Is Megumi Fujii the Strawweight GOAT?

chinarice said:
She pretty much has 0 wins worth a damn. Don't care how much I get flamed. In her prime, she beat fighters with 1-2 records.
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Spoken like a true Fight Finder statistician.

(No, it’s not a compliment)
 
Cyborg's been on top for longer. WMMA's too new for Hendo records. They all fight cans, some more than others. The ones who remain on top get the accolades, and are way easier to name than with men.
 
The Schmoop said:
That is true. However, unlike bones and spider, cyborg has pissed clean for 5-6 years and has remained equally dominant. I don't think she ever needed PEDs but what's done is done. Many of her haters claim she's still reaping the benefits of roid abuse yet every other fighter that was forced of juice or trt suffered extreme performance drop off (Vitor, Hendo, Lombard etc).
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Of the two years she's been tested under USADA she's already failed a drug test, and women coming off steroids is a whole lot different than men <Lmaoo>.
 
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acannxr said:
Of the two years she's been tested under USADA she's already failed a drug test, and women coming off steroids is a whole lot different than men <Lmaoo>.
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How long was her suspension?
 
acannxr said:
Won 22 fights in a row before losing a split decision, has in fact only ever lost by decision (26-3) and repeatedly fought opponents in heavier weight classes.

Yay...
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Or nay...
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Megumi is #2.

Under my system, Gina is #1.
 
Ancient Warrior said:
Spoken like a true Fight Finder statistician.

(No, it’s not a compliment)
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yeah because when someone who has 20+ fights and is in their prime, fighting someone with a 1-1 record, that's right impressive!

I don't post here for your acceptance. I don't fish for likes when I post something. I post my opinion and don't care if everyone disagrees with me. You may not agree with me but I think it's silly for her to be labeled "GOAT" when other fighters have beaten better fighters than she has.

It's similar to labelling Royce Gracie the GOAT. He isn't. She is a pioneer to WMMA. Don't try to fluff her up to be something she isn't.
 
chinarice said:
yeah because when someone who has 20+ fights and is in their prime, fighting someone with a 1-1 record, that's right impressive!

I don't post here for your acceptance. I don't fish for likes when I post something. I post my opinion and don't care if everyone disagrees with me. You may not agree with me but I think it's silly for her to be labeled "GOAT" when other fighters have beaten better fighters than she has.

It's similar to labelling Royce Gracie the GOAT. He isn't. She is a pioneer to WMMA. Don't try to fluff her up to be something she isn't.
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Note: records at the time they fought. The women she fought may have been in higher weight classes at the time, I simply cited the weight classes they currently compete in from Sherdog; Fujii has weighed in anywhere from 105-120 lbs for her fights.

Fujii (0-0) vs. Matsumoto (1-1); Strawweight
Fujii (1-0) vs. Montoya (6-1); Flyweight
Fujii (2-0) vs. van der Wel (0-0-1); Flyweight
Fujii (3-0) vs. Tavares (2-0); Flyweight
Fujii (4-0) vs. Le Chon (0-0)
Fujii (5-0) vs. Takimoto (6-4); Strawweight
Fujii (6-0) vs. Tamai (13-7); Featherweight
Fujii (7-0) vs. Murray (0-0); Flyweight
Fujii (8-0) vs. Yoshida (13-5-5); Atomweight
Fujii (9-0) vs. Welchlin (1-0); Flyweight
Fujii (10-0) vs. Ellis (9-2); Strawweight
Fujii (11-0) vs. Takabayashi (8-1); Strawweight
Fujii (12-0) vs. Nagano (0-0); Strawweight
Fujii (13-0) vs. Hales (1-0); Flyweight
Fujii (14-0) vs. Hee Ham (3-2); Strawweight
Fujii (15-0) vs. Morii (0-0); Bantamweight
Fujii (16-0) vs. Chu (0-0)
Fujii (17-0) vs. Ishioka (7-3); Atomweight
Fujii (18-0) vs. Sunaba (12-11-1); Strawweight
Fujii (19-0) vs. Schneider (4-4); Strawweight
Fujii (20-0) vs. Esparza (3-0); Strawweight
Fujii (21-0) vs. Ellis (14-5); Strawweight
Fujii (22-0) vs. Frausto (9-1); Bantamweight
Fujii (22-1) vs. Fujino (9-4); Strawweight
Fujii (23-1) vs. Nagano (8-4); Strawweight
Fujii (24-1) vs. Benitez (6-1, 1 NC); Flyweight
Fujii (25-1) vs. Aguilar (13-4); Strawweight
Fujii (25-2) vs. Yamaguchi (10-4-1); Atomweight
Fujii (26-2) vs. Aguilar (15-4); Strawweight

