Arab-Israeli Conflict, v2: What the UN Jerusalem vote mean for Israel, the U.S, and Palestine

[Arkain2K]

Israel's envoy Danon calls UN vote an 'Empty victory for Palestinians'
Jonathan Gratch | 12/21/2017

Israel's Ambassador to the United Nations, Danny Danon, was resolved in his dismissal of the general assembly's decisive vote on thursday of 128 to nine, rejecting the US decision to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital.

"We don't need the acknowledgment of the general assembly. We are used to resolutions, it will not change the history,"Danon said in an exclusive interview with i24News following the UN vote.

Danon called it an "empty victory" that "will not support that Palestinians who live in Ramallah or Gaza."

The only way to move forward is to negotiate directly with Israel," Danon said resolutely.

Seven countries -- Guatemala, Honduras, Togo, Micronesia, Nauru, Palau and the Marshall Islands -- joined Israel and the United States in opposing the measure.

"I think the move of the president will change the history. Once the embassy will be in Jerusalem and other embassies will follow the US—that's meaningful," Danon told i24News.

Among the 35 countries that abstained were Argentina, Australia, Canada, Croatia, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Latvia, Mexico, the Philippines, Romania and Rwanda.

Ukraine, which supported the draft resolution at the Security Council, was among 21 countries that did not turn up for the vote.

Danon considered the abstentions a victory, saying, "People are shocked to see so many countries deciding to abstain. In the past, they supported every resolution against Israel in the General Assembly."

Danon seemed to take comfort in a discrepancy between the way countries relate to Israel publicly in contrast with their private relations.

"I feel the gap in the private UN and public UN. Publicly they will vote against us, but privately, they will come to me and would like to work with Israel, to learn from Israel. There is a lot of appreciation, even admiration for Israel. My goal is to close that gap to convince those ambassadors to publicly support Israel."

Speaking to the UN General Assembly ahead of the vote, Israel's envoy to the United Nations vowed that Israel would never be "driven" from Jerusalem.

"No General Assembly resolution will ever drive us from Jerusalem," Ambassador Danny Danon said prior of the vote.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu condemned a UN vote on Thursday that rejected a US decision to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital, but expressed satisfaction at the number of countries that didn't vote for the measure.

"Israel completely rejects this preposterous resolution. Jerusalem is our capital, always was, always will be," Netanyahu said in an English-language video posted online by his spokesman.

"But I do appreciate the fact that a growing number of countries refuse to participate in this theatre of the absurd," said the Israeli leader.

"Especially I want to again express our thanks to President (Donald) Trump and Ambassador (Nikki) Haley for their stalwart defense of Israel and their stalwart defense of the truth."

Israel's Minister of Education Naftali Bennett thanked the cumulative 65 nations that did not vote in favor of the resolution (predominantly the result of abstaining or absence) and especially thanked the United States.

"A special thank you to our great friend, the United States, President Trump and his envoy, Nikki Haley, who boldly lead the way for everyone to realize what we Jews know for 3,000 yearsL Jerusalem has always been, and will always be, the capital of Israel."

http://www.i24news.tv/en/news/inter...lls-un-vote-an-empty-victory-for-palestinians

 

[Orgasmo]

Haley's speech in response was excellent. She is a fine spokeswoman for the US at the UN.

It sounded quite salty. She made a threat just two days earlier, and majority of the world called her bluff.

 

[Arkain2K]

Turkey's Erdogan Says Expects U.S. to Rescind Jerusalem Decision After UN Vote
Dec. 21, 2017

ISTANBUL (Reuters) - Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan said on Thursday he expected U.S. President Donald Trump's administration to rescind without delay its "unfortunate decision" to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital.

In comments on Twitter, Erdogan said he welcomed the "overwhelming support" for the resolution in the United Nations General Assembly, where more than 100 countries voted in favor of calling for the United States to reverse its decision.

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/a...s-to-rescind-jerusalem-decision-after-un-vote

 

[Seaside]

They are correct. Israel has always been the aggressor, and they are an apartheid state.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_242

israel is just unlucky if they was a country of 50 million they be more powerful. they are weak and small not powerful country compare to big powers or collective muslim world. if they were a larger country in another part of world like sudan or egypt and they did this to someone else nobody care. Israel got caught up in cold war stuff and is unfortunate to have muslim world against her.

the americans and british are far more war mongering killers with their foreign policy. and the victors of war rightfully get to keep land they conquered. the UN in that resolution saying give it back is just posturing by mega powers USA and USSR and China at the time to cause ease tensions with oil producing arab muslim world. If you take away israel importance to USA and UK and take away oil of the arabs nobody would care.

