Another BJJ doesn't work video

[JohnPJones]

Visiting from the striking side.
A lot of people are saying the same things like karate and Kung fu people tend to when representatives of their styles lose.
Things like “well he was only rolling with a white belt. Let’s see him try this on a blackbelt”

It’s really hard to say how much experience Jesse has in BJJ and if was fair to put him against a white belt in the first place.

now question.

how many BJJ blackbelts think they could win a white belt level karate point fighting match?

 

[shunyata]

Visiting from the striking side.
A lot of people are saying the same things like karate and Kung fu people tend to when representatives of their styles lose.
Things like “well he was only rolling with a white belt. Let’s see him try this on a blackbelt”

It’s really hard to say how much experience Jesse has in BJJ and if was fair to put him against a white belt in the first place.

now question.

how many BJJ blackbelts think they could win a white belt level karate point fighting match?

Me? But I'm also a ringer because of kickboxing. I'd do just fine at white belt level Karate Combat (yes I know it's not point fighting).

 

[JohnPJones]

Me? But I'm also a ringer because of kickboxing. I'd do just fine at white belt level Karate Combat (yes I know it's not point fighting).

That’s why I said point fighting.
With modern light contact rules it’s extremely technical though rather stupid rule sets.

 

[Forceof1]

Visiting from the striking side.
A lot of people are saying the same things like karate and Kung fu people tend to when representatives of their styles lose.
Things like “well he was only rolling with a white belt. Let’s see him try this on a blackbelt”

It’s really hard to say how much experience Jesse has in BJJ and if was fair to put him against a white belt in the first place.

now question.

how many BJJ blackbelts think they could win a white belt level karate point fighting match?

I'll take that challenge... but also have a 4th degree blackbelt in Karate and spent my youth / pre-teens in point fighting tournaments...

 

[Bob Francis]

I admit I actually like this video.



A bit of background, I am a BJJ black belt and I do think BJJ can work in the street.

Why do I like this video?

Because it is the most obvious thing BJJ students forget, the fight does not need to stay on the ground once you go to the ground.

Danaher illustrates that same point in this video:



I never learned the importance of control and takedowns until my first MMA fight, when I realized that it was harder than I thought keeping someone on the ground.

Still love BJJ

When I was in the 101st airborne I took some Gracie Jiu Jitsu. It was only the beginning training for fighting. After that we learned striking and throwing. Growing up I got into dozens of fights and won about 15 of them. What I learned was to strike first after some bully put their hands on me. I generally only had to use my fist.

Only one time did I attack 2 guys and it was because when I was alone on the PE field they came up to me and one of them says 'Look he's all alone. What's he going to do now?' challenging me to fight. I ran up to him, kicked him in his balls then when he bent over in pain I gave him a right hook. I jump kicked his friend in the solar plexus knocking the wind out of him and gave him a right hook. Then I walked away as they both were in the fetal position on the ground.

As an adult I've only made arrest since I was a peacekeeper in Kosovo, a police cadet and security guard for 10 years working in public places that had bars. That's when jiu jitsu became more important because I had to arrest people, zip strip their wrist together or handcuff them. I would say BJJ becomes more important after age 18 because it can help you avoid going to jail for punching someone's face so hard they get broken bones or lose teeth. It can help you avoid getting civil lawsuits too.

I threw a man who was around 230lbs straight on his face on the ground and was about to kick him in the head but stopped because I didn't want to go to jail for excessive force. Then I jumped on his back and it took 2 pairs of handcuffs to handcuff him. I didn't get in any trouble over it since he didn't get hurt and he was found guilty of burglary.

 

[Bob Francis]

As someone who's done BJJ for 10 years and wrestled for 10 years before that I have such mixed feelings and frustrations around this.

I for the life of me can't fathom why the BJJ community fears incentivizing the takedown. Fucking drives me wild. It's like I can't really defend the criticisms of our martial art when when its flaws are directly pointed out and people just shrug and say "oh well I don't want to to learn new things".

