Why can’t people accept USADA’s explanation?

[The Merchant]

Seems to me like it was a decision based on a couple things
A) You’re right, they didn’t know for sure whether it was new or not
B) If they would have sanctioned him, he could just claim that it was not new, as we both agree they couldn’t have proven otherwise and
C) Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year AND they already ruled last year that it was not enough to have an effect in opinion of the independent arbiter
They decided to pick one side not the other

It's up to Jones to explain it's presence in his body not USADA.

You state "Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year"

Can you give me the amounts for both years please.

 

[BobbyHillComedian]

That's what they inferred. All they actually KNOW is there are small trace amounts.

Yes.. Small trace amounts that they, in their scientific opinions, believed were consistent with their previous experience testing for the m3 metabolite, which showed this type of false positive to be entirely possible

Or... Maybe they're all in on it

 

[Threetrees]

It's up to Jones to explain it's presence in his body not USADA.

You state "Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year"

Can you give me the amounts for both years please.

I agree with the first point, but that isn’t in opposition to what I was saying also

“
USADA informed the Nevada State Athletic Commission (NSAC) on Thursday that a urine sample collected by USADA from Jon Jones in an out-of-competition test session on December 9, 2018 was reported by the WADA-accredited laboratory in Salt Lake City to contain an extremely low level of 4-chloro-18-nor-17β-hydroxymethyl,17α-methyl-5α-androst-13-en-3α-ol (M3), a metabolite of dehydrochlormethyltestosterone (DHCMT), or another chlorine-substituted anabolic steroid.

This is the same substance that was detected in Jones’ positive test from July 28, 2017 and for which he received a 15-month sanction from an independent arbitrator under the UFC Anti-Doping Policy. After examining the scientific literature on this substance and the extensive testing history on Jones and consulting with leading scientific experts, USADA has concluded that the extremely low level of DHCMT in Mr. Jones’ December 9, 2018 sample is consistent with residual amounts from his prior exposure for which he was previously sanctioned.

USADA has also concluded that consistent with the prior finding by the independent arbitrator, at these extremely low levels, Jones obtained no performance enhancement from this level. The level reported was at approximately 60 pg/mL and there was no parent drug or other metabolites of the drug in his sample. As a result of these findings, USADA has determined that Mr. Jones is not facing a violation per the UFC Anti-Doping Policy.

As always, sanctioning bodies for each hosting state have jurisdiction over fighter participation and – taking all facts into account – are able to come to their own conclusions under their rules.

We are confident after consideration of all the evidence and based on science that the resolution of this result under the UFC Anti-Doping Policy is consistent with USADA’s mandate and in the interests of justice.”

Here is the second amount
I’m going crazy though, I know I saw a quote somewhere with both of them mentioned

 

[savemgs]

t has nothing to do with science you idiot. It's the obvious favoritism they have shown towards people that UFC ask them to. They banned Machida because of an accident that he went and told them with and told him about. Frank Mir and Tom lawlor had similar experiences to Jon Jones and got 2 years ionic as it sounds Josh Barnett scientifically proved his innocence and they screwed of him so bad that UFC had to let him out of his contract. I've been saying this organizations a joke since Mirko Cro Cop diabolical by the way fun fact he never tested positive for anything all test came back negative. Yeah asking somebody like that the snitch is a joke.

 

[MysticGOD]

Don't forget the good old food pyramid!!! Bread, eat lots and lots of bread. The experts are always found wrong. That's why I don't put my faith in science. Because science always changes.

And then how do you conduct your daily life without using any sort of science?
The fact is that it is impossible to live life without using any sort of current sciences, which may or may not turn out to be false later but you still are using some sort of system

 

[YourOnlineHero]

Do you know more biochemistry than the experts?

Are you one of those anti-science dweebs who claims that because something intuitively doesn’t make sense based on the information you have (read as less information than the experts) it can’t possibly be true, and no arguments will change your mind?

TinFoil hat brigade is out in full force about Jon.

Jones really did a number on some of you guys

Because I've done enough research to understand how it works and I can easily couple that knowledge with common fucking sense to come up with an opinion I'm willing to stand behind.

I have nothing against steroid users. I am one. But Jones is a cheater.

 

[Threetrees]

It's up to Jones to explain it's presence in his body not USADA.

You state "Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year"

Can you give me the amounts for both years please.

https://ufc.usada.org/wp-content/uploads/Final-Redacted-Award-Jones-and-USADA.pdf
20-80 cited here

I read 80 somewhere earlier, dont know where but that may have been someone misciting
Or i may be misciting

 

[sdss]

The only science that matters is that he has a banned substance in his system.

For anyone other than Jon Jones, that has meant you can't fight.

 

[The Merchant]

https://ufc.usada.org/wp-content/uploads/Final-Redacted-Award-Jones-and-USADA.pdf
20-80 cited here

I read 80 somewhere earlier, dont know where but that may have been someone misciting
Or i may be misciting

I would like both figures so we know that ""Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year""

It also states a quantitative test is not used because there is no threshold for the metabolite, it's banned at any level. So talking about the amount is a big of a red herring anyway.

