Social Landmark Dutch study shows those pesky conservatives were right all along: Kids grow out of "gender confusion"

[Rod1]

So your position is that we have trans characters in kids shows, and trans athletes in schools and trans visibility days because of social media algorithms?

I have never seen trans character is kids shows outside of social media outrage porn, but then again i curate what my kids see instead of giving them unrestricted access.

 

[Cajun]

That's not what I said.

People on the left are discussing issues that actually impact their lives (wages, infrastructure, workers rights, healthcare, housing, etc) while people on the right non-stop hyperventilate about issues that don't affect their lives in any way.

I can be concerned about things that don't directly affect me. Women or children being abused (not talking trans specifically but physical/sexual abuse) can still very much concern me even though I am not in either scenario. Topics can run the gamut from social issues to govt across the board. Just saying peeps can bring up whatever they want and if I disagree then I respond no matter how many stories there are. It's part of this place imo.

 

[Lucas1980]

I can be concerned about things that don't directly affect me. Women or children being abused (not talking trans specifically but physical/sexual abuse) can still very much concern me even though I am not in either scenario. Topics can run the gamut from social issues to govt across the board. Just saying peeps can bring up whatever they want and if I disagree then I respond no matter how many stories there are. It's part of this place imo.

This notion that you can't be concerned or have any say in things that don't directly affect you is retarded and just plain absurd.

 

[Madmick]

It's a good thing I'm making up my mind based on this one contrarian study and not the consensus that's developed over time among the relevant academic fields. Can you imagine if I had made my choice about what's right and wrong based on a holistic consensus and not this one contrarian study that just re-affirms my pre-existing biases?

This study isn't contrarian, isn't in a minority, and this consensus you reference doesn't exist.

You're not very bright, are you?

 

[Gotosleepho]

Pretty obvious. You don't even need a study to know this. Plus with all the things they teach kids in school, the "educators" almost encourage this sort of stuff in a way.

 

[blackheart]

This study isn't contrarian, isn't in a minority, and this consensus you reference doesn't exist.

You're not very bright, are you?

It is a contrarian study, there is consensus, you're just being a doubt merchant. There is no trans agenda. There is just medical and scientific consensus and physicians trying to do their best to provide medical treatment to their patients based on the best available evidence. You can keep lying, but I'll keep telling the truth.

 

[Madmick]

It is a contrarian study, there is consensus, you're just being a doubt merchant. There is no trans agenda. There is just medical and scientific consensus and physicians trying to do their best to provide medical treatment to their patients based on the best available evidence. You can keep lying, but I'll keep telling the truth.

Show me. Show me this "consensus". Point me to the DOIs for the large-scale studies tracking thousands of young adolescents over multiple decades, and their testimonies of gender identity.

 

[oldshadow]

Trans competitions is regulated by international federations though.

And most relevant ones have made moves to ban them.

And Biden and his supports want to use Title IX to force the issue.

 

[PhitePhan]

I have never seen trans character is kids shows outside of social media outrage porn, but then again i curate what my kids see instead of giving them unrestricted access.

So your position is that we have trans characters in kids shows, and trans athletes in schools and trans visibility days because of social media algorithms?

 

[method115]

It is a contrarian study, there is consensus, you're just being a doubt merchant. There is no trans agenda. There is just medical and scientific consensus and physicians trying to do their best to provide medical treatment to their patients based on the best available evidence. You can keep lying, but I'll keep telling the truth.

Is there consensus? Didn't the UK ban puberty blockers for the treatment of gender dysphoria?

 

[Scerpi]

I posted what the authors of the cited study said, you're rejecting their conclusion. I'm the cultists. Lol

And you've ignored the OP because you don't like it's conclusion... Head in sand



But yes... continue to support mutilating teens and possibly making them permanently infertile. Teens who barely know what they want in life and what they want to do. What a fantastic idea... Letting a 12 or 13 year old make a decision that will permanently alter their body for the rest of their life. Espeically a kid who may be experiencing mental issues and not making decision clearly.