 

[RerouteToRemain]

 

[Swing]

So we shouldn't do it because Muslims don't like it? Muslims have given us precious little reason to care what they think, especially when their attitudes toward Israel are completely revanchist and bigoted.

It's always a matter of weighing things. And, personally, it's less about appeasing Muslims than it is about everyone else. Especially given how many of our past decisions with regard to the region have seemed ill-advised in hindsight.

Even more so since it's difficult to see what real benefit this will have for us. Yes, we should always consider our own interests and our own right to do things. But no, I don't think those should always outweigh what the rest of the world would like. A big reason I feel that way is because we like to stick in our nose in the business of other countries all the time. Fair is fair.

 

[Grenz]

Like I said. Weak.

How dare you call this man weak

 

[Gregolian]

It's always a matter of weighing things. And, personally, it's less about appeasing Muslims than it is about everyone else. Especially given how many of our past decisions with regard to the region have seemed ill-advised in hindsight.

Even more so since it's difficult to see what real benefit this will have for us. Yes, we should always consider our own interests and our own right to do things. But no, I don't think those should always outweigh what the rest of the world would like. A big reason I feel that way is because we like to stick in our nose in the business of other countries all the time. Fair is fair.

"our past decisions with regard...."

Not pissed at you but that annoys the shit out of me. IT WAS THE GODDAMN FRENCH AND ENGLISH THAT CARVED UP THE REGION AND MADE ISRAEL.

Fucking heckle those fuckers.

EDIT:
Yes, I know the US has been and was heavily involved but little things like Lebanon only exists cause France wanted a Coptic Christian nation in the area so they sliced it out of what is now Syria.

 

[Rod1]

I wouldn't say "large" for 40 years. Let's say around 20. Not sure what that has to do with other countries having dollars in reserve, though.

Allows America to borrow at a ridiculous low rate and keeps a large portion of your population free to pursue more profitable ventures.

Not to mention the geopolitical muscle that US sanctions carry as a result of such.

There is a reason why China wants to replace the dollar so badly.

 

[Arkain2K]

What the UN Jerusalem vote mean for Israel, the US and Palestinians
Jeremy B White | 21 December 2017

The United Nations held a major vote on the status of Jerusalem — one that could have broad implications.

In many ways, the vote was a matter of America and Israel against the world. It called into question Donald Trump’s foreign policy and underscored an uncertain path forward for the Middle East peace process.

Below, we break down some of the paramount questions about the vote.

What did they vote?

The resolution was a reaction to Donald Trump formally recognising Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. It emphasises that Jerusalem’s status must be resolved through negotiations and expresses “deep regret” at the change, which it also declares “null and void”. In a reference to Mr Trump’s vow to move the American embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, it urges “all States to refrain from the establishment of diplomatic missions in the Holy City of Jerusalem”.

It wasn’t close. The resolution passed in a 128-9 landslide that saw some three-quarters of nations voting yes (another 35 abstained and 21 were no-shows). The countries that sided with the US in voting against the measure were the Central American nations of Guatemala and Honduras; the island nations of the Marshall Islands, the Federated States of Micronesia, Nauru and Palau; Togo; and, of course, Israel.

For a point of reference, the 2012 vote to give Palestine “observer status” at the UN passed 138 to 9, with 41 abstentions.

What happens now?

Not necessarily much. Keep in mind this was a resolution rejecting America’s stance, rather than a change in policy or an explicit call to action. That means its value is largely symbolic, though it could have concrete consequences for America’s diplomatic capital and working relationships with other countries.

America’s Ambassador to the United Nations, Nikki Haley, warned that America “will remember this day” when “we are called upon once again to make the world’s largest contribution to the United Nations” and when other nations ask America “to pay even more and to use our influence for their benefit”. That could be rhetorical, or it could mark a real change in how America plans to navigate international relationships and disbursement of humanitarian aid— time will tell on this one.

What does this mean for Israel?

For Israel, this vote essentially confirmed the global status quo: while many Israelis view Jerusalem as their undivided, eternal capital, much of the world views Israeli control over the city as an illegal claim to the spoils of war seized in a 1967 conflict known as the Six Day War.

In 2016, the United Nations Security Council passed a resolution condemning Israeli actions “aimed at altering the demographic composition, character and status of the Palestinian Territory occupied since 1967, including East Jerusalem,” singling out the building of settlements and the displacement of Palestinians (the United States abstained). A separate resolution adopted last year by the General Assembly asserted that Israel was violated the Geneva Convention for its actions in “Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem”.

Ms Haley also said earlier this year the US may leave the UN’s Human Rights Council over its “chronic anti-Israel bias”. The 47-member body has repeatedly voted on resolutions to condemn Israel for its perceived mistreatment of Palestinians.

