold of a deep single-leg and dragged him down... He had zero to offer. Any and all combat ability left him and I got a sub 40 secs in...
Granted this was in the gym but he was going pretty hard but landed nothing significant that at 100% would've ended it...

 

[$uicideboy$]

the best boxer is better at boxing than the best mma fighter is at mma

 

[U.S. Soldier]

It's the same thing about that A level Athlete BS that goes on around here

 

[Human Bass]

the best boxer is better at boxing than the best mma fighter is at mma

How do you measure that? Boxing is much more limited when it comes to attacks , therefore allows much more fine tuning.

 

[Spooon]

I know very little about boxing, but I think not only purses are better but the time between fights and the amount of damage sustained in each fight are also smaller, meaning that a boxer can do more fights than a MMA fighter.

 

[fightfan62]

I don't know what the OP is talking about. MMA fans shit on boxing all the time. Constantly talking about how boxers would get destroyed in a street fight. How no boxer could ever make the transition to MMA. Talking about how boxing is dying. Bringing up James Toney vs Randy Couture, even James Toney was a shot fight at that point.

If you ask me, boxing gets the least amount of respect compared to other combat sports by MMA fans.

 

[goodnamestaken]

Legitimate points made by the thread-starter. In support of those points, I'd say the following:

1) Certain elements of proper boxing technique and proper MMA technique are mutually exclusive. Examples: A boxer's bob-and-weave may go lower than an MMA fighter's due to lack of concern for headkicks; a boxer's stance gives more shoulder and less body whereas an MMA fighter's stance is more square (better takedown defense), etc.

2) In addressing the "mythic" status that is given to top boxers (as opposed to top wrestlers), I would assume that this is only because of how much top boxers are paid. In most people's eyes, such financial success automatically grants more (perceived) "legitimacy."

The one counter-point that I would make to the thread-starter's arguments, though, would be that there IS ample reason to complain about the boxing technique of many MMA fighters; however, it doesn't deal with those issues I mentioned above, but rather with the very basic boxing techniques that can and should be implemented in MMA striking. They are:

1) Head movement
2) Chin down and hands up (not quite as high in MMA due to takedown defense, but still high enough to maintain defensive responsibility for strikes)
3) Footwork (shuffle-stepping, angles, etc. as opposed to plodding/walking/following)

I can think of quite a few MMA fighters who demonstrate excellent technique with regard to the above. However, they still tend to be the exceptions to the rule. These three boxing fundamentals are perfectly transferable to MMA, yet we still see many--a majority even--professional MMA fighters who display atrocious striking techhnique in these regards.

Obviously, the beauty of MMA is that any fighter can compensate for certain deficiencies in one area by possessing outstanding skill in another. However, this of course is still no excuse for one not to improve upon one's weaknesses. As a whole, I believe that the overall level of the average MMA fighter has improved tremendously over the last 5 years, boxing technique included. That being said, there is still much more refinement to be made.

 

[Godzilla3232]

It's one of those things that's only true because people keep saying it.

In the beginning boxing had decades of tradition and respect behind it, while MMA was as if bumfights.com somehow ended up on TV. Things have changed, MMA has been all but legitimized, and the best of the best athletes in MMA are easily comparable to those in boxing, but it doesn't matter. It's safer to just parrot what everyone else says; what's historically been said about these 2 sports. To offer an opinion that goes against the status-quo is to open yourself up to ridicule, but if you speak in support of the status-quo people will be nice to you and possibly even compliment your insight.

 

[SeattleFightFan]

because you're on a site with a huge turnover rate and a continual new set of 17 year olds who need to talk through a bunch of 17 year old shit. just like you used to.

when i was 17 years old it was "oh ya? well how would an American Football lineman do in a rugby match?!?" and then i'd stick my chest out like i was the first person to think of something as grand as that. if it wasn't MMA for you, you probably have a good non-MMA example as well.

the boxing / MMA tie is too obvious to ignore, and young new fans cannot avoid the same arguments you and i also probably thought were important when we were young new fans.

the only thing that's new is a continually shifting forum, because IRL you wouldn't be hanging out with 17 year olds talking about the same shit you did when you were 17. the obvious exception being:

 

[countswagula]

How do you measure that? Boxing is much more limited when it comes to attacks , therefore allows much more fine tuning.

Boxing has been around for much longer, and has had much more of a cumulative talent pool and competitive environment for the sport to evolve in.

 

[seapants]

mma fights are seen as "jack of all trades master of none" ... and people like masters

 

[BWC]

I don't know what the OP is talking about. MMA fans shit on boxing all the time. Constantly talking about how boxers would get destroyed in a street fight. How no boxer could ever make the transition to MMA. Talking about how boxing is dying. Bringing up James Toney vs Randy Couture, even James Toney was a shot fight at that point.

If you ask me, boxing gets the least amount of respect compared to other combat sports by MMA fans.

Haha I was thinking the same thing. Boxing put on a pedastal?? WTF are you talking about? Boxing gets dissed constantly by MMA fans. How many people always state "boxing is dying" when all the data points to the exact opposite being true.

MMA will never sniff boxing's jock in popularity, money, history, etc. Just get the eff over it..

 

[caliboi74lv]

I know very little about boxing, but I think not only purses are better but the time between fights and the amount of damage sustained in each fight are also smaller, meaning that a boxer can do more fights than a MMA fighter.

The purses are better, but you do still have boxers making less than a $1000 for a boxing match..I don't think boxers take less damage. There's been deaths in boxing. Recently a boxer went into a coma..and died, one other also went into a coma.
Champs in each sport make the money and fight less..

 

[caliboi74lv]

Haha I was thinking the same thing. Boxing put on a pedastal?? WTF are you talking about? Boxing gets dissed constantly by MMA fans. How many people always state "boxing is dying" when all the data points to the exact opposite being true.

MMA will never sniff boxing's jock in popularity, money, history, etc. Just get the eff over it..

Very true..MMA fans think it's boring. I'm still a boxing fan. I grew upi watching Leonard, Holmes, Hagler, Duran, Camacho, Arguello, Mancini..Tyson in his prime..and still in the 90's with Morales, Barerra, Tapia, RJJ,Holyfield, Castillo and Corales, DeLaHoya, Gatti, and Foreman comin back. Got into MMA around mid late 90's. Still like watching boxing, I don't as much, but boxing is still here, even if people don't want to admit it. It's nice to see some free boxing like in the mid/late 80's on national tv. PPV I don't buy, but go to a friends house.

 

[cumafish]

A Muay Thai champion has better MT skill than an MMA champion.
A Olympic wrestler has better wrestling skill than an MMA champion.
A Boxing champion has better boxing skill than an MMA champion.

the list can go on ad infinitum.

 

[Ar145984]

I know very little about boxing, but I think not only purses are better but the time between fights and the amount of damage sustained in each fight are also smaller, meaning that a boxer can do more fights than a MMA fighter.

That's arguable. In MMA, alot of fights can end in submissions as knockouts. In boxing, due to the padding of the gloves, many boxers can take hits, but the impact of the padding still causes brain damage, just not as much to knock someone out as easily as in MMA. Add to that, boxers do 12 rds and have multiple opportunities to getup from a potential KO each round, the brain damage into the 7th or 8th round is insane. I'd take being KO'd in MMA over a long process of being TKO'd over and over.

The damage from MMA mostly comes from the grappling and conditioning required, rather than the actual fight. ACL tears, hip surgeries and limb damages can stack up.