Would you put jones above Gsp and say he's the goat if he didn't popped for steroid??

[whougonnacall]

Nope
Jones seemed to rely on a height and reach adv and looked very ordinary vs the few guys who matched him there
The eye pokes are another factor against him...guys a straight up cheater

 

[Gamer007]

In his prime, Jones finished opponents (ie beat them so badly, that they couldn't continue fighting), and made legends look like amateurs.


In his prime, GSP relied on judges scorecards for over 5 years, to win fights.




Finishes are more definitive wins than decisions, and any person with common sense knows that.




Also, Vitor had a SUNKEN armbar on Jones, and Jones didn't tap. GSP tapped to strikes.



Jones, Fedor and Silva are on a different level than Georges.

 

[Hotora86]

If he didn't get stripped THREE FUCKING TIMES then I'd consider it.

 

[yeguiza]

To achieve greatness it is not required to have never lost. Therefore only the best victories are considered when judging goat.

thanks for setting the rules, kid

also, never losing is better than losing....

say hi to your mom from yeguiza

 

[Prince Nephilim]

Jon Jones is already GOAT.

 

[Wicked_1]

Lol yes every single fighter has done roids.

Also wtf at not being a fan of eye pokes but juicing to the gills, that's Allright

No juicing is bad and they know it, he just happened to get caught. Like I said all fighters have used. Comparing him to gsp.. Who I guarantee juiced when the test were far more laxed, then retired right when they got serious about tests. So even though he didn't get caught it seems they are on equal term in that regard.

 

[AssassinFacedBaby]

Nah you're delusional

Nah you’re delusional

 

[Stevanchez]

No.

I don't take the "popped" as an automatic eliminator. Jones is still in my top 5, but definately behind GSP, Fedor, and Silva.

When looking at high level ability mixed with physical attributes/advantages, Jones is the best fighter I've seen. I was sure Jones was gonna be the greatest, but now I'm not sure he'll catch the other 3.

 

[Sapp]

Yes. I had him as the clear GOAT until he popped again, and now he's simply run out of goodwill.

 

[Dirge]

GSP fought better competition but Jones never lost, tough call

 

[MMAandBOXINGfan]

I get exactly what you're saying and I agree to an extent. I really feel you can't use size as an advantage when they both choose the weight class and make the weight. Machida was even smaller than weidman if we take it there. But I can agree some of the guys weren't "prime" but he didn't face a shot version if them either. The only fight I could see going differently if said fighter was prime is the Rampage fight, I feel his wrestling would have been more of a factor and if juanito was still with him his boxing would have been better as well. We could say shogun but look how easy mark colman got shogun down and in the mat is where jones really put a number on shogun.

I think our conversation helps jones as far as the op though, because while jones opponents may have been older, they were more established and more technically proficient than their past selves. While gsp was fighting a generation of up and comers who had nowhere near the experience of gsp and he was in his physical prime. So gsp was never at a disadvantage in skill, experience or age.

Thats cool... they werent exactly " shot " so we can kind of agree they weren't their best versions. And you're right it is pretty impressive Jones' was able to defeat them considering their experience level over him.. but the older more established technically proficient fighters arent always the ones that win the fight, look at poor Frankie, dude that sucked super bad. Also GSP wasn't fighting a generation of up and comers.. he was basically the same age as everyone he fought. Condit was a bit younger but had more fights than GSP when they fought..Nick is also a bit younger but had more fights as well. Thiago Alves same thing, bit younger but more fights so neither of these guys were up and comers....Shields, Hughes are older had been around a bit longer than GSP. I just realized Fitch and Koscheck are both 40yrs old thats crazy.. Kos i guess could be seen as an up and comer since he got into the sport a bit later however he had about the same amount of fights as GSP when they fought. BJ Penn is BJ Penn but he was just severely outmatched by GSPs size and strength same goes for Serra but well neither of these guys were up and comers either...

None of the guys he fought were actually young and up and comer except for maybe Jason Miller and Karo which were both maybe favored over GSP when they fought, Karo was fkn awesome. I dont know anything about the pre UFC days so maybe there are some up and comers there, not being sarcastic i realy dont know. Sean Sherk only ever lost to the best (GSP, Hughes, Penn, Frankie) Dan Hardy didnt belong in there, Trigg was never that great but at the time even Hughes thought would beat GSP. Honestly the only up and comer was probably Hendricks and he beat GSP up pretty good. I don't even know what the hell Im even going on about anymore man lol i started looking up these guys records and ya.. anyways Jon Jones is a great fighter one of the best ever, i am not a fan, i was in the beginning but i dont like that fake nice person shit. at least hes over that church boy innocent shit but after all hes done its hard to ever look at that guy and truly be a fan of his. He is one of the best ever though no one can take anything away from him steroids or not he got in the cage and fought, not many of us can say the same.

 

[MMAandBOXINGfan]

GSP fought better competition but Jones never lost, tough call

Matt Hamill kicked his ass dude what are you talking about!?!?