Let me be clear... I give zero fucks about what an adult wants to do. After 18... have at it, even if believe that's a still a little young. But kids are far more malleable and will bend to the will of the adults in their lives, especially parents and doctors. If a psycho parent is pushing a trans agenda on their young child.. guess what happens. And because the America system has lost its minds, there's almost zero pushback from doctors as shown in the article below.

Notice how most EU countries require thorough therapy and counseling before even considering hormone blockers or surgery? What a novel idea... Maybe make sure the kid really is trans and not projecting due to outside influence or other mental issues.

Europe And U.S. Diverge Sharply On Treatment Of Gender Incongruence In Minors​

Europe And U.S. Diverge Sharply On Treatment Of Gender Incongruence In Minors

In line with precautionary principle, introduction of treatments whose effects are either disputed or unknown should be carefully reviewed before being routinely adopted.

www.forbes.com

In Europe political divisions on this topic aren’t nearly as conspicuous as they are in the U.S. Rather, the debate is much more fact-based. An increasing number of countries have conducted systematic reviews of evidence to determine the benefits and risks of puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones. And the findings from these reviews—that the certainty of benefits is “very low”—have informed changes in policy regarding treatment of gender incongruence in minors. While European health authorities aren’t instituting bans on treatment, currently minors in six European countries—Norway, U.K. Sweden, Denmark, France and Finland—can access puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones only if they meet strict eligibility requirements, usually in the context of a tightly controlled research setting.

Unlike Europe, there doesn’t appear to be a middle ground in the U.S. Instead the discussion on trans care for youth is polarized, with dueling diametrically opposed viewpoints. It’s either provide access to a full set of services, including pharmaceutical interventions, without reservation and cite existing evidence as if it’s settled science, or prohibit therapy entirely. (What were you saying again? The Science is settled? lol)

A marked shift in policy this year has meant that in Denmark most youth referred to the centralized gender clinic no longer get a prescription for puberty blockers, hormones or surgery. Rather, they receive therapeutic counseling and other support services. (NO WAY!! SHOCKING)

In France, the Académie Nationale de Médecine in February 2022 recommended the “greatest reserve” when considering puberty blockers or hormone treatments. The academy warned that the risk of “over-diagnosis” is real and urged caution when evaluating patients.

At the risk of overgeneralizing, the American approach allows minors much more autonomy, in which the medical establishment’s role is mostly to assent to a child’s declaration that he or she is trans. This affirmative model removes several safeguards put in place by, say, the Dutch Protocol, resulting in a possible deficient lack of medical precautions.

 

[blackheart]

Show me. Show me this "consensus". Point me to the DOIs for the large-scale studies tracking thousands of young adolescents over multiple decades, and their testimonies of gender identity.

Consensus is determined around the best available evidence at any given time. It's not determined around the imaginary goal post that you just made up. You are setting the goal post at a place that can't be falsified because you know the type of data you're asking for doesn't exist. We have only been providing the sort of gender-affirming care that we're talking about for about 20 years. But based on the best data and evidence that is available, physicians provide gender affirming treatment to people experiencing gender dysphoria because that has the best outcomes for patients.

Many women get boob jobs and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw breast enhancement surgery
Many men get hair transplants and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw hair transplants.

Why do you think normal/mainstream doctors in garden variety hospitals are providing gender affirming care Mick? How did we get to that place? They're doing it because there's a secret shadowy cabal of trans people pushing it on everyone? Or its a communist plot to destabilize the west? Or is it a common mainstream medical practice because the best available data shows its the right thing to do?

You like to play it straight like you're a serious rational calm conservative, when the reality is that you're just as emotionally motivated as any other rabid frothing MAGA freak. That's what this is about. It's about you being emotionally motivated to harm people that your lizard brain (the amygdala) has identified as the "out group". A group that elicits a disgust response from your amygdala. This isn't about a rational calm careful analysis of the evidence. It's about you being unable to restrain and regulate the primitive lizard part of your brain.

