Can Stipe vs Ngannou be MMA version of Fury vs Wilder?

muaythaidon1 said:
Wilder has a legit straight right hand, nice and straight and sets it up nicely, something Frank is incapable of.
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He's not incapable he just chooses not too. Also when your fights usually last under one round there isn't a lot of time for him to showcase his game anyway
 
Scorpz said:
I don't think Stipe will be as lucky this time to avoid the big bombs
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If you avoid a punch or two it might be luck. If you avoid punches for 25 minutes (ie 5 rounds) its skill, not luck. Having said that, Stipe is older now (ie slower reflexes) and has been inactive (poorer timing). I think he gets taken out this time.
 
AnotherOldGuy said:
If you avoid a punch or two it might be luck. If you avoid punches for 25 minutes (ie 5 rounds) its skill, not luck. Having said that, Stipe is older now (ie slower reflexes) and has been inactive (poorer timing). I think he gets taken out this time.
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Thats definitely part of the reason for the interest although really with Ngannou's style its the first few mins that matter.

I wouldnt say Stipe comfortably outboxed Ngannou, he did look in danger early on and took him down instead and I can see Francis making adjustments to leave him a bit less open to that without radically altering his skill set.
 
JustOnce said:
Ngannou and Wilder are both monsters with historical knock out powers in their hands. (Yes Wilder is obviously a better boxer by far.)

Fury put on a boxing clinic on Wilder in the first fight, then he put a beat down on Wilder in the second.

Stipe put a MMA clinic on Ngannou, will this be similar to Fury vs Wilder in that it will be a worse domination in the second fight or will Ngannou be able to adjust?
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It was already, the first match is wilder vs fury mma version
 
I have seen a lot of shit here but this is definitely the most racist thread yet.
 
Anything's possible especially at heavyweight but I don't think it's very likely here. Ngannou has power on the inside too and with both hands so you can't just negate it by smothering him like Fury did Wilder. Ngannou also has a better chin than Stipe. The few times Stipe got too overconfident and tried to brawl with Ngannou, Ngannou tagged him and made him shoot
 
I don't see Stipe pushing forward. Fury had a massive size advantage on Wilder and used it to wear on him. Stipe on the other hand is way smaller than Ngannou. He will only be able to dominate when/if Ngannou gets tired.
 
more like foreman vs Morrison if ask Dana. he acted like francis got a big ego and wasn't training. lead up with foreman showed him on vacation and bit of a comedy sketch while tommy was training military style
 
Yeah I can see the resemblance. Hopefully it has the same outcome and the better fighter wins rather than the guy with the harder punches.
 
thorcorm said:
No. Ngannou is a better MMA fighter than Wilder is a boxer. Ngannou has beat the best of the best in the UFC while Wilder has literally dodged every good fighter in the heavyweight division. Joshua, Ruiz, Parker, Povetkin, White, etc.

When he went against Fury who wasn’t coming off a huge layoff, he got battered. Wilder has Ortiz as his best win. Think about that.
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He didn't ducked povetkin. He was supposed to fight him but alex pissed hot
 
moreorless87 said:
Thats definitely part of the reason for the interest although really with Ngannou's style its the first few mins that matter.

I wouldnt say Stipe comfortably outboxed Ngannou, he did look in danger early on and took him down instead and I can see Francis making adjustments to leave him a bit less open to that without radically altering his skill set.
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I don't think he outboxed Nganno, but then it was an MMA fight so that wasn't imporant (Fury would be UFC champ if it was just about boxing). But he clearly outfought him by MMA criteria -- part of not getting hit in MMA includes the skill to do successful takedowns when your opponent is throwing punches at you, and Stipe showed that. I'd have to watch it again, but I think the danger was mainly potential -- I don't remember Stipe being staggered, let alone knocked down (though I'd have to watch again to be sure). I remember Ngannou landing square once, but it didn't seem to affect Stipe very much (again, I'd have to re-watch). So I don't think Stipe was ever in any actual danger.