All of this is to say that global condemnation of Israel’s assertion to sovereignty over disputed territories is nothing new for Israeli leadership. Nor is American backing of Israel that cuts against a global consensus. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has lauded Mr Trump’s decision and thanked him and Ms Haley for their “stalwart defence of Israel”.

What about Palestinians?

This was a vindication for Palestinians. It illustrates that they enjoy broad support for their cause, including at the United Nations, an institution that has historically been sympathetic to their struggle. A spokesman for Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas hailed the vote as “a victory for Palestine,” and suggested that Palestinian leadership views the international body, rather than America, as the better partner in their drive for self-determination.

“We will continue our efforts in the United Nations and at all international forums to put an end to this occupation and to establish our Palestinian state with east Jerusalem as its capital,” spokesman Nabil Abu Rdainah said.

And Trump?

Again, it’s unclear. From the start, Mr Trump has been skeptical of America’s global obligations as he promotes an “America First” platform that focuses on domestic issues.

He has assailed what he sees as inadequate contributions by other NATO members, saying America has unfairly been asked to pay well above its share, pulled America from the UN-brokered Paris climate accord and has repeatedly strained longstanding alliances. In formally recognising Jerusalem the capital of Israel, he overrode objections from much of the international community.

He once again took the line that America pays too much to ungrateful allies this week, threatening to withhold aid to nations that backed the resolution, saying “this isn’t like it used to be where they could vote against you and then you pay them hundreds of millions of dollar” and “we’re not going to be taken advantage of any longer”.

As with Ms Haley’s reprimand, we shall see if that does translate into foreign aid cuts. But Mr Trump’s words and actions here have been fairly consistent with the “America First“ foreign policy views that have already animated his presidency.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-next-israel-us-palestine-trump-a8123446.html

 

[HomerThompson]

How dare you call this man weak

LMAO. That picture is ridiculous.

 

[oldshadow]

35 abstained.

 

[Swing]

If Americans read more than just regurgitated American media they will notice their country has lost it's world standing a ton of respect globally.

Nationalists can spin it all they want but when allies UK/Australia are openly mocking, condemning and concerned about Trump being elected while he goes off and funds the Saudis & Israel it is actually a bad path to head down.

As much as America helps with funding & aid there IS a reciprocation at some level.
Want buddies for your next war?
You want to go full isolationist (retard), go for it. See how that works out.

*cue redneck*: "fuck those cucks, we don't need them, they need US".
Just like in Iraq & Afghanistan? okay buddy.

We do still have a lot of slack to play with, and I think that will be true for some time even after Trump. Regardless, I don't like the idea of flexing our muscle just because. It feels hollow and spiteful. If the major support we can come up with is, "it's our decision and you can't tell us different" I don't think we should go through with it.

 

[Gregolian]

LMAO. That picture is ridiculous.

Know what gets me about that isn't the overly feminine way he sits with his legs and his hands on his lap... it's how he sits stock straight with his back like he's wearing a backboard.

 

[Rod1]

So we shouldn't do it because Muslims don't like it? Muslims have given us precious little reason to care what they think, especially when their attitudes toward Israel are completely revanchist and bigoted.

Not only muslims, did you see the vote?

It's remarkable how many things the UN doesn't condemn. Most of the time, when they are condemning something, it relates to Israel. The UN is obsessed with delegitimizing that one particular country.

Because the UN is a forum of nations to discuss things, and there are a lot of muslim nations who hate Israel and a lot of other nations who want international law to not become a total joke.

 

[Gregolian]

Because the UN is a forum of nations to discuss things, and there are a lot of muslim nations who hate Israel and a lot of other nations who want international law to not become a total joke.

Implying it wasn't one already.

 

[jimbob27]

It sounded quite salty. She made a threat just two days earlier, and majority of the world called her bluff.

I'd say very salty, considering Donald said "Let them vote against us, we'll save a lot. We dont care." That's definitely not the sentiment Hayley put across.

 

[Grenz]

LMAO. That picture is ridiculous.

"I'm a feminist."

 

[snakedafunky]

Let's not pretend Trump wanted any other country to vote with the US on this.
He wants to create us vs. them situation. The UN is just an instrument to give US shenanigans around the word some kind of legitimacy.
Trump just uses it for domestic politics. His approach is obviously not going to help the US long-term.

Also what Nationalist is on the Jew side? You can't make that shit up.
Sword dancing with the Saudis supportive of an illegal Jewish state is not precisely nationalist material.

 

[Rygu]

So the UN condemns it, who gives a shit that literally means nothing.