2 points for a takedown (including guard pull) and 1 point for a return to standing from the bottom, wrestling style. Make a sweep 3 points if you want. That'll still give strong guard players a slight advantage. And if people aren't engaging standing or on top, start dishing out warnings and penalty points wrestling/judo style.

/end rant

Its probably because you're more likely to be injured when landing the wrong way and the gym gets a civil lawsuit. Its the lawyers fault.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Riding time starts as soon as someone achieves top position, whether from TD or guard pull

excuse my ignorance but is being in somebody’s full guard considered top position?

 

[ChickenBrother]

excuse my ignorance but is being in somebody’s full guard considered top position?

For purposes of accumulating riding time under college wrestling rules, yes. I believe it’s also consistent with BJJ scoring because a TD or sweep into other guy’s full guard still earns 2 points.

 

[DoctorTaco]

For purposes of accumulating riding time under college wrestling rules, yes. I believe it’s also consistent with BJJ scoring because a TD or sweep into other guy’s full guard still earns 2 points.

huh. The implications there say a lot about full guard that seem to be contradictory to the established narrative about the position

 

[ChickenBrother]

huh. The implications there say a lot about full guard that seem to be contradictory to the established narrative about the position

How so? The contradiction is in BJJ scoring. Why does BJJ score 2 points for a TD into guard? Why is a sweep into other guy's guard worth 2 points? Because top position (even inside other guy's guard) is inherently a better position, all else being equal. Yet you're allowed to pull guard without penalty. That's the issue - it doesn't make any sense even by BJJ's own inconsistent scoring logic.

I'm allowed to pull guard into bottom position without giving up points but then I can sweep other guy into the same position I just put myself in, and that scores me 2 points?



If you pulled guard and I'm on top, why can't I just "pull guard" into bottom position without losing any points?

 

[HunterAcosta]

How so? The contradiction is in BJJ scoring. Why does BJJ score 2 points for a TD into guard? Why is a sweep into other guy's guard worth 2 points? Because top position (even inside other guy's guard) is inherently a better position, all else being equal. Yet you're allowed to pull guard without penalty. That's the issue - it doesn't make any sense even by BJJ's own inconsistent scoring logic.

I'm allowed to pull guard into bottom position without giving up points but then I can sweep other guy into the same position I just put myself in, and that scores me 2 points?



If you pulled guard and I'm on top, why can't I just "pull guard" into bottom position without losing any points?

yeah I agree a sweep shouldn’t be worth two points into a guard unless your leads directly into side control or mount /north south or taking back .

 

[BJJ_Rage]

people going around the same old shit topic here, what the fuck? of course some if most of the shit we do while rolling in the gym or competition is towards, well BJJ COMPETITION.

just like judo, wrestling and other martial arts who focus on competition.

The point is, this guys, the karate buy is a fucking prick.

He alreadyt took a shoot to bjj when posting that interview with super foot, totally bullshit full of lies.

Then he comes back, posted a vid on how bjj doesnt work, literally, goes to a bjj gym, acts all nicely, then proceeds to turn the theme of the vid and concurs that bjj sucks because this idiot goes in a bjj competition and the WHITE BELT, with less than 3 months problaly sucks a taking him down, and pulls guard, then with his ass over his head procees to show how he subs him.

Well, even in a sport bjj setting, if hes going to take an opnion on the sport, at least go against someone proeficient at the art, NOT A FREAKING WHITE BELT.

Fucking idtiot.

People in the state should really show him some humility with an old gracie storm, get a cam filming and even put him to roll under BJJ competition rules, with some guy whos at least a blue or purple competitor. See how that goes.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Visiting from the striking side.
A lot of people are saying the same things like karate and Kung fu people tend to when representatives of their styles lose.
Things like “well he was only rolling with a white belt. Let’s see him try this on a blackbelt”

It’s really hard to say how much experience Jesse has in BJJ and if was fair to put him against a white belt in the first place.

now question.

how many BJJ blackbelts think they could win a white belt level karate point fighting match?

you shitting me? how about a simple fight... There are like a gazilion vids of "trained" karete kung fu and striking black belts putting to sleep or getting wasted by simple brawlers.

