Canelo vs Da Sexy One

Seano said:
Sergio was a mess. His footwork was a joke. His footwork was what got him dropped against Pavlik and he was always stumbling about even before his knee was ever an issue. One of the most overrated fighters in recent years, IMO.


He looked as good as he did because he fought one dimensional plodders. Williams, Chavez, etc.
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You thought JCCJR was gonna beat Sergio down, tbh. And Sergio ended up breaking his face.
 
BluntTrauma21 said:
Meh my "exaggerations" were basically you don't think he pivoted as well as I did. I thought he did a hell of a job with that part of his game. He might've been lazy with it at times but he was still great when he was on, imo. Agree to disagree, I guess.
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The other disageeement was about he would come out like a bat out of hell. You really think Sergio would storm a guy like canelo with his countering and strong left hook that would be a terrible for a southie like him who like to try and pull guys back into him.

Agree to disagree is one thing but if you think his pivots were great. Who else do you think were great pivoters?
 
zapataxiv said:
Mess is a strong word. I would say he really strongly relied on his athletic ability to leap in and out which caused to him to get hit especially against top guys. He is still one of my favorites from recent years and his fights were always fun.
How do you think Williams would have fared against Alvarez?
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Canelo would have knocked him cold. The only reason Williams didn't get KO'd more often was because of his freakish ability to cut weight. Once he moved up in weight, getting hit clean started to matter.
 
zapataxiv said:
The other disageeement was about he would come out like a bat out of hell. You really think Sergio would storm a guy like canelo with his countering and strong left hook that would be a terrible for a southie like him who like to try and pull guys back into him.

Agree to disagree is one thing but if you think his pivots were great. Who else do you think were great pivoters?
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He started great against Pavlik, he domed PWill out like he was an ammy, he absolutely dominated Bunema from start to finish, he knocked Pwill down in their first fight in the first or second rd. He made Chavez Jr look like a simpleton who shouldn't have been in the same area code as him. I'm not saying he was the best starter in the world, but to say he couldn't fast start, esp against a guy who isn't known as a great starter or leader in Canelo, is just off imo.

He was great at pivoting when he was on. I think the angles he created off of those pivots gave him a lot of great opportunities to put together solid offense. He was no Pac or Sweat P if that's what you're alluding to but that doesn't mean he didn't do a great job against some of his opponents.
 
Seano said:
Canelo would have knocked him cold. The only reason Williams didn't get KO'd more often was because of his freakish ability to cut weight. Once he moved up in weight, getting hit clean started to matter.
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I agree with that
 
BluntTrauma21 said:
He still lost convincingly. As you say, check the record books.
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And? Chavez turned out to be trash. That doesn't make anything I said about Sergio false. Chavez was unable to capitalize on those flaws.
 
BluntTrauma21 said:
He started great against Pavlik, he domed PWill out like he was an ammy, he absolutely dominated Bunema from start to finish, he knocked Pwill down in their first fight in the first or second rd. He made Chavez Jr look like a simpleton who shouldn't have been in the same area code as him. I'm not saying he was the best starter in the world, but to say he couldn't fast start, esp against a guy who isn't known as a great starter or leader in Canelo, is just off imo.

He was great at pivoting when he was on. I think the angles he created off of those pivots gave him a lot of great opportunities to put together solid offense. He was no Pac or Sweat P if that's what you're alluding to but that doesn't mean he didn't do a great job against some of his opponents.
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He started cold in most of the fights you just listed he got dropped pwill in their first fight because he was cold and not pivoting!!

I was not alluding to him being one of the greats. But I meant he was often spotty in how he set up his pivots, lazy in how he kept his weight (unfortunately his knee problems exacerbated this later on). There are plenty of guys who were much better who were not GOATs
 
BULLSHIT!

Sexy would've made Canelo look flat footed and potshot him for 12 rounds, and can even hurt him with the left cross.
 
I think Canelo takes him pretty comfortable. Pavlik was winning until the cut. Chavez Jr hurt him bad, and that is prime Sergio, maybe even his peak.

Canelo is a lot better than Chavez Jr. Both have similar power, tho JCCjr is a bit bigger, he also lazy and never had great power, just size and would wear people down. Canelo is far more accurate and better.
 
Entertaining bout. I think Canelo ends up slowing down and timing Sergio pretty good, that being said Martinez has the ability to land a few bombs Canelo doesn't see coming. I think Canelo takes it, but Maravilla has a shot.
 
Martinez was incredibly overrated and would get crushed by Canelo.

He made a name, and somehow a P4P spot by exclusively beating up one dimensional C/B level fighters.

Cotto would have KO'd him at any point in their career, his defence simply wasn't good enough and neither was his chin. His punching style worked really well against up and down fighters who would walk forward with a high guard, but he always struggled outside of that.
 
cottagecheesefan said:
I think Canelo takes him pretty comfortable. Pavlik was winning until the cut. Chavez Jr hurt him bad, and that is prime Sergio, maybe even his peak.

Canelo is a lot better than Chavez Jr. Both have similar power, tho JCCjr is a bit bigger, he also lazy and never had great power, just size and would wear people down. Canelo is far more accurate and better.
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I think it was 4/4 before the cut in the Pavlik fight. And the cut wasn't by accident, it was Sergio finding his left hand again in that 9th round and landing repeatedly to open Pavelik's face up.

2010/2011 was probably his prime
 
zapataxiv said:
He started cold in most of the fights you just listed he got dropped pwill in their first fight because he was cold and not pivoting!!

I was not alluding to him being one of the greats. But I meant he was often spotty in how he set up his pivots, lazy in how he kept his weight (unfortunately his knee problems exacerbated this later on). There are plenty of guys who were much better who were not GOATs
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I don't know about not pivoting, but I agree Sergio's footwork clearly was not the best, he got his own feet mixed up a lot and his foot positioning didn't line up with where he'd be placing his head so he'd put himself off balance and would sometimes get punished for it, but, he could move his feet really really really quickly, had an awkward style and threw a good jab with very fast hands and had incredible reflexes.

Also don't personally think Sergio would start fast or do well being aggressive, Canelo would catch him too often. He'd have best odds just moving laterally a lot and trying to get Canelo to come after him. Sergio's fast feet should see him make the 12 imo with enough power and speed to keep Canelo honest and take some rounds, Canelo's not all that scary when he has to come forward unless he's in with C level guys.
 
Minowafanatic said:
I think it was 4/4 before the cut in the Pavlik fight. And the cut wasn't by accident, it was Sergio finding his left hand again in that 9th round and landing repeatedly to open Pavelik's face up.

2010/2011 was probably his prime
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Word. I will have to rewatch it. Real good fight, maybe I will today
 
nastyleft said:
Ummm B-Hop, Hagler, Roy...
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What about Pirog? His defense wasn't as polished as Canelo's but he did much better offensively against Jacobs
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Too bad he had to retire I think we would have had some exciting fights with him and Golovkin still around.
 
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