who are the best no gi grapplers in the world?

[Herfavcolor90]

The top nogi guys all swear by the gi. "Nogi4lyfe" guys will always be butthurt about this.

I like the Gi, but this has always been a bunk argument. All the top no-gi guys started training in a gi, simply because that's how most BJJ is taught. If you took the gi off of Marcelo Garcia and gave him the same training environment, do you really think he'd be worse off?

There's no actual proof that the gi does anything for ones no-gi game outside of bro science passed on by old school BJJ players. Maybe it does help, but there's no actual proof of it.

 

[Shemhazai]

There's no actual proof that the gi does anything for ones no-gi game outside of bro science passed on by old school BJJ players. Maybe it does help, but there's no actual proof of it.

More friction and grips makes you better at skills that get harder with more friction and grips. These happen to be the defensive skills, and bottom/guard movements in particular. So if your takedowns are good enough that you will never be put on your back, then I suppose the gi is not as necessary, but if you're among the vast majority that needs a good guard game to prevail against someone with the ability to take you down, training in (AND out of) the gi will be beneficial.

 

[dirtmcgirt444]

There's no actual proof that the gi does anything for ones no-gi game outside of bro science passed on by old school BJJ players. Maybe it does help, but there's no actual proof of it.

Hasn't 10th Planet been around for almost a decade? If training only no-gi makes you better at no-gi than there would be a number of 10th Planet no-gi champions at this point, no? It's not conclusive but it's a pretty good indicator that those who train in the gi can transition to no-gi and be just as good if not better than strictly no-gi players.

 

[BJJArsenal]

When the title is Best nogi grapplers in the world, and you reference to some random guy who won ADCC trials, it tells that basically everyone at top trains with the gi.

Not debating that. I'm not on this guy's nuts (I later found his name: Adam Sachnoff) I just don't think he's a slouch.

 

[Ice 9 Cobra]

Hasn't 10th Planet been around for almost a decade? If training only no-gi makes you better at no-gi than there would be a number of 10th Planet no-gi champions at this point, no? It's not conclusive but it's a pretty good indicator that those who train in the gi can transition to no-gi and be just as good if not better than strictly no-gi players.

10P is such a small percentage of grapplers though. Just statistically alone its hard for them to make a large impact. Then you add in that Eddie has a very limited number of blackbelts running their own schools, and its hard for them to compete.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

10P is such a small percentage of grapplers though. Just statistically alone its hard for them to make a large impact. Then you add in that Eddie has a very limited number of blackbelts running their own schools, and its hard for them to compete.

well, its unfair to compare 10th vs the whole gi world, but if you compare 10th planet vs a single team, Atos, GFT, Alliance etc etc, thats an equalizer, yet 10thplannet is still way far beyond any succesful team.

by the way, I like 10thplanet.

 

[Ice 9 Cobra]

10P is still way smaller than alliance. Why not compare it against another affiliate it's size.

 

[Saenchai]

when 10p has the size of alliance or gracie barra, lets then compare...

 

[Herfavcolor90]

More friction and grips makes you better at skills that get harder with more friction and grips. These happen to be the defensive skills, and bottom/guard movements in particular. So if your takedowns are good enough that you will never be put on your back, then I suppose the gi is not as necessary, but if you're among the vast majority that needs a good guard game to prevail against someone with the ability to take you down, training in (AND out of) the gi will be beneficial.

And no-gi training makes you better at scrambling, guillotines, wrestling, etc.. there are trade offs to both styles, one isn't superior. If you can't develop your guard without a gi, you're not magically going to be Braulio Estima with one.

At the end of the day, thinking the gi has effected elite no-gi grapplers is ridiculous. They'd be elite no matter if they wore pajamas to class or not.

 

[Herfavcolor90]

Hasn't 10th Planet been around for almost a decade? If training only no-gi makes you better at no-gi than there would be a number of 10th Planet no-gi champions at this point, no? It's not conclusive but it's a pretty good indicator that those who train in the gi can transition to no-gi and be just as good if not better than strictly no-gi players.

This point doesn't make sense. 10th Planet is a completely different style than BJJ in the same way that Sambo or Luta Livre are different. To associate them with normal no-gi BJJ is a bit dishonest at best.

 

[xMTDx]

Leozada is doing well

 

[kjg1672]

I think Rustam is your best answer.

