What do you believe happens after death?

Some people find comfort in believing in an afterlife.

I find more comfort in believing that this is not a test. That what we do here matters. And that we need to enjoy it and make a positive impact because this is our one chance.
 
BisexualMMA said:
I think it is a pretty weak case for belief on its own and weaker still the more that people like William Lane Craig add to it.

Premise 1: Whatever begins to exist has a cause.
Premise 2: The universe began to exist.
Conclusion: The universe has a cause.

Premise 1... Whatever begins to exist has a cause. Does it? I reject the premise until that can be demonstrated to be true.
Premise 2... The universe began to exist. Did it? Demonstrate conclusively that it began to exist. Until then I reject the premise.
Conclusion... I have rejected both premises until they are demonstrated so I obviously don't subscribe to the conclusion.

Craig then adds more stuff to get to a personal Creator that I question or reject as well on its logical merits.
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What always bothered me about creation is that if everything has to be created by a creator, who created the creator. The creationists say that the creator always existed. If something like a creator can exist without being created, why can't everything else?
 
The answer can only be discovered in the present. It reminds me of some shaman thing where they bury themselves for days. Is that from Carlos Castaneda?

I'd rather take that as a metaphor and meditate instead.
 
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spacegnome said:
i know this to be false. why assume belief in an afterlife is formed from arrogance? i can think of so many other reasons that we know belief in an afterlife came from other than just arrogance.

your position seems unnecessary and reductive to me.
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Agreed. Ignorance, faith, and fear are also reasons to be believe in an afterlife. I envy the faithful actually. Must be nice to believe that this short and sometimes painful stay we have as living creatures is not all there is.
 
Noveltymortar said:
Agreed. Ignorance, faith, and fear are also reasons to be believe in an afterlife. I envy the faithful actually. Must be nice to believe that this short and sometimes painful stay we have as living creatures is not all there is.
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You envy those you dont understand and denigrate? Sounds like an untruth to me.
 
jmag said:
The answer can only be discovered in the present. It reminds me of some shaman thing where they bury themselves for days. Is that from Carlos Castaneda?

I'd rather take that as a metaphor and meditate instead.
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Meditation is one of the best ways to investigate this reality. I have not missed a day in 25 years.
 
I don't think anything happens. No proof that anything happens. No reason to believe it does. I am guessing its the same thing that happens when you lose consciousness. Nothing.
 
spacegnome said:
You envy those you dont understand and denigrate? Sounds like an untruth to me.
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Yes, I envy the faithful. Why would that be a lie? What reason would there be for me to lie about it? I'm conflicted about religion and faith. I think a society is mostly better with it. I just am not able to believe in the idea of an afterlife or the existence of God. We are animals and we die the same way as other animals.
 
Noveltymortar said:
Yes, I envy the faithful. Why would that be a lie? What reason would there be for me to lie about it? I'm conflicted about religion and faith. I think a society is mostly better with it. I just am not able to believe in the idea of an afterlife or the existence of God. We are animals and we die the same way as other animals.
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you dont understand them as all of the reasons you give for people believing are negatives and backhanded insults. you don't understand the phenomenon and have a very childish understanding of what brings people to faith in general.

way more often than not people are brought to spirituality from having intense and life changing spiritual awakenings that produce deep changes in the psyche.
 
@Noveltymortar

you ought to read a book called "variety of spiritual experiences" by William James. this is a serious scholarly work and one of the best treatments of the topic overall.

another book "psychology and religion" by the late psychologist carl jung treats the deep value of spirituality in the context of psychology and explains why he thinks that religion symbols emerge again and again in cultures with no cultural bleed-over because they are built into the unconscious mind.
 
spacegnome said:
you dont understand them as all of the reasons you give for people believing are negatives and backhanded insults. you don't understand the phenomenon and have a very childish understanding of what brings people to faith in general.

way more often than not people are brought to spirituality from having intense and life changing spiritual awakenings that produce deep changes in the psyche.
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I don't disagree that I don't understand all the reasons that bring people to faith. But what brings people to faith makes no difference to this argument because your experiences don't prove anything. The questions will only be answered after death. I have complete confidence that when you die, you will be completely dead because that is what life and death means. Anything else requires a suspension of all common sense and all logic. To believe in an afterlife is to believe in fairy tales, and that is what children believe in.

If after I die it turns out I'm wrong I will apologize to you when you show up in the forums on the other side.
 
I think your antenna turns off and the things that made you who you are get dispersed into the vast nothingness of the universe. If you’re lucky some of the fragments get picked up piecemeal by somethings somewhere eventually. It would be sort of pessimistic if not for the idea that who we are individually is informed and altered by the presence of countless others before use, forming and reforming, adding depth and complexity at every pass.
 
Noveltymortar said:
I don't disagree that I don't understand all the reasons that bring people to faith. But what brings people to faith makes no difference to this argument because your experiences don't prove anything. The questions will only be answered after death. I have complete confidence that when you die, you will be completely dead because that is what life and death means. Anything else requires a suspension of all common sense and all logic. To believe in an afterlife is to believe in fairy tales, and that is what children believe in.

If after I die it turns out I'm wrong I will apologize to you when you show up in the forums on the other side.
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what brings people to faith is the ONLY thing that matters in this discussion because i am disputing the reasons you gave and claimed friend. you brought up the reasons not me. i am just bringing some much needed information to that topic.
 
Your soul goes to one of two places...
 
spacegnome said:
what brings people to faith is the ONLY thing that matters in this discussion because i am disputing the reasons you gave and claimed friend. you brought up the reasons not me. i am just bringing some much needed information to that topic.
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It doesn't matter at all because it doesn't prove or disprove the question. I am going to leave it like this; I don't share your faith, but I am glad for you that found it.
 
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Noveltymortar said:
It doesn't matter at all but it doesn't prove or disprove the question. I am going to leave it like this; I don't share your faith, but I am glad for you that found it.
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i have not made a single claim about the reality behind the phenomenon. i am not making that argument here. again, i have only addressed your lack of understanding and denigration of the reasons people come to believe.
 
spacegnome said:
i have not made a single claim about the reality behind the phenomenon. i am not making that argument here. again, i have only addressed your lack of understanding and denigration of the reasons people come to believe.
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Fair enough. I was a bit harsh in my choice of words.
 
Noveltymortar said:
Fair enough. I was a bit harsh in my choice of words.
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fair enough man. those books are worth reading btw. let me put it to you this way. if i somehow found out there was not god for certain it would change almost nothing for me. spiritual practice is so powerful and effective at transforming peoples lives that it would not matter.
 
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