Fujii's first loss was a questionable and controversial split decision, her second was a decision loss that could've gone either way, and the third was a technical decision loss due to getting eye poked (was very sad to see because it was her retirement fight). Fujii has definitely fought some cans in the middle of her career, and fighting opponents with little fights or making their debut earlier in her career are irrelevant. However, to argue that Fujii fought no legitimate fighters is a baseless argument.
 
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acannxr said:
Note: records at the time they fought. The women she fought may have been in higher weight classes at the time, I simply cited the weight classes they currently compete in from Sherdog; Fujii has weighed in anywhere from 105-120 lbs for her fights.

Fujii (0-0) vs. Matsumoto (1-1); Strawweight
Fujii (1-0) vs. Montoya (6-1); Flyweight
Fujii (2-0) vs. van der Wel (0-0-1); Flyweight
Fujii (3-0) vs. Tavares (2-0); Flyweight
Fujii (4-0) vs. Le Chon (0-0)
Fujii (5-0) vs. Takimoto (6-4); Strawweight
Fujii (6-0) vs. Tamai (13-7); Featherweight
Fujii (7-0) vs. Murray (0-0); Flyweight
Fujii (8-0) vs. Yoshida (13-5-5); Atomweight
Fujii (9-0) vs. Welchlin (1-0); Flyweight
Fujii (10-0) vs. Ellis (9-2); Strawweight
Fujii (11-0) vs. Takabayashi (8-1); Strawweight
Fujii (12-0) vs. Nagano (0-0); Strawweight
Fujii (13-0) vs. Hales (1-0); Flyweight
Fujii (14-0) vs. Hee Ham (3-2); Strawweight
Fujii (15-0) vs. Morii (0-0); Bantamweight
Fujii (16-0) vs. Chu (0-0)
Fujii (17-0) vs. Ishioka (7-3); Atomweight
Fujii (18-0) vs. Sunaba (12-11-1); Strawweight
Fujii (19-0) vs. Schneider (4-4); Strawweight
Fujii (20-0) vs. Esparza (3-0); Strawweight
Fujii (21-0) vs. Ellis (14-5); Strawweight
Fujii (22-0) vs. Frausto (9-1); Bantamweight
Fujii (22-1) vs. Fujino (9-4); Strawweight
Fujii (23-1) vs. Nagano (8-4); Strawweight
Fujii (24-1) vs. Benitez (6-1, 1 NC); Flyweight
Fujii (25-1) vs. Aguilar (13-4); Strawweight
Fujii (25-2) vs. Yamaguchi (10-4-1); Atomweight
Fujii (26-2) vs. Aguilar (15-4); Strawweight

Fujii's first loss was a questionable and controversial split decision, her second was a decision loss that could've gone either way, and the third was a technical decision loss due to getting eye poked (was very sad to see because it was her retirement fight). Fujii has definitely fought some cans in the middle of her career, and fighting opponents with little fights or making their debut earlier in her career are irrelevant. However, to argue that Fujii fought no legitimate fighters is a baseless argument.

Cyborg, being oversized for Featherweight, with most of her opponents being Bantamweights or Flyweights, and popping twice for PEDs in my mind disqualifies her from the discussion. That leaves Ronda Rousey and Joanna as the only other candidates along with Megumi. I think Joanna has a better resume than Ronda, personally, due to the varied styles of her opponents, while Ronda primarily fought grapplers. However, Joanna also just got knocked out so I'm not sure how that would affect her in this discussion.
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and stuff like this:

Fujii (12-0) vs. Nagano (0-0); Strawweight
Fujii (15-0) vs. Morii (0-0); Bantamweight
Fujii (16-0) vs. Chu (0-0)

and Fujii (20-0) vs. Esparza (3-0); Strawweight

is complete lunacy. Why is someone with 12, 15 and 16 fights, undefeated, fighting debuting professional fighters or even fighting a 3-0 fighter, 20 fights undefeated? Padded record to the max. She is a pioneer for WMMA but the competition has risen, albeit not significantly on average.
 
chinarice said:
and stuff like this:

Fujii (12-0) vs. Nagano (0-0); Strawweight
Fujii (15-0) vs. Morii (0-0); Bantamweight
Fujii (16-0) vs. Chu (0-0)

and Fujii (20-0) vs. Esparza (3-0); Strawweight

is complete lunacy. Why is someone with 12, 15 and 16 fights, undefeated, fighting debuting professional fighters or even fighting a 3-0 fighter, 20 fights undefeated? Padded record to the max. She is a pioneer for WMMA but the competition has risen, albeit not significantly on average.
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The thing is, Fujii was very active.

Fujii averaged 3.2 fights per year over her career (and averaged 4 fights per year when she fought Morii).

Pointing out three examples of can-crushing as a basis for saying her entire record is padded is flawed logic.
 
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Fuck yes. By today's standards she would be a 105, and fought women up to 145. Never cheated, did not talk shit and always carried herself like a champion.
 
jeskola said:
There's Cyborg, easy GOAT, then everyone else.
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Cyborg, who has fought as many women who were 125'ers as she did legit 145 lbs women? And by this I mean she has only fought six women who have not fought lighter than 145. and three of them have zero wins. She has failed two drug tests and attempted to alter a weigh in scale to fight smaller women.

GOAT of disgrace, nothing more.
 
acannxr said:
The thing is, Fujii was very active.

Rousey averaged 2.8 fights per year over her career.
Fujii averaged 3.2 fights per year over her career (and averaged 4 fights per year when she fought Morii).

Pointing out three examples of can-crushing as a basis for saying her entire record is padded is flawed logic.
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I think it's complete lunacy, regardless of how active a fighter is, to be fighting someone with 0 professional fights, when the other had 15+. Garbage commissions to even sanction such a fight.

When you have a big number of wins and 0 losses, it becomes less impressive when you dig deeper into the fact that said fighter has reached a current status in their career, where fighting debuting fighters to MMA to be complete nonsense.

Does she have more quality wins than Rousey or JJ, while they have not even half as many ifghts as Fujii? I don't think so. I think WMMA as a whole as a long ways to go. Outside of a dozen WMMA fighters, it seems on the level of UFC 1.
 
chinarice said:
I think it's complete lunacy, regardless of how active a fighter is, to be fighting someone with 0 professional fights, when the other had 15+. Garbage commissions to even sanction such a fight.

When you have a big number of wins and 0 losses, it becomes less impressive when you dig deeper into the fact that said fighter has reached a current status in their career, where fighting debuting fighters to MMA to be complete nonsense.

Does she have more quality wins than Rousey or JJ, while they have not even half as many ifghts as Fujii? I don't think so. I think WMMA as a whole as a long ways to go. Outside of a dozen WMMA fighters, it seems on the level of UFC 1.
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You also have to remember, I'd say at least 70% of her fights took place when there was no WMMA in North America (and I consider the starting point of North American WMMA the night Carano/Cyborg fought in Strikeforce). And Rousey/Joanna had the benefit of the UFC getting behind them and investing money in their divisions, so it's not an apples to apples comparison.

Fujii's fight against Schneider was her first fight post-Carano/Cyborg and it was interestingly enough in Bellator (notice the correlation?).

To answer your last question of who fought more quality opponents, you need to give me your definition of what a quality opponent is.
 
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