 

[yovan]

I think Rustam is your best answer.

And Keenan choked out Rustam no-gi as a purple...

EDIT: he won on points actually

 

[dirtmcgirt444]

This point doesn't make sense. 10th Planet is a completely different style than BJJ in the same way that Sambo or Luta Livre are different. To associate them with normal no-gi BJJ is a bit dishonest at best.

I guess I'm not very familiar with 10th Planet. How is 10th Planet so different than BJJ.

 

[Herfavcolor90]

I guess I'm not very familiar with 10th Planet. How is 10th Planet so different than BJJ.

Their move system is different. It's like saying Japanese JJ is the same as BJJ.

 

[Shemhazai]

And no-gi training makes you better at scrambling, guillotines, wrestling, etc.. there are trade offs to both styles, one isn't superior. If you can't develop your guard without a gi, you're not magically going to be Braulio Estima with one.

At the end of the day, thinking the gi has effected elite no-gi grapplers is ridiculous. They'd be elite no matter if they wore pajamas to class or not.

If there are benefits/trade-offs to both styles, why the hell should no gi guys not train in the gi? They should train both. However, unless your takedowns are very high level (and even then, at least defensively), you should have good guard fundamentals. Can you learn them in no gi? Sure. Will they be honed to a higher level in the gi, where defensive movements have to be more precise? Undoubtedly.

Also, other arguments held forth by many top guys is that the gi trains your brain to consider more threats/options. Of course, no gi presents a different challenge due to the need for a different processing speed, but again, this is an argument for training both.

This point doesn't make sense. 10th Planet is a completely different style than BJJ in the same way that Sambo or Luta Livre are different. To associate them with normal no-gi BJJ is a bit dishonest at best.

You must be trolling.

 

[Shemhazai]

Their move system is different. It's like saying Japanese JJ is the same as BJJ.

OK, so you are a n00b. There is no 'move system' in BJJ.

 

[BJJArsenal]

And Keenan choked out Rustam no-gi as a purple...

EDIT: he won on points actually

And also went to double(?) over time against Galvao at NYC Ultimate Absolute I.

 

[Herfavcolor90]

If there are benefits/trade-offs to both styles, why the hell should no gi guys not train in the gi? They should train both. However, unless your takedowns are very high level (and even then, at least defensively), you should have good guard fundamentals. Can you learn them in no gi? Sure. Will they be honed to a higher level in the gi, where defensive movements have to be more precise? Undoubtedly.

Also, other arguments held forth by many top guys is that the gi trains your brain to consider more threats/options. Of course, no gi presents a different challenge due to the need for a different processing speed, but again, this is an argument for training both.

Show me where I said you *shouldn't* train in a Gi. Your entire reply here is in response to something I never said.

They force you to get better at different things, but I don't believe there's much carry over. You obviously can't scramble the same in a gi as you do no-gi due to the grip differences. Just because you get better at scrambling no-gi it doesn't mean you'll be that good in a gi.

Look at Rodolfo Vieira. He's #1 in a Gi. No-gi? Not so much.

OK, so you are a n00b. There is no 'move system' in BJJ.

So, you're going to act like different styles don't exist? Eddie Bravo himself claims it as a different style. Do we not consider Kickboxing different from Muay Thai despite them being 90% similar styles? I don't consider a 10th planet belt equal to a BJJ belt, do you?

 

[Shemhazai]

Look at Rodolfo Vieira. He's #1 in a Gi. No-gi? Not so much.

Mainly because his style of offense is very reliant on gi grips. There are lots and lots of examples to the contrary.

So, you're going to act like different styles don't exist? Eddie Bravo himself claims it as a different style. Do we not consider Kickboxing different from Muay Thai despite them being 90% similar styles? I don't consider a 10th planet belt equal to a BJJ belt, do you?

Kickboxing and MT are different sports with different rule sets. Sambo and BJJ are different sports with different rule sets. 10th Planet is just a flavor of no gi BJJ used by a certain affiliation, just as Atos, Alliance and Checkmat have their flavors, but at the end of the day, the differences in style come down to the individual. There is no 'canon' of moves, just a body of techniques that have been found to work under a given rule set, and that is constantly being developed and added to by creative practitioners.

The fact that 10th Planet talk so much about being a distinct 'system' and different from BJJ can be attributed to clever marketing and Eddie Bravo thinking too highly of himself.