I'm sure Ngannou will adjust based on his last fight with Stipe, but I'm equally sure Stipe will adjust based on his last fight with Ngannou -- the saying in war is no plan survives the first encounter with the enemy, and both will come in with adjusted plans. But I'm betting against Stipe this time not because of changes in Ngannou, but because in changes in Stipe -- he's older and largely inactive. Slipping and takedowns are very much based on reflexes and timing, and reflexes are the first thing to age, and not being active strongly affects timing -- I'd be very surprised if Stipe hasn't lost considerably in both.
 
AnotherOldGuy said:
I don't think he outboxed Nganno, but then it was an MMA fight so that wasn't imporant (Fury would be UFC champ if it was just about boxing). But he clearly outfought him by MMA criteria -- part of not getting hit in MMA includes the skill to do successful takedowns when your opponent is throwing punches at you, and Stipe showed that. I'd have to watch it again, but I think the danger was mainly potential -- I don't remember Stipe being staggered, let alone knocked down (though I'd have to watch again to be sure). I remember Ngannou landing square once, but it didn't seem to affect Stipe very much (again, I'd have to re-watch). So I don't think Stipe was ever in any actual danger.

I'm sure Ngannou will adjust based on his last fight with Stipe, but I'm equally sure Stipe will adjust based on his last fight with Ngannou -- the saying in war is no plan survives the first encounter with the enemy, and both will come in with adjusted plans. But I'm betting against Stipe this time not because of changes in Ngannou, but because in changes in Stipe -- he's older and largely inactive. Slipping and takedowns are very much based on reflexes and timing, and reflexes are the first thing to age, and not being active strongly affects timing -- I'd be very surprised if Stipe hasn't lost considerably in both.
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I remember a couple of pretty big punchs landing for Ngannou and Stipe looking a bit panicy going for the takedown.

The big factor there for me would be had Stipe clearly outboxed Ngannou I would not be confident Francis could make that much adjustment, he could hope to land that one big shot but technically he'd have a mountain to climb. The way Stipe outwrestled Ngannou though, I honestly didnt think that was a technical masterclass, it wasnt like GSP on say Alves were Thaigo would need to very significantly advance him technique to shift things. I could see Ngannou making adjustments there without really having to advance his technique massively.
 
moreorless87 said:
I remember a couple of pretty big punchs landing for Ngannou and Stipe looking a bit panicy going for the takedown.

The big factor there for me would be had Stipe clearly outboxed Ngannou I would not be confident Francis could make that much adjustment, he could hope to land that one big shot but technically he'd have a mountain to climb. The way Stipe outwrestled Ngannou though, I honestly didnt think that was a technical masterclass, it wasnt like GSP on say Alves were Thaigo would need to very significantly advance him technique to shift things. I could see Ngannou making adjustments there without really having to advance his technique massively.
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I'd have to watch the fight again, but I just don't remember Stipe being staggered by any of the punches. I've always understood panic wrestling to mean going for a takedown that you have no hope in landing, and wouldn't want to work in any case (ie against a guy who's a better grappler than you). Stipe landed his, and he's better on the ground than Ngannou (I agree it wasn't a master class, but then Ngannou didn't do a master class standing against Stipe either), so I don't see them as panicky. If an NFL team that generally passes runs the ball occasionally, is that panic running or just good tactics? Takedowns are part of MMA (and Stipe's grappling was better than Ngannou's), so his going for takedowns seems like normal good tactics. To take an extreme case, was Couture going to the ground with James Toney panic wrestling or just intelligent tactics?

I'm sure Ngannou will make changes. I'm equally sure Stipe will make changes. They fought 25 minutes, both fighters and their teams learned a lot about each other. It'd be coaching malpractice for either team not to adjust for what they learned, especially given that both have a lot of room for improvement.
 
One fighter is an explosive athletic lesser skilled specimen. The other fighter is a cerebral intelligent fighter. It's the classic matchup.
 
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