The point isnt that jesse is putting a vid bashing bjj as a SD are while going vs someone who has no experience, in a bjj setting competition. See the oxymoron?

HAve you seen a single vid of him rating an art by trainging with white belts of those arts?

 

[JohnPJones]

you shitting me? how about a simple fight... There are like a gazilion vids of "trained" karete kung fu and striking black belts putting to sleep or getting wasted by simple brawlers.

The point isnt that jesse is putting a vid bashing bjj as a SD are while going vs someone who has no experience, in a bjj setting competition. See the oxymoron?

HAve you seen a single vid of him rating an art by trainging with white belts of those arts?

The issue is people getting their egos hurt, and not getting the joke.

 

[JohnPJones]

people going around the same old shit topic here, what the fuck? of course some if most of the shit we do while rolling in the gym or competition is towards, well BJJ COMPETITION.

just like judo, wrestling and other martial arts who focus on competition.

The point is, this guys, the karate buy is a fucking prick.

He alreadyt took a shoot to bjj when posting that interview with super foot, totally bullshit full of lies.

Then he comes back, posted a vid on how bjj doesnt work, literally, goes to a bjj gym, acts all nicely, then proceeds to turn the theme of the vid and concurs that bjj sucks because this idiot goes in a bjj competition and the WHITE BELT, with less than 3 months problaly sucks a taking him down, and pulls guard, then with his ass over his head procees to show how he subs him.

Well, even in a sport bjj setting, if hes going to take an opnion on the sport, at least go against someone proeficient at the art, NOT A FREAKING WHITE BELT.

Fucking idtiot.

People in the state should really show him some humility with an old gracie storm, get a cam filming and even put him to roll under BJJ competition rules, with some guy whos at least a blue or purple competitor. See how that goes.

So what evidence do you have that contradicts the first hand accounts of someone directly involved?

 

[shunyata]

The issue is people getting their egos hurt, and not getting the joke.

I was following you, but when you clarified that karate point fighting had an esoteric sometimes nonsensical rules system it just made it sound more and more like IBJJF competition.

 

[shunyata]

huh. The implications there say a lot about full guard that seem to be contradictory to the established narrative about the position

Realistically if we inserted a "riding time" rule into jiu jitsu competition the clock wouldn't start until after a guard pass. IBJJF rules are all about incentivizing the guard.

You can go from bottom side control to turtle to sitout to front headlock to standing up with front headlock and it's zero points under IBJJF rules. Perfectly valid side control escape in fighting or grappling, but the IBJJF rules won't give you points until you take them down from that front headlock or set up an open guard with the connection and then sweep to mount.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

So what evidence do you have that contradicts the first hand accounts of someone directly involved?

mm most of the bullshit super foot said was descresto by they fighters themself. Not the fucking comentstor, who got kicked out of the show. There’s a vid on YouTube about this vid, just look for it

 

[BJJ_Rage]

So what evidence do you have that contradicts the first hand accounts of someone directly involved?

here you go...

 

[TheMaster]

I admit I actually like this video.



A bit of background, I am a BJJ black belt and I do think BJJ can work in the street.

Why do I like this video?

Because it is the most obvious thing BJJ students forget, the fight does not need to stay on the ground once you go to the ground.

Danaher illustrates that same point in this video:



I never learned the importance of control and takedowns until my first MMA fight, when I realized that it was harder than I thought keeping someone on the ground.

Still love BJJ

So "the 3 great deficiencies of Jiu Jitsu were lack of legocks, takedowns and ability to keep a guy down".

In other words, Catch Wrestling