Legal vs illegal in a nutshell

[Brazilian HKD]

I know this isn't PC to say, so keep all your little snowflake tears away from me, but here's a hard truth for you soyboy cucks:

If you've been in America for several generations and your best employment prospect is a low wage manual labor job, then you're a fuckin loser and you're not cut out to live in the GOAT country. Go live in some shithole where the competition is easier. We'd rather have the motherfucker who trudged across hundreds of miles of desert wasteland to cross a border and work 80 hours a week for a decade just to give his kids a chance at a better life. If you're not willing or able to outcompete that guy, we don't want you.

Well at least in my experience, the ones suffering more because of ilegalls here in mass are the ones who are part of the Black community, due to the impossibility of competing with workers that accept semi slave wages and accepting to be fired without warnings nor compensation. It is more complicated than a matter of competency.

 

[woodguyatl]

• Joe legal works in construction, has a Social Security number and makes $25.00 per hour with taxes deducted.
  
  Jose illegal also works in construction has no Social Security number and makes $15.00 per hour cash, under the table.
  
  Ready?... now pay attention....
  
  Joe legal: $25.00 per hour × 40 hours = $1,000.00 per week or $52,000.00 per year. Now, take 31% away for State and Federal taxes. Joe legal now has $31,231.00.
  
  Jose illegal: $15.00 an hour × 40 hours = $600.00 per week or $31,200.00 per year. Jose illegal pays no taxes. Jose illegal now has $31,200.00.
  
  Joe legal pays medical and dental insurance with limited coverage for his family at $600.00 per month, or $7,200.00 per year. Joe legal now has $24,031.00.
  
  Jose illegal has full medical and dental coverage through the State and local clinics and emergency hospitals at a cost of $0.00 per year. Jose illegal still has $31,200.00.
  
  Joe legal makes too much money and is not eligible for food stamps or welfare. Joe legal spends $500.00 per month for food or $6,000.00 per year. Joe legal now has $18,031.00.
  
  Jose illegal has no documented income and is eligible for food stamps, WIC and welfare. Jose illegal still has $31,200.00.
  
  Joe legal pays rent of 1,200.00 per month or $14,400.00 per year. Joe legal now has $9,631.00.
  
  Jose illegal receives $500.00 per month Federal rent subsidy. Jose illegal pays out that $500.00 per month or $6,000.00 per year. Jose illegal still has $31,200.00.
  
  Joe legal pays $200.00 per month or $2,400.00 per year for car insurance. Some of that is uninsured motorist insurance. Joe legal now has $7,231.00.
  
  Jose illegal says, "We don't need no stinkin' insurance."... and still has $31,000.00.
  
  Joe legal has to make his $7,231.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline.. etc.
  
  Jose illegal has to make his $31,200.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline and what he sends out of the country every month....
  
  Joe legal now works overtime on Saturdays or gets a part time job after work.
  
  Jose illegal has nights and weekends off to enjoy with his family.
  
  Joe legal's and Jose illegal's children both attend the same elementary school.
  
  Joe legal pays for his children's lunches while...
  
  Jose illegal's children get a government-sponsored lunch.
  
  Jose illegal's children have an after school ESL program.
  
  Joe legal's children go home.
  
  Now, when they reach college age...
  
  Joe legal's kids may not get into a State school and may not qualify for scholarships, grants or other tuition help, even though Joe has been paying for State schools through his taxes, while...
  
  Jose illegal's kids go to the, 'head of the class' because they are a minority.
  
  Joe legal and Jose illegal both benefit from the same police and fire services, but Joe paid for them and Jose did not.
  
  Do you get it, now?

If you are going to make an argument should get the basic facts correct.

The Federal tax on $52000 is about $7000. State income (if any) is a small portion of that. Share with me how you came up with $20,000.

Illegal immigrants can not collect welfare.

Illegal immigrants in many states, I live in one, do not qualify for in State tuition.

Illegal immigrants do not qualify for food stamps.

Schools are paid for by property taxes. If Joe and Jose are both renting, their landlords pay the property taxes out of the rent. If they own, they pay the taxes themselves. Either way they are paying the taxes.

Most illegal immigrants have care insurance because they get arrested without it. They may not have a drivers license, but they almost always have insurance.

Anecdotally, I don't know a single illegal here in Atlanta that does not work six or seven days a week.

 

[AgonyandIrony]

If you are going to make an argument should get the basic facts correct.

The Federal on $52000 is about $7000. State income (if any) is a small portion of that. Share with me how you came up with $20,000.

Illegal immigrants can not collect welfare.

Illegal immigrants in many states, I live in one, do not qualify for in State tuition.

Illegal immigrants do not qualify for food stamps.

Schools are paid for by property taxes. If Joe and Jose are both renting, their landlords pay the property taxes out of the rent. If they own, they pay the taxes themselves. Either way they are paying the taxes.