 

[Dorkman]

And if gravity/the force that keeps us grounded didn't exist I'd have the super power to fly.

 

[juncito]

Thats cool... they werent exactly " shot " so we can kind of agree they weren't their best versions. And you're right it is pretty impressive Jones' was able to defeat them considering their experience level over him.. but the older more established technically proficient fighters arent always the ones that win the fight, look at poor Frankie, dude that sucked super bad. Also GSP wasn't fighting a generation of up and comers.. he was basically the same age as everyone he fought. Condit was a bit younger but had more fights than GSP when they fought..Nick is also a bit younger but had more fights as well. Thiago Alves same thing, bit younger but more fights so neither of these guys were up and comers....Shields, Hughes are older had been around a bit longer than GSP. I just realized Fitch and Koscheck are both 40yrs old thats crazy.. Kos i guess could be seen as an up and comer since he got into the sport a bit later however he had about the same amount of fights as GSP when they fought. BJ Penn is BJ Penn but he was just severely outmatched by GSPs size and strength same goes for Serra but well neither of these guys were up and comers either...

None of the guys he fought were actually young and up and comer except for maybe Jason Miller and Karo which were both maybe favored over GSP when they fought, Karo was fkn awesome. I dont know anything about the pre UFC days so maybe there are some up and comers there, not being sarcastic i realy dont know. Sean Sherk only ever lost to the best (GSP, Hughes, Penn, Frankie) Dan Hardy didnt belong in there, Trigg was never that great but at the time even Hughes thought would beat GSP. Honestly the only up and comer was probably Hendricks and he beat GSP up pretty good. I don't even know what the hell Im even going on about anymore man lol i started looking up these guys records and ya.. anyways Jon Jones is a great fighter one of the best ever, i am not a fan, i was in the beginning but i dont like that fake nice person shit. at least hes over that church boy innocent shit but after all hes done its hard to ever look at that guy and truly be a fan of his. He is one of the best ever though no one can take anything away from him steroids or not he got in the cage and fought, not many of us can say the same.

Can't really disagree with anything you said. I like "evil" Jones more myself, it's more authentic and more entertaining as well. I see you keep mentioning Karo too, I watched him when he was fighting but I didn't have the same understanding I have now. I'm gonna have to go check out a few of his fights right now. Do you know of any sites I can watch older fights besides YouTube?

 

[MMAandBOXINGfan]

Can't really disagree with anything you said. I like "evil" Jones more myself, it's more authentic and more entertaining as well. I see you keep mentioning Karo too, I watched him when he was fighting but I didn't have the same understanding I have now. I'm gonna have to go check out a few of his fights right now. Do you know of any sites I can watch older fights besides YouTube?

damnit im not sure... fightnext.com is one i used to use but it doesn't seem to be working now :-/

 

[juncito]

damnit im not sure... fightnext.com is one i used to use but it doesn't seem to be working now :-/

No worries, I'll do some heavy research(google) and figure this out. I used to use allthebestfights. Com but the ufc has really locked their content down.

 

[Tuf_guy]

Losses:
Gsp: 2
Jones : 1(0 if you don't that)

Winner: jones

Top wins:
Jones: Gus,Dc(x2),glover,machida,Evans,vitor,shogun,rampage,bader,osp
Gsp: jake shield, Hughes x2,alves,condit,koscheck x2,bisping,nick Diaz,Hendricks,bj penn x2,fitch

Gus > condit.
Bj penn > Dc
Machida > Diaz
Alves = broken hand vitor
Koscheck > evans
Shogun >bisping
Fitch >osp (I know they fight nothing alike)
Hendricks > rampage
Jake shield?? Hughes?? Glover??

Winner: tie?Gsp?
Title defenses:
Gsp:9
Jones:9

Winner: tie

Extra:
Multi division champ: gsp
Jones finished opponents more

Does Jones still have the weird T/E ratio for the first DC fight?

And does Jones still look like he did on the right after a few months of lifting...

?

 

[juncito]

damnit im not sure... fightnext.com is one i used to use but it doesn't seem to be working now :-/

So I settled for a highlight video and man, his trips/sweeps to immediately threatening tge kimura was pretty sick. He would go for a throw from damn near any position too lol. Now I'm gonna make sure I find some of his full fights. Did he even take down GSP?

 

[MMAandBOXINGfan]

No worries, I'll do some heavy research(google) and figure this out. I used to use allthebestfights. Com but the ufc has really locked their content down.

yup i just google it... i had ufc fight pass for a while and it was pretty cool since you can go back and see pretty much any ufc fight or event but well i dont have it anymore.

 

[MMAandBOXINGfan]

So I settled for a highlight video and man, his trips/sweeps to immediately threatening tge kimura was pretty sick. He would go for a throw from damn near any position too lol. Now I'm gonna make sure I find some of his full fights. Did he even take down GSP?

https://ok.ru/video/10616769050

try that. He takes Pierre down in the 3rd with an awesome sweep and then Rogan starts yelling out wow Georges is sttrrroong when he is able to basically muscle his way out of the kimura attempt was pretty cool