Two vital techniques not used against Machida.

[Fzubek]

I'm surprised Silva didn't fight a smarter fight. I think Machida has done so well because he is truly one of the first fighters utilizing this type of striking technique in MMA.
And I'm not referring to his Karate background, but rather his stick and move, defense first style.

But this isn't a new style to boxing, and while I realize utilizing Boxing techniques alone wont win you a fight against someone as well versed as Machida, it would completely nullify his offense and defense on the feet.

Two things i have never seen someone try against Machida..

#1 Jabbing- You simply cannot chase someone as good as Machida down without a jabbing, double jabbing and even tripling the jab.

A consistent jab, would not have only helped Silva create contact with Machida, it would have allowed him to close the distance, and create oppurtunities to land a right hand.

#2 Cutting the Octagon off, rather than following Machida in a straight line.

Ortiz and Silva followed Machida around one way, in straight lines, and this plays right into Machidas technique, and he doesnt have to think about when or where to throw his counters as he knows his opponent is following him in a straight line.

 

[Mef-ninja]

your kinda right about the jab.. but your wrong about the cuttin off the octagon.. its easier said than done against machida.. you see machida doesnt move just backwards.. he goes side to side.. he good at backin up.. coming from a different angle and popin you one in the face.

 

[nefti]

asking silva to fight differently is like asking machida to fight head on. They fight like they fight. What disagree is HOW he went about being agressive. I would have asked him to throw alot of jabs and low kicks. You can go foward without throwing power shots and exposing yourself. IMHO, you have to jab and low kick against machida.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

I think it will be a while until someone really figures out or even tries to counter his style. Too many guys will continue to chase him thinking their chin is good enough to fall into his trap and take his strikes.

 

[TsukinoKage]

You're speaking from a boxing standpoint, but have you considered the repercussions of throwing a triple jab with KICKS involved?

Watch a kickboxing bout. Jabs are used, but not nearly as much as in pure boxing, because of the modified range and availability of counters.

 

[nefti]

I think it will be a while until someone really figures out or even tries to counter his style. Too many guys will continue to chase him thinking their chin is good enough to fall into his trap and take his strikes.

there is nothing wrong with "chasing" a guy down. It's how you do it

 

[refuseTOlose]

I agree with throwing the jab, but wouldn't trippling it up leave him open for many different counters, which Machida is an expert at. Also, cutting off the octagon is very hard, especially with a guy like Machida. This is why I would love to see Rashad Evans to fight Machida. Evans isn't a guy to chase guys down and Jackson is an expert when it comes to crafting game plans. I think Machida's stance is good for throwing leg kicks, but you can't really throw them when he is using great footwork, so you would have to pick your spots. I'm obviously not the most knowledgable when it comes to striking, but those are just my 2 cents...

 

[ChachiKiller]

I agree with throwing the jab, but wouldn't trippling it up leave him open for many different counters, which Machida is an expert at. Also, cutting off the octagon is very hard, especially with a guy like Machida. This is why I would love to see Rashad Evans to fight Machida. Evans isn't a guy to chase guys down and Jackson is an expert when it comes to crafting game plans. I think Machida's stance is good for throwing leg kicks, but you can't really throw them when he is using great footwork, so you would have to pick your spots. I'm obviously not the most knowledgable when it comes to striking, but those are just my 2 cents...

I agree. I think Rashad has one of the styles that would pose some problems for Machida.

Greg Jackson was like Bill Belichick to me until last Sat. GSP was bulling Penn against the fence and pounding him on the ground. Jackson told GSP to make it a kickboxing match in the 3rd. GSP went out, stood in the center of the ring and took three unanswered punches from Penn. GSP then took him down and pounded him for another nine minutes.

 

[Forkfoot]

You'd see people using the jab a lot more on Machida if he weren't a southie.

 

[Daido_Juku]

I think one good Idea, is not fight a stand up battle against Machida but a grappling match.

 

[Too Defensive**]

I think one good Idea, is not fight a stand up battle against Machida but a grappling match.

You mean like what TIto tried to do?

No, the only way to beat Machida is not to go after him, but to stay in the pocket and let him come to you. If you chase him down, he will back up, then suddenly spring forward out of no where with a knock out punch. Let him come to you and implement the same strategy. Unfortunatly, this would make for a boring fight which would go with a decision.

 

[Meatsack]

I think one good Idea, is not fight a stand up battle against Machida but a grappling match.

While that would help you not get punched and kicked, it would pose the problem of dealing with Lyoto's black belt in BJJ.

I think it will be interesting (if Dana ever lets it happen) to see Rashad fight Machida. I agree that Rashad will pose some problems, and Greg Jackson will put together a good gameplan, I am giving the edge to Machida. Watching two counterstrikers square off can be a little frustrating; whoever abandons their gameplan first will lose.

#1 Jabbing- You simply cannot chase someone as good as Machida down without a jabbing, double jabbing and even tripling the jab.

Silva should have used the jab, yes, but I'm guessing Lyoto would probably counter that with low kicks until it became a little too punishing to try that very often.

 

[Too Defensive**]

While that would help you not get punched and kicked, it would pose the problem of dealing with Lyoto's black belt in BJJ.

