Did anyone give Royce Gracie a chance at Submitting Matt Hughes?

[antithetic]

Weird you mention that fight, I watched that fight TODAY with a coworker at work (we were working hard)

I remember people being kinda confused that Royce was there and a lot of people thought he was gonna get smashed... and he did.

It felt like a really random fight at the time

It was, youre right.

 

[filthynumber1]

Nobody could have guessed he was gonna get smashed as bad as he did.
Royce proved his arm can bend backwards. Matt had it locked up and Royce didnt even blink.

 

[PicoPulse]

The game changed so much since Royce competed. I don't think he even keeps up with the sport. I don't even think he even owns a gym anymore. I will pick Gall over him.....

He even had to low blow Ken to get the win.

 

[Lo Pan]

I really though Royce was gonna make him tap...that was before Hughes ground and pounded his head through the canvas.

 

[Coconutwater]

I gave Royce a .06% chance of catching a wreckless Hughes , but no, I knew Matt would win. You don’t struggle against Hideo or Bobby Ologun and think you can beat Hughes.

I wanted Royce to win simply because it would have been nostalgic, like some things don’t change....But they do.

 

[bubbleboyjones]

I can’t believe they made this fight.

Royce is a legend no doubt and he had balls stepping up to fight the bigger stronger wrestler who was a bad matchup for him.

But was this meant as a serious fight or a freak show at the time.

I wasn’t an MMA fan until TUF 3.

I watched it at a Hooters. I can confirm a LOT of casuals thought Hughes could win.

It was brilliant match making at the time for the UFC for making $$$ off of a guy who posed no threat to your champ and it raised Hughes profile a lot. He ends up doing 400k again Penn 4 months later and then fights GSP 2 months later doing another 500k. Hughes made a shitload of his career earnings in the year alone.

*Edit* Now that I am thinking about it I recall the UFC's marketing had Royce as undefeated in the UFC and didn't mention his Pride loss so people were under the impression Royce was undefeated at the time as well.

 

[Carl Sonnen]

Yeah. Tons of people thought it was a legit match where Hoyce had a chance, even on Sherdog. About half of my huge group of friends that used to get together for UFC ppvs legit thought Hoyce was gonna submit Matt. They bought into the legend hype ("This my house. I build it."). I knew it was a mismatch from the get go. Was kind of funny watching the looks on their faces.

 

[ralphus1]

I remember seeing video afterwards where Hughes went back to the locker room and told his team he was surprised how it went, thinking Royce would have put up more of a fight.

 

[DaleBoca]

Have you guys heard the new Bob Sinclar song?

 

[Wicked_1]

Very tiny one. Royce only has bjj. Nothing more, so Matt would have had to make u huge mistake to get submitted..

 

[TurboHolocaust]

This my house, I build it!

 

[RampageFaction]

I remember Marc Laimon on TUF running his mouth about Royce’s BJJ being at a blue belt level at best in the early UFC’s. I don’t like Laimon because he has a big mouth...but he wasn’t that far off. I wouldn’t call it blue belt level but Royce was never really all that great. I rooted for him in every fight because I was a fan from Jump street, but he was average at best even in the BJJ dept. Matt Hughes ruined that event for me.

 

[PD4838]

Even though Matt isnt known for striking, I thought he would mop the floor striking with Royce and get the takedown at will. The domination on the ground surprised me a bit. It proved the evolution of
Fighters as did a few other fights to me

 

[GSP83]

Yup. Royce was sort of a nostalgia pick in this fight. TS mentions how much bigger Hughes was but look at the size of some of the people Royce beat in the early UFCs? Way bigger than Matt Hughes. The difference was Hughes also had great skills.

To a lesser extent, this is why I don't subscribe to the idea that "Prime" Fedor would still beat all the top fighters that so many others love on here. I loved Fedor too and he was the best of his time but time has moved on. Like with Royce, it's not just them getting old, it's also newer fighters getting better.

I agree. I remember Mike Tyson giving an interview saying how he could not beat the Klitschko brothers based on the training and nutrition advancements have advanced so much over time. And that's not just for MMA or boxing that's for every sport. Athletes just get better over time, the one's who are ahead of their time are the true all time greats.

 

[Druken_Vovchanchyn]

lmao only newbs or fan boys thought he had a chance a chance vs the god damn country boy.

Matt was a fucking monster man, people have forgetten about him

 

[gono btw]

The reason Royce was chosen in the first place to be the champion of the Gracie family was because he was the smallest and they thought it would be the best look for BJJ if the smallest family member was beating everyone who was bigger than him.

That´s a...myth...

Hoyler was smaller, even Henzo was a lil bit smaller.

Horion chose Hoyce, and not Hickson (or even Helson) for political reasons [inside the family]...

 

[Woldog]

That´s a...myth...

Hoyler was smaller, even Henzo was a lil bit smaller.

Horion chose Hoyce, and not Hickson (or even Helson, for that matters) for political reasons [inside the family]...

I'm going off what I read in Mark Hunts book, I don't watch much MMA and didn't really watch any of the earlier UFC's I only really watched Pride and K-1

 

[reddhelium]

whatever hope i had for a competitive fight went out the window when i saw them face off after the weigh-in-

 

[gono btw]

Actually, a lot of people did, including Matt himself. I remember him talking in an interview about how there was a moment during the fight when he was wondering when the magical submission would come, when Royce would find a way to snatch an arm or lock up a choke. Part of that was the Royce Gracie mystique, to be sure, but then when you considered that submissions were for a long time Matt's kryptonite - getting tapped by Dennis Hallman not once but twice, getting choked unconscious by Newton in that triangle that he luckily slammed his way out of, losing his belt to BJ by RNC, and having to fight like hell to not get triangled by Charuto - it was by no means beyond the realm of possibility.

For comparison - and, as one of the biggest Ken Shamrock fans to ever post on this forum, this kills me to say - it was a hell of a lot more plausible to imagine Royce submitting Matt than to imagine Ken submitting Tito.

There was some serious nostalgia floating around with a huge number of people convincing themselves Royce had a shot........deep down everybody knew he was getting manhandled.

I'd take prime Ettish to beat no gi Royce all day.

Some gave him a chance his performance against Yoshida where he out grappled him was still in peoples mind, looking back it looks foolish but nostalgia is a hell of a drug.

Not a freak show at all. I know it's weird nowadays, but weight classes weren't the end all be all of who fought who. There were a few dozen guys who were basically the toughest guys in the world and they would match-up based on availability, purse size, and health status. Weight was a factor of course, you didn't put Krazy Horse against Coleman(!!!). But for the most part the toughest guy, most bad ass dudes on the planet were determined by how willing he was to fight anyone at any weight.

Ahh the good old old old days....

If i remember right Gracie really wanted that fight because he was claiming pure BJJ could still defeat a accomplished MMA fighter.

Everyone knew he would get tooled.

The after the fight Gracie said "he used Gracie JJ to beat me" lol.

Yup. Royce was sort of a nostalgia pick in this fight. TS mentions how much bigger Hughes was but look at the size of some of the people Royce beat in the early UFCs? Way bigger than Matt Hughes. The difference was Hughes also had great skills.

To a lesser extent, this is why I don't subscribe to the idea that "Prime" Fedor would still beat all the top fighters that so many others love on here. I loved Fedor too and he was the best of his time but time has moved on. Like with Royce, it's not just them getting old, it's also newer fighters getting better.

I remember Marc Laimon on TUF running his mouth about Royce’s BJJ being at a blue belt level at best in the early UFC’s. I don’t like Laimon because he has a big mouth...but he wasn’t that far off. I wouldn’t call it blue belt level but Royce was never really all that great. I rooted for him in every fight because I was a fan from Jump street, but he was average at best even in the BJJ dept. Matt Hughes ruined that event for me.

That was a pure hype job, irrelevant fight.
Hoyce was 40 yrs old, already past his physical prime in Pride.

Now, Hoyce himself (and if ya listen to some members of the family like Helson who blamed the loss on Hoyce not focussin´entirely on GJJ) for sure was the 1st to hype himself.

 

[gono btw]

I'm going off what I read in Mark Hunts book, I don't watch much MMA and didn't really watch any of the earlier UFC's I only really watched Pride and K-1

Then ya should read Art Davie´s book... Ya´ll understand why Horion chose Hoyce over Hickson.