Flash_Monsta's Street Justice Pub

Anyone watch Billions on TV? I gave it a shot and I'm enjoying it. Paul Giamatli is a beast of an actor in it.

I also need to get stuck into Preacher, the pilot was cool as fuck.
 
Also, commiserations to Flash on today's match.

Football is ghey anyway.
 
Last edited:
Anyone watch Billions on TV? I gave it a shot and I'm enjoying it. Paul Giamatli is a beast of an actor in it.

I also need to get stuck into Preacher, the pilot was cool as fuck.

I just heard about Billions- I think it was in the Guardian's best TV of the year so far feature. I might put that in the queue. I just have the Expanse to finish off, then Season 4 of Banshee, and then I need a new show.
 
I can just guess about the things said in that FIFA-meeting:

"So, let's get the two nations best known for their organized hooligan culture to play in one of the hardest city of the host country. Any objections? Nobody, fine!"
 
RIP to all the english fans who have gotten absolutely battered by the russian hools.

Chances are, a lot of our fans gave as good as they got. At least our own hooligans.

But clearly most of the England fans who were in the stadium when the Russians started climbing over the barricades were just normal people. Hence them running for their fucking lives.
 
Billions looks good AF. I'm in the middle of Bloodline right now. Great show.
 
I keep hearing that Billions is good so I guess I should check it out. The Summer is usually the time that I binge-watch some shows since most of the stuff I watch weekly is over until the Fall.

Anybody watch UnReal? It's a scripted show about the running of a realty show like the Bachelor. It was described to me as a dark comedy but it's mostly just dark. The way they treat the people on the show is nuts even if it's exaggerated.
 
I'd be willing to bet there isn't much exaggeration.
 
So has the Eric/Arlec thing been discussed around here?

I just say the thread on the main forum.
 
Soooooo Fedor got beat up badly by Fabio in the first. Wtf dude. Stay home, don't tarnish your legacy. So bummed to see him go out this way.
 
UK bros:

Leave or Remain?

I'm voting oot.

Nothing to do with immigration (although it can be used by companies to undercut pay and conditions for workers by have a labour pool willing to accept worse conditions) but more with the inherently undemocratic nature of the EU. This is our chance to dodge the removal of article 50 of the Lisbon treaty and get our sovereignity back, and dodge TTIP.
 
UK bros:

Leave or Remain?

I'm voting oot.

Nothing to do with immigration (although it can be used by companies to undercut pay and conditions for workers by have a labour pool willing to accept worse conditions) but more with the inherently undemocratic nature of the EU. This is our chance to dodge the removal of article 50 of the Lisbon treaty and get our sovereignity back, and dodge TTIP.

I'm for Remain.

I'm mainly concerned with the economic impact. There's pretty much universal consensus amongst serious and credible sources that the impact of leaving will be somewhere between very bad and catastrophic. World Bank, Treasury, IFS, IMF... apparently when Beexit guys try to find an economist who will appear to offer the counterpoint on the media, they barely have a choice of 1-2 minor figures compared to the hundreds o the other side. Anyway... loss of direct access to the single market will really hurt exports and trade right away, which will cause a recession. Fewer jobs, reduced or negative growth. In the medium term there will be a significant decline in inward investment. So yet again, fewer jobs, less growth. The "we can get a new/better deal quickly" is just a lie.

I'm not much moved by the sovereignty argument. Sovereignty is not binary, something you have or don't have. It is a matter of degree. In fact, almost every country has given up its sovereignty to some degree. Members of the WTO give up sovereignty over some aspects of trade policy. Signatories to the land mine ban give up sovereignty with respect to national defense. Members of the UN have more or less given up sovereignty insofar as they are bound by the UN Security Council. The list of ways that countries have given up sovereignty goes on and on. The point is that almost all countries find it useful to bind themselves in some way if others are also bound. So it's not "sovereignty above all other things" it's "sovereignty on all issues where it's not worth giving up sovereignty".

So the sovereignty argument more or less collapses back into the argument over the net benefits of being in the EU. If the net benefits of its are sufficient (and the benefits are mainly from trade plus the upside of freedom of movement), then it was probably worth giving up some degree of sovereignty. (Not all of it, because it is a matter of degree.)

If the issue is that you see the EU as not very democratic, well, I'm not an expert on this at all. But my understanding is that over the last 15 or so years they have improved things. In particular, the Lisbon Treaty made lots of helpful changes like increasing the power of the European Parliament (for which there are direct elections) relative to the Commission, and increasing the role of national parliaments in enacting European legislation. And to the extent there's a deficit in democracy, I would rather we were in it, pushing for further reform, then outside.
 
Soooooo Fedor got beat up badly by Fabio in the first. Wtf dude. Stay home, don't tarnish your legacy. So bummed to see him go out this way.
Crazy fight....but Fedor was fighting like he had a deathwish, what has happened to the well rounded fighter of old? I don't get it..he fights smart and patient against Monson and looked pretty good doing so, but just goes mental against Fabio.
 
Football is teh awesome.

RIP to all the english fans who have gotten absolutely battered by the russian hools.


I'm not a soccer fan but pretty much every pub/bar/brewery here is running awesome deals. The only downside is that you have to listen to soccer matches at full volume.

I was out Thursday celebrating the last day of Uni work for the year, I had like 8 beers and 4 doubles of talisker and I ended up paying like 20usd for it all. It was awesome, I think the bartender was drunk.
 
I'm for Remain.

I'm mainly concerned with the economic impact. There's pretty much universal consensus amongst serious and credible sources that the impact of leaving will be somewhere between very bad and catastrophic. World Bank, Treasury, IFS, IMF... apparently when Beexit guys try to find an economist who will appear to offer the counterpoint on the media, they barely have a choice of 1-2 minor figures compared to the hundreds o the other side. Anyway... loss of direct access to the single market will really hurt exports and trade right away, which will cause a recession. Fewer jobs, reduced or negative growth. In the medium term there will be a significant decline in inward investment. So yet again, fewer jobs, less growth. The "we can get a new/better deal quickly" is just a lie.

I'm not much moved by the sovereignty argument. Sovereignty is not binary, something you have or don't have. It is a matter of degree. In fact, almost every country has given up its sovereignty to some degree. Members of the WTO give up sovereignty over some aspects of trade policy. Signatories to the land mine ban give up sovereignty with respect to national defense. Members of the UN have more or less given up sovereignty insofar as they are bound by the UN Security Council. The list of ways that countries have given up sovereignty goes on and on. The point is that almost all countries find it useful to bind themselves in some way if others are also bound. So it's not "sovereignty above all other things" it's "sovereignty on all issues where it's not worth giving up sovereignty".

So the sovereignty argument more or less collapses back into the argument over the net benefits of being in the EU. If the net benefits of its are sufficient (and the benefits are mainly from trade plus the upside of freedom of movement), then it was probably worth giving up some degree of sovereignty. (Not all of it, because it is a matter of degree.)

If the issue is that you see the EU as not very democratic, well, I'm not an expert on this at all. But my understanding is that over the last 15 or so years they have improved things. In particular, the Lisbon Treaty made lots of helpful changes like increasing the power of the European Parliament (for which there are direct elections) relative to the Commission, and increasing the role of national parliaments in enacting European legislation. And to the extent there's a deficit in democracy, I would rather we were in it, pushing for further reform, then outside.

Good points but for me, I can't see the EU being reformed. The entire idea of the EU in the 20's was a United States of Europe, and while the Lisbon treaty did give some concessions it was also essentially an EU constitution with the ultimate goal being "ever closer union". I don't think federalism is a good choice, and while there are degrees of sovereignity as you rightly say, the end goal of the EU is less national sovereignity and a central EU government, army, constitution and parliament that supercedes individual nations.

Economically there are a few very good pro-leave voices such as Paul Mason and Richard Murphy. It's very unclear what will happen there as the decreased over-regulation via the EU and ability to arrange our own trade deals could have a large positive impact. We would also save the money we pay to the EU, which is debated as to how much. However for 40 of the 41 years we have been a member we have never gotten more back than we put in. Not a great investment. The trade deals in place could just be mirrored if we leave, and Switzerland, Iceland and Norway are all non-EU members and I am quite happy to be more like them in a lot of ways. The EU has been stagnant on growth since 2010, unlike almost anywhere else - it seems to be somewhat of a sinking ship in that aspect.

There are also considerations like not being allowed to nationalise and support organisations in the UK, nationalising the rail, energy and industries like steel is not possible in the EU framework, and can't be changed. Also I really, really don't want TTIP and the EU is pushing for it.

I can see why a lot of people are struggling to make their mind up.
 
Good points but for me, I can't see the EU being reformed. The entire idea of the EU in the 20's was a United States of Europe, and while the Lisbon treaty did give some concessions it was also essentially an EU constitution with the ultimate goal being "ever closer union". I don't think federalism is a good choice, and while there are degrees of sovereignity as you rightly say, the end goal of the EU is less national sovereignity and a central EU government, army, constitution and parliament that supercedes individual nations.

Economically there are a few very good pro-leave voices such as Paul Mason and Richard Murphy. It's very unclear what will happen there as the decreased over-regulation via the EU and ability to arrange our own trade deals could have a large positive impact. We would also save the money we pay to the EU, which is debated as to how much. However for 40 of the 41 years we have been a member we have never gotten more back than we put in. Not a great investment. The trade deals in place could just be mirrored if we leave, and Switzerland, Iceland and Norway are all non-EU members and I am quite happy to be more like them in a lot of ways. The EU has been stagnant on growth since 2010, unlike almost anywhere else - it seems to be somewhat of a sinking ship in that aspect.

There are also considerations like not being allowed to nationalise and support organisations in the UK, nationalising the rail, energy and industries like steel is not possible in the EU framework, and can't be changed. Also I really, really don't want TTIP and the EU is pushing for it.

I can see why a lot of people are struggling to make their mind up.

On the topic of economists, Paul Mason isn't an economist, he's a journalist. Richard Murphy is an economist, but his view seems to be that the economic impact wouldn't be that much because we would renegotiate a deal ilke the one the European Free Trade area, whereby we agree to all of the regulations of the EU anyway, including free movement, in order to get access to the free market. But not being represented in the EC or the European Parliament. If you are concerned about Sovereignty, that's even worse. That's the equivalent of being Puerto Rico- governed by US law but not having senate on Congressional representation.

On the topic of "getting back what we put in" that arguably not the case, or doesn't matter. The contribution to Europe is 340 euros per household per year. The estimated economic benefit of access to the single market is about 3,000 pounds per year. Thus, in technical terms, we make fucking bank by being the in the EU.

To be blunt, it's fairly cut-and-dried. On the economic and financial side, being in the EU is a big win. Leaving will almost certainly hurt, probably a lot. Honestly, I am happy to hear back and forth on the other aspects of the debate, concerns about TTIP, sovereignty, the democratic deficit- these are totally valid. But I am pretty sure that there is little point going back on economic and financial issues. It's pretty much settled. The public policy debate equivalent of whether you should cut squats off before you get to parallel- yes, you can find a few people who say you should, but they don't know what they are talking and meanwhile pretty much everyone who does know will tell you otherwise.

That's why Johnson and Gove don't seriously try to engage- they just stink the waters up with lies and misdirection, and move on to areas where they have a stronger case, or where things are decided on appeal to emotion and not obectively, like immigration.
 

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,237,108
Messages
55,467,926
Members
174,786
Latest member
plasterby
Back
Top