Most illegal immigrants have care insurance because they get arrested without it. They may not have a drivers license, but they almost always have insurance.

Anecdotally, I don't know a single illegal here in Atlanta that does not work six or seven days a week.

If Mexicans didn't work so fucking hard we wouldn't have to pull ourselves up by our bootstraps.

 

[xcvbn]

Bam, right off the bat you don't know what you're talking about. Upwards of 70% of undocumented immigrants do pay taxes through a counterfeit or false SSN. And many who don't pay taxes through ITIN's (individual taxpayer identification numbers). And the ones who don't fall into either group are usually working freelance.

You seriously think a construction company could work a big project without reporting wages and not come under immediate scrutiny?


Irony.

This is where employers(agriculture, construction) are often complicit by supplying the fraudulent SSN's.

Funny that no conservative outlets pushing the Mollie Tibbetts story as illegal alien hysteria were willing to attack the very Republican employers of the suspect.

Imo this issue starts and ends with the American citizens who give illegal immigrants jobs. I refuse to blame extremely poor immigrants who come here to work harder and get paid less than their American counterparts.

 

[Trotsky]

This is where employers(agriculture, construction) are often complicit by supplying the fraudulent SSN's.

I can't speak to that, but I believe it.

Funny that no conservative outlets pushing the Mollie Tibbetts story as illegal alien hysteria were willing to attack the very Republican employers of the suspect.

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. For instance, here in Missouri we have a Republican state legislature and, despite constantly using anti-immigrant rhetoric to get votes, they voted down a bill to require Missouri employers to use e-verify to prevent undocumented hires.

Imo this issue starts and ends with the American citizens who give illegal immigrants jobs. I refuse to blame extremely poor immigrants who come here to work harder and get paid less than their American counterparts.

Yeah, it's dicey to hold employers strictly liable either, though, particularly when the person is using an SSN - to hold employers who hired in good faith to that level of requirement would both unduly burden commerce and could very easily feed into hiring discrimination toward Hispanic persons. I would be fine with stiff penalties for knowingly hiring undocumented workers without supplying sponsorship, but that would be a standard of proof that would really only affect a small amount of employers.

 

[xcvbn]

I can't speak to that, but I believe it.



Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. For instance, here in Missouri we have a Republican state legislature and, despite constantly using anti-immigrant rhetoric to get votes, they voted down a bill to require Missouri employers to use e-verify to prevent undocumented hires.



Yeah, it's dicey to hold employers strictly liable either, though, particularly when the person is using an SSN - to hold employers who hired in good faith to that level of requirement would both unduly burden commerce and could very easily feed into hiring discrimination toward Hispanic persons. I would be fine with stiff penalties for knowingly hiring undocumented workers without supplying sponsorship, but that would be a standard of proof that would really only affect a small amount of employers.

Immigration is without a doubt a "political issue" that is never intended to be taken care of. There are many ideas, like e-verify, that would severely curb the issue but mysteriously these solutions are shelved.

It's really no wonder that the GOP pretends to be anti-illegal immigration then does nothing to stop it when they control Congress, the Senate, and the White House. The vast majority of employers who exploit immigrants tend to be card carrying Republicans. My uncle is one of them. Complete fucking hypocrite who hires illegal immigrants then bitches about them all the same.

Enforcement would be very difficult but not impossible. Just need time and reliable whistle blowers with great record keeping. Pop one employer/executive with a 10 year sentence+$1M fine and bricks will be shat.

 

[all caps]

This is where employers(agriculture, construction) are often complicit by supplying the fraudulent SSN's.

Funny that no conservative outlets pushing the Mollie Tibbetts story as illegal alien hysteria were willing to attack the very Republican employers of the suspect.

Imo this issue starts and ends with the American citizens who give illegal immigrants jobs. I refuse to blame extremely poor immigrants who come here to work harder and get paid less than their American counterparts.

I refuse to blame the American citizens for it as well. The people in power bring them here. They are no different from me and you. If I'm gonna live with them, I'm gonna work with them.

 

[Maga]

This is where employers(agriculture, construction) are often complicit by supplying the fraudulent SSN's.

Funny that no conservative outlets pushing the Mollie Tibbetts story as illegal alien hysteria were willing to attack the very Republican employers of the suspect.

Imo this issue starts and ends with the American citizens who give illegal immigrants jobs. I refuse to blame extremely poor immigrants who come here to work harder and get paid less than their American counterparts.

I in no way shape or form have a problem with their willingness and desire to have a better life. It's the fact it's so easy to get in and work the system.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

I know this isn't PC to say, so keep all your little snowflake tears away from me, but here's a hard truth for you soyboy cucks:

If you've been in America for several generations and your best employment prospect is a low wage manual labor job, then you're a fuckin loser and you're not cut out to live in the GOAT country. Go live in some shithole where the