I think it will be interesting (if Dana ever lets it happen) to see Rashad fight Machida. I agree that Rashad will pose some problems, and Greg Jackson will put together a good gameplan, I am giving the edge to Machida. Watching two counterstrikers square off can be a little frustrating; whoever abandons their gameplan first will lose.



Silva should have used the jab, yes, but I'm guessing Lyoto would probably counter that with low kicks until it became a little too punishing to try that very often.

I think the most obvious problem in grappling Machida is taking him down in the first place

 

[Meatsack]

I think the most obvious problem in grappling Machida is taking him down in the first place

True, but with Rashad's wrestling background, that is not an impossibility. Thinking of Rashad, specifically, that might be the kiss of death for him, as he doesn't alway seem to know what to do once he gets his opponent on the ground.

 

[Sinister]

your kinda right about the jab.. but your wrong about the cuttin off the octagon.. its easier said than done against machida.. you see machida doesnt move just backwards.. he goes side to side.. he good at backin up.. coming from a different angle and popin you one in the face.

Nothing you stated here says why a person couldn't or shouldn't attempt to cut Lyoto off. He's quick on his feet, but when someone moves side-to-side regardless of their speed, in ANY combat sport, you don't just follow them around. You step side-to-side, too, and you attempt to find their rhythm so you can disrupt it.

And for people saying the jab would be countered with kicks, I'd certainly hope someone in MMA would know not to throw arbitrary jabs from range. Fzubek is smart enough to know that he's talking about technically sound jabs, in which you step in with the jabs. You don't just jab and keep your feet where they are, and be a sitting duck for kicks. It's much harder to kick someone who is coming at you with a punch than it is to kick someone who is just standing there waiting to be kicked, or just walking around with their hands up.

Range is something MMA Fighters are just now starting to really understand. And I think it REALLY was shown with BJ's win over Sherk where BJ was successful at keeping Sherk at the end of a jab most of the night. When Rashad fought Forrest, I actually felt Rashad was trying to stay at long range too much and his quick hands would have been better served closer to Forrest rather than at the ends of his long limbs, which is why Rashad got out-struck on the outside. And Rashad's corner kept telling him to stay OUT, rather than close the gap and light Forrest up on the inside.

Sure he might have been taken down, but look what happened when the Fight went to the ground.

Sometimes people get the impression NOTHING works in MMA. Can't jab because of kicks, can't kick because of takedowns, can't cut off the octagon because of angles, etc. If that were true, Lyoto's just invincible, which is hardly the case.

 

[nefti]

jabs and low kicks should be every fighter's two best friends.

 

[Meatsack]

And for people saying the jab would be countered with kicks, I'd certainly hope someone in MMA would know not to throw arbitrary jabs from range. Fzubek is smart enough to know that he's talking about technically sound jabs, in which you step in with the jabs. You don't just jab and keep your feet where they are, and be a sitting duck for kicks. It's much harder to kick someone who is coming at you with a punch than it is to kick someone who is just standing there waiting to be kicked, or just walking around with their hands up.

I agree. However, while I do defer to your broader knowledge and experience, I think jabbing on Machida will open you up to being countered with kicks, especially if one doesn't follow up the jab with kicks or punches in combination.

 

[Sinister]

Again, not an arbitrary jab. Of course you're not going to win a Fight with a jab alone, but are you seriously picturing someone just jabbing and nothing else?

It's about using it to set something up.

 

[Meatsack]

The jab is best used to set up a combination, of course. I see a lot of fighters throwing 'one-and-done', though (look at BJ Penn on Saturday night).

 

[baconCrunch]

I'm surprised Silva didn't fight a smarter fight. I think Machida has done so well because he is truly one of the first fighters utilizing this type of striking technique in MMA.
And I'm not referring to his Karate background, but rather his stick and move, defense first style.

But this isn't a new style to boxing, and while I realize utilizing Boxing techniques alone wont win you a fight against someone as well versed as Machida, it would completely nullify his offense and defense on the feet.

Two things i have never seen someone try against Machida..

#1 Jabbing- You simply cannot chase someone as good as Machida down without a jabbing, double jabbing and even tripling the jab.

A consistent jab, would not have only helped Silva create contact with Machida, it would have allowed him to close the distance, and create oppurtunities to land a right hand.

#2 Cutting the Octagon off, rather than following Machida in a straight line.

Ortiz and Silva followed Machida around one way, in straight lines, and this plays right into Machidas technique, and he doesnt have to think about when or where to throw his counters as he knows his opponent is following him in a straight line.

you're right
if that person has a good jab
and to be honest, i can't think of one lhw in mma who does

in regards to chasing him down in a straight line
absolutely correct
and machida uses his footwork to get into position to strike, and not be hit
again, the problem is hardly any mma fighters have good enough footwork

the 3rd and most important element, reflexes/timing
machida has faster reflexes than anyone in the division
thiago silva, rampage jackson, chuck liddel, etc, all look like slo motion compared to machida

overall, machida has an around standup game
he understands his distance, good timing and natural reflexes
has very good kick, knee, boxing and clinch techniques
all around
i would say his only fault is sometimes he keeps his chin up when he comes in