 

[blackheart]

Is there consensus? Didn't the UK ban puberty blockers for the treatment of gender dysphoria?

Oh the place that has been given the nickname "TERF island"? A place that is notorious for being really aggressive and shitty to trans people? Oh wow, I am shocked that "TERF island" has outlawed medical treatment for trans people. Next you're going to tell me that Jews aren't treated so well in Afghanistan!

 

[PhitePhan]

Consensus is determined around the best available evidence at any given time. It's not determined around the imaginary goal post that you just made up. You are setting the goal post at a place that can't be falsified because you know the type of data you're asking for doesn't exist. We have only been providing the sort of gender-affirming care that we're talking about for about 20 years. But based on the best data and evidence that is available, physicians provide gender affirming treatment to people experiencing gender dysphoria because that has the best outcomes for patients.

Many women get boob jobs and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw breast enhancement surgery
Many men get hair transplants and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw hair transplants.

Why do you think normal/mainstream doctors in garden variety hospitals are providing gender affirming care Mick? How did we get to that place? They're doing it because there's a secret shadowy cabal of trans people pushing it on everyone? Or its a communist plot to destabilize the west? Or is it a common mainstream medical practice because the best available data shows its the right thing to do?

You like to play it straight like you're a serious rational calm conservative, when the reality is that you're just as emotionally motivated as any other rabid frothing MAGA freak. That's what this is about. It's about you being emotionally motivated to harm people that your lizard brain (the amygdala) has identified as the "out group". A group that elicits a disgust response from your amygdala. This isn't about a rational calm careful analysis of the evidence. It's about you being unable to restrain and regulate the primitive lizard part of your brain.

You said there is a consensus, so you should back up your claim.

 

[method115]

Oh the place that has been given the nickname "TERF island"? A place that is notorious for being really aggressive and shitty to trans people? Oh wow, I am shocked that "TERF island" has outlawed medical treatment for trans people. Next you're going to tell me that Jews aren't treated so well in Afghanistan!

In March, for example, the Norwegian Healthcare Investigation Board announced it would revise its current clinical recommendations. The updated guidelines restrict the use of puberty blockers, cross-sex hormones and transition-related surgery to clinical research settings.

Is this also a TERF country?

 

[chardog]

Pretty obvious. You don't even need a study to know this. Plus with all the things they teach kids in school, the "educators" almost encourage this sort of stuff in a way.

our educators have pronouns

that tells you everything you need to know

 

[Halifax]

Consensus is determined around the best available evidence at any given time. It's not determined around the imaginary goal post that you just made up. You are setting the goal post at a place that can't be falsified because you know the type of data you're asking for doesn't exist. We have only been providing the sort of gender-affirming care that we're talking about for about 20 years. But based on the best data and evidence that is available, physicians provide gender affirming treatment to people experiencing gender dysphoria because that has the best outcomes for patients.

Many women get boob jobs and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw breast enhancement surgery
Many men get hair transplants and then later regret it - we don't then decide to outlaw hair transplants.

Why do you think normal/mainstream doctors in garden variety hospitals are providing gender affirming care Mick? How did we get to that place? They're doing it because there's a secret shadowy cabal of trans people pushing it on everyone? Or its a communist plot to destabilize the west? Or is it a common mainstream medical practice because the best available data shows its the right thing to do?

You like to play it straight like you're a serious rational calm conservative, when the reality is that you're just as emotionally motivated as any other rabid frothing MAGA freak. That's what this is about. It's about you being emotionally motivated to harm people that your lizard brain (the amygdala) has identified as the "out group". A group that elicits a disgust response from your amygdala. This isn't about a rational calm careful analysis of the evidence. It's about you being unable to restrain and regulate the primitive lizard part of your brain.