 

[Threetrees]

I would like both figures so we know that ""Because the amount was lower than the amount from last year""

I post the most recent figure which was 60 picograms per

 

[The Merchant]

I post the most recent figure which was 60 picograms per

source pls.

 

[Threetrees]

source pls.

It’s posted above in the statement by USADA

 

[Threetrees]

I agree with the first point, but that isn’t in opposition to what I was saying also

“
USADA informed the Nevada State Athletic Commission (NSAC) on Thursday that a urine sample collected by USADA from Jon Jones in an out-of-competition test session on December 9, 2018 was reported by the WADA-accredited laboratory in Salt Lake City to contain an extremely low level of 4-chloro-18-nor-17β-hydroxymethyl,17α-methyl-5α-androst-13-en-3α-ol (M3), a metabolite of dehydrochlormethyltestosterone (DHCMT), or another chlorine-substituted anabolic steroid.

This is the same substance that was detected in Jones’ positive test from July 28, 2017 and for which he received a 15-month sanction from an independent arbitrator under the UFC Anti-Doping Policy. After examining the scientific literature on this substance and the extensive testing history on Jones and consulting with leading scientific experts, USADA has concluded that the extremely low level of DHCMT in Mr. Jones’ December 9, 2018 sample is consistent with residual amounts from his prior exposure for which he was previously sanctioned.

USADA has also concluded that consistent with the prior finding by the independent arbitrator, at these extremely low levels, Jones obtained no performance enhancement from this level. The level reported was at approximately 60 pg/mL and there was no parent drug or other metabolites of the drug in his sample. As a result of these findings, USADA has determined that Mr. Jones is not facing a violation per the UFC Anti-Doping Policy.

As always, sanctioning bodies for each hosting state have jurisdiction over fighter participation and – taking all facts into account – are able to come to their own conclusions under their rules.

We are confident after consideration of all the evidence and based on science that the resolution of this result under the UFC Anti-Doping Policy is consistent with USADA’s mandate and in the interests of justice.”

Here is the second amount
I’m going crazy though, I know I saw a quote somewhere with both of them mentioned

@The Merchant

 

[lepsahekim]

Even Nevada State Athletic Commission didn't accept USADA's explanation

Yes, a bunch of elected officials with no understanding of biochemistry or organic chemistry are supposed to know better than the experts at USADA. Is the earth flat for you as well?

 

[Phi-]

Do you know more biochemistry than the experts?

Are you one of those anti-science dweebs who claims that because something intuitively doesn’t make sense based on the information you have (read as less information than the experts) it can’t possibly be true, and no arguments will change your mind?

TinFoil hat brigade is out in full force about Jon.

Jones really did a number on some of you guys

I just finished a call with my brother (PhD in molecular biology). He doesn't follow MMA and is currently in charge of a +10M € project for cancer research at the AIT (Austrian institute of technology). He's definitely not part of any tinfoil hat brigade.

He started laughing when I suggested the explanation USADA offered. He then told me it was absolutely impossible (!) to retain any amount of a substance with a half life of 16 hours over a year in your blood or urine.

You also don't need an experts opinion for something that common sense. It's not like Jon is a first time offender or above suspicion.

 

[Threetrees]

I was just finished a call with my brother (PhD in molecular biology). He doesn't follow MMA and is currently in charge of a +10M € project for cancer research at the AIT (Austrian institute of technology). He's definitely not part of any tinfoil hat brigade.

He started laughing when I suggested the explanation USADA offered. He then told me it was absolutely impossible (!) to retain any amount of a substance with a half life of 16 hours over a year in your blood or urine.

So many people have family who are experts
You’re like the 5th person to post their father, brother, cousin, wife is an expert

 

[Jin Akutsu]

Dude. The fact they issued Mayweather a retro active TUE a full 3 weeks after reporters found out he used an IV should have tipped you off that perhaps they can be bought.

Dude was in jail, serving time, and they let him out to fight Manny. The justice (LMAO) system let him go to fight Manny. Drug testing in combat sports in a nutshell. Canelo/Golovkin. The list is endless in boxing and MMA.

 

[The Merchant]

@The Merchant

Cheers.

So the first time they never did a quantitative test and estimated 20-80. This time they seem to have a more accurate count of a concentration of 60.

Thanks for engaging and providing answers for me, that's good intellectual honesty and i appreciate it!

 

[MDoza]

Do you know more biochemistry than the experts?

Are you one of those anti-science dweebs who claims that because something intuitively doesn’t make sense based on the information you have (read as less information than the experts) it can’t possibly be true, and no arguments will change your mind?

TinFoil hat brigade is out in full force about Jon.

Jones really did a number on some of you guys

Like when Donald Trump says “I’m the smartest, and I talked to all the experts..”, you believe him because he’s the president and his experts MUST know best, right?

Then remember, Dana and Donald are best friends..

Now, Dana comes around saying “Nope, Jones didn’t cheat, I talked to the top Russian steroid expert, he said so, so I know he didn’t cheat..”

Ummm, bullshit.

 

[LTJGE]

Jones nuthuggers/defenders are the most pathetic bunch of cretins on this forum, which considering the utter scum that congregate this place is saying something.