War Room OT Discussion v2

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I laid down a bet on Bisping. All the factors already mentioned + the betting line made it too tempting not to.

Bisping has done pretty decent against larger and solid grapplers (although the Leites fight has me a bit concerned) and has great cardio, good technical boxing and underrated scrambling. GSP is a complete question-mark but the layoff, age and injuries are not exactly pros in his column. If GSP was a brawler or an explosive striker i would be way more apprehensive but i just dont see him being able to get Mike in any real trouble -- the rinse and repeat jab wont work(i hope).

I think the closest facsimile GSP faced is Diaz but Nick showed no real offensive agression and typical 0 TDD.

The thing that gives me the biggest ?!?!? is that GSP is a cerebral and paranoid mother-quebec'ér and wouldnt take this fight if he truly does not think he can win.

Still. Bisping wins -- confidence level at 70%


Side Question: Is anyone else way more excited for the CG v TJD fight??? Its going to look like two Jack Russel Terriers on meth going after each other.

I have considered the factor that GSP is a puss and wont take a high risk fight. That is usually true but Bisping kind of allows him both. He knows if Bisping beats him, he wont totally fucking destroy him. It will be some light tko. and it is a higher weight class and he is old anyway. built in excuses.

GSP hates being embarrassed. Like Rashad. Their biggest fear is being totally undressed like Anderson did to Forrest. They hate looking bad. GSP once admitted it is embarrassing to lose a fight cuz girls are watching. That hurts more than the punches. It does. When GSP loses, he will still be a man. Unlike Forrest. That is why he didn't fight Anderson. That shit is embarrasing. I mean Anderson totally emasculated Forrest in front of millions. GSP is more cautious about that.
 
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Side Question: Is anyone else way more excited for the CG v TJD fight??? Its going to look like two Jack Russel Terriers on meth going after each other.
Great fight. Masvidal-Wonderboy will be hot fucking fire too.
 
I have considered the factor that GSP is a puss and wont take a high risk fight. That is usually true but Bisping kind of allows him both. He knows if Bisping beats him, he wont totally fucking destroy him. It will be some light tko. and it is a higher weight class and he is old anyway. built in excuses.

GSP hates being embarrassed. Like Rashad. Their biggest fear is being totally undressed like Anderson did to Forrest. They hate looking bad. GSP once admitted it is embarrassing to lose a fight cuz girls are watching. That hurts more than the punches. It does. When GSP loses, he will still be a man. Unlike Forrest.

Not sure how anyone can call someone of GSP's stature a puss? He went against absolute killers at the time and never ducked anyone in his division -- never a hold out and nary a pull out.

I think it's more of a legacy fight (moving up to win a title) and that he has been working diligently at putting on mass and strength (possible to make up for declining speed) for a year.

GSP is a lot of things - a "puss" is most certainly not one of them
 
Not sure how anyone can call someone of GSP's stature a puss? He went against absolute killers at the time and never ducked anyone in his division -- never a hold out and nary a pull out.

I think it's more of a legacy fight (moving up to win a title) and that he has been working diligently at putting on mass and strength (possible to make up for declining speed) for a year.

GSP is a lot of things - a "puss" is most certainly not one of them

He left the sport after a weak title defense that many people thought he lost. Hardly a way for a champion to go out.

He is a puss. But still tough. He doesnt have a killing spirit. He was afraid to break Dan Hardy's arm. He is not the kind of person to do that. He doesnt have it in him. Frank Mir does. Jones does. These guys are like seriously dangerous when they get mad.

Matt Hughes is similar to GSP. Afraid to break Royce's arm. Mir would have snapped that fucker. So would ronda. can you see how these guys go all out? gsp doesnt. Like GSP said he goes to dark places. No, Mir does. lol. He gets sociopathic over some losses. WAnting to maim Lesnar.
 
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Great fight. Masvidal-Wonderboy will be hot fucking fire too.

Oh snap, yes it will be

Plus Big Rigs punishment fight against Paulo Borrachinha

I also am looking forward to JJ v ThugRose. Joanna really seems to love hurting her opponents.
 
He left the sport after a weak title defense that many people thought he lost. Hardly a way for a champion to go out.

He is a puss. But still tough. He doesnt have a killing spirit. He was afraid to break Dan Hardy's arm. He is not the kind of person to do that. He doesnt have it in him. Frank Mir does. Jones does. These guys are like seriously dangerous when they get mad.

Matt Hughes is similar to GSP. Afraid to break Royce's arm. Mir would have snapped that fucker. So would ronda. can you see how these guys go all out? gsp doesnt.