Let's charge for all cosmetic surgeries and have insurance not cover it then. All 100% out of pocket if you are not happy with your body. At least in canada.

Once folks have to start paying out of pocket and provinces stop using our tax dollars for it, tunes will change quick.

"Sure hun. When you are old enough to afford it without my help"

By then they will have grown out of it 99.9% of the time

 

[Osculater]

All these new pronouns and genders has all the children and teens confused to identify with hahaha!

 

[SKYNET]

I'm just waiting for @kflo.

 

[terrapin]

That's not what I said.

People on the left are discussing issues that actually impact their lives (wages, infrastructure, workers rights, healthcare, housing, etc) while people on the right non-stop hyperventilate about issues that don't affect their lives in any way.

People on the left on this site waste most of their lives posting instead of living and so I think it's an absolute joke to pretend that the reason people on the left don't talk about the trans issue is because they're too busy and engaging in important activities.

On this issue the left has been profoundly and amazingly closed-minded and judgmental and ignorant. The reason for this ignorance is mostly tribalism since the right by nature is going to see the problems with transgender issues before people on the left and since some bring it up sometimes in a quite bigoted manner, the left knee-jerk reacts and will not listen and will not do research and will not learn.

The ignorance and closed-mindedness of the left has been staggering in my opinion and also heartbreaking because on any other issue that is not a partisan one that is not poisoned by tribalism I would expect the left to be more educated and more reasonable.

I did a deep dive just about 2 1/2 years ago on this topic because I knew absolutely nothing about any of it. I didn't understand the pronouns. I didn't understand what they even meant. I felt like I just had no education and it only took a short time to find out really what's happening and when I came to sherdog I realized the left had basically no idea and is intentionally uneducated about it due to tribalism.

And I think it's crazy to believe it's not affecting anyone. It's actually a widespread problem. There are real real serious problems with the trans activist community and the way medical professionals have been handling people that are potentially trans or at least claim to think that they're trans.

Basically to find any good discussions on the topic or debates on the topic I had to look to Europe because there seems to be no chance of an honest debate happening in the states due to partisan hackery.

Tavistiock is a great case study for what is going wrong with medical professionals all over the world on this issue. Here is a short list of things to consider.

Ideologues in positions within clinics who promote surgery and or medical treatment to kids who may really not be trans.

A lack of any real time spent investigating comorbidities that often make a kid think they are trans like depression, autism or being molested by their father at home. These are particularly troublesome because it can take a person up to a year to be honest with a therapist about what's happening at home and surgery and or medical treatment is often recommended within a few sessions!!! It's particularly painful to hear someone from the left saying that we should trust medical professionals on this issue and then have that same person on the left in a different thread decry the lack of genuine quality medical care you can get under a for-profit system!!!!



The statistical anomaly that shows that once you put a kid on hormones they're almost 100% likely to go onto surgery but it's because of the hormones not because they really want the surgery!!!

Public shaming by the left and by many groups for any medical professionals or psychological professionals or lay people who question the trans movement, treatment of trans etc and its prevalence.

Influencers on tick tock and social media promising kids that their problems will be solved once they change their gender because it changed their lives so profoundly. This may or may not be just something they say to get hits on tick, tock or YouTube.

Young girls in particular being prone to social contagions and how social contagion spread and how the new transgenderism thing looks very much like a social contagion affecting young girls especially.

What has been known for some time now that most kids outgrow it... most people who think they're trans when they're young end up just being gay and they come to peace with their bodies and still get to have orgasm because they still have their parts.

Some left left wing scholars I have listened to have gone so far as to call what is happening conversion therapy against gay kids.

Trans activist organizations refusing to debate openly. Just simply refusing public debate against scholars who challenge their positions and instead choosing a intentional campaign of slander and lying instead keeping everyone in the dark because their ideas cannot be debated in the light of day.