He left after being burnt out -- there were plenty of rumors and speculation that he would leave after that fight regardless. And, he left after 9 consecutive title defenses

He wasnt afraid to break Hardy's arm, he was trying -- he just didnt have the torque with the position to do so.

He had no problem targeting Kos' mangled eye for 4 rounds after it was closed shut or smashing Serra's ribs in with knees.
 
Another example of GSP's will: he wanted to quit against whoever. Shields I think. He was panicking in his corner about his eye. I think he was trying to quit. What he was saying, I think was said to have somebody stop the fight. But Greg Jackson totally ignored him and pushed him back out there. Another corner may have said, "Oh you are blind in one eye?" and at least address it. Jackson totally ignored it. I personally would have been concerned but that is probably why I am not a coach.
 
Another example of GSP's will: he wanted to quit against whoever. Shields I think. He was panicking in his corner about his eye. I think he was trying to quit. What he was saying, I think was said to have somebody stop the fight. But Greg Jackson totally ignored him and pushed him back out there.

nope -- he got poked in the eye during the fight, a lot. But we have access to video of that fight -- show me where he said he wanted to quit.

He tore his fucking groin against a bulldozer in Thiago Silva and still dominated him for every round. If GSP is a "puss" -- what would that make you?
 
nope -- he got poked in the eye during the fight, a lot. But we have access to video of that fight -- show me where he said he wanted to quit.

He tore his fucking groin against a bulldozer in Thiago Silva and still dominated him for every round. If GSP is a "puss" -- what would that make you?

I am saying those were things said to get people to call off the fight. He didn't explicitly ask to stop. He was fuckin panicked though. He panicked about the groin thing too and Greg Jackson calmed him down then too with nonsense.

I just think he wanted out of the fight for a second. Like cro cop vs Hunt in PRIDE. Thinking of that for some reason but that is a perfect example of somebody who no longer wants to fight. Cro Cop did not want to fight anymore. He wanted out but never explicitly quit. But to put it plainly, he didnt want to fight anymore. period.
 
Betting on MMA is a fool's game though as I learned. Despite everything I said, GSP could still win and it wouldnt surprise me. Put that money on Facebook stock or something. Or as Jack Savage would suggest --Twitter.

I am betting everyday and I like it. As somebody said, the market is helluva drug.

Everything is more interesting with money on the line. That is why God and Satan make us go through all this shit. We literally are human cockfighters
 
I love Madonna, I don't care. She is a conqueror.



A man can tell a thousand lies
I've learned my lesson well
Hope I live to tell
The secret I have learned, 'till then
It will burn inside of me

The secret that I hide, will I grow old
How will they hear
When will they learn
How will they know
 
I'm like -140 Bisping but I'm conservative. That should normally lead me to make a decent-sized bet, but I see too much uncertainty in my prediction. I'll bet small if anything.

Do you think it all comes down to whether the TD threat allows GSP to bully him? Is there another dynamic that is so important? Closest we have to this is GSP-Hendricks, which exposed GSP to a degree, but it's probably not a great comparison. We have Bisping doing okay against Chael (I thought he won) and his TDD has only improved along with his accuracy and power.
There’s some uncertainty with Gsp fighting a guy his size that also has good tdd. He had no issues taking down Hardy, Condit or Diaz who are bigger ww. And we haven’t seen him really strike with a guy who has good striking couples with good tdd. Hendricks is a great example of a guy who gave him trouble (and I always thought Hendricks was overrated). I can see him having that kind of trouble with Bisping except Bisping has great cardio.

So yes, I think stopping the take down is enormous.
 
Talked about this earlier. @JudoThrowFiasco likes Bisping, too.

I just think we have no idea what GSP will look like. I have no confidence in Bisping against any decent opponent, though.
It feels weird to bet Bisping, who I think is really a 2nd or 3rd tier fighter over a guy I think is the best p4p fighter ever. Looking at the attributes leads me to think it’s a bad matchup for gsp who’s fighting in the wrong weight class.

Off topic but if gsp does win good fucking luck with Whitaker or one of those other big hard hitting middle weights.
 
What? He beat Rockhold. He is fuckin scrappy. He barely lost to Rashad. Barely lost to Chael. GSP gets hit a lot. Bisping is a volume puncher with great tdd and good at getting up when taken down.

It was hell for SOnnen and others to get him down and stay there. Good luck GSP. You will need it.
I think we agree on this fight but I suspect Rockhold has a glass jaw. I want to see if he can take a shot to know for sure but that wasn’t a big left hook and Bisping doesn’t have good power.
 
Am I the only one who has very little interest in watching the GSP/Bisping fight?

Knowing Bisping plans on retiring afterwards makes it even more boring to me.
 
Bisping has done pretty decent against larger and solid grapplers (although the Leites fight has me a bit concerned) and has great cardio, good technical boxing and underrated scrambling. GSP is a complete question-mark but the layoff, age and injuries are not exactly pros in his column. If GSP was a brawler or an explosive striker i would be way more apprehensive but i just dont see him being able to get Mike in any real trouble -- the rinse and repeat jab wont work(i hope).

Those are definitely the *kinds* of strikers who would be more trouble for Bisping (you can take him out of his game by not giving him space and his defense is poor), but note that Bisping has an extremely strong preference for having his front foot on the outside before engaging, and GSP at his best would be able to prevent that. It doesn't seem to me that Bisping gets there because he's super fast or efficient with his footwork. Plus GSP's jab could be a real factor there. If Bisping were to beat a good version of GSP, it might be just by outhustling him, like throwing a lot more strikes and landing a similar amount, and convincing the judges that he won three rounds. But of course, GSP might have slowed down a lot, or he might get KO'd. If he can't at least establish the TD threat, he could be in trouble.

Bottom line, I think that if GSP were at his best, Bisping would still be a bad style matchup, but the difference in levels would be too much, and he'd win. But since we don't know what to expect from him, he can definitely lose.

Side Question: Is anyone else way more excited for the CG v TJD fight??? Its going to look like two Jack Russel Terriers on meth going after each other.

Oh yeah. I'm excited to see GSP back in the octagon in a title fight at 185, but it's kind of a freak show thing. CG vs. TJD is a legitimately great fight. Like a Pride (or NJPW) show in that there's kind of a different main event for hardcore fans and for more casual ones.

He left the sport after a weak title defense that many people thought he lost. Hardly a way for a champion to go out.

Most champions go out with a clear loss, way earlier in their reigns than he did. And he fought like a damned warrior in that, even if he arguably didn't deserve the decision (I had it for Hendricks, but it could have gone either way).

He is a puss. But still tough. He doesnt have a killing spirit. He was afraid to break Dan Hardy's arm. He is not the kind of person to do that. He doesnt have it in him. Frank Mir does. Jones does. These guys are like seriously dangerous when they get mad.

I'd call him a "puss" (not really, but I'd entertain the idea) if he were afraid to have his own arm broken. Not wanting to break someone else's arm isn't something to criticize him for (not necessarily accurate anyway--he wanted the finish). Mir was really dangerous when he had the edge, but tended to fold when he was in trouble. That's more puss-like, IMO.

Matt Hughes is similar to GSP. Afraid to break Royce's arm. Mir would have snapped that fucker. So would ronda. can you see how these guys go all out? gsp doesnt. Like GSP said he goes to dark places. No, Mir does. lol. He gets sociopathic over some losses. WAnting to maim Lesnar.

I like how you make being a sore loser sound like something to admire.
 
Am I the only one who has very little interest in watching the GSP/Bisping fight?

Knowing Bisping plans on retiring afterwards makes it even more boring to me.

See above. I'm interested in seeing GSP fight, period. But as a pure fight, yeah, this isn't great. The card as a whole is great, though.
 
Agree with basically everything Mr. Savage wrote.

My level of interest in seeing GSP v. Bisping is less than my interest in Olenik v. Blaydes (early prelims), but more than Brown v. Gall (prelims).

COGAR v. DILLASNAKE is by far the most interesting fight on the card and it's maybe the most compelling matchup of the year so far.



See above. I'm interested in seeing GSP fight, period. But as a pure fight, yeah, this isn't great. The card as a whole is great, though.
 
His striking has been pretty sharp too. I can't imagine GSP standing with Bisping on Bisping's terms and having any success. I also find it hard to imagine GSP's takedowns being enough of a threat to stifle Bisping's boxing. All of the x-factors are in Bisping's favor, except perhaps the general athletic awesomeness of GSP (old knees tho?).
GSP is going to be landing his jab at will(unless he's shot athletically). He's going to knock Bisping's eye straight again.
 
It feels weird to bet Bisping, who I think is really a 2nd or 3rd tier fighter over a guy I think is the best p4p fighter ever. Looking at the attributes leads me to think it’s a bad matchup for gsp who’s fighting in the wrong weight class.

Off topic but if gsp does win good fucking luck with Whitaker or one of those other big hard hitting middle weights.
2 week sig bet? I've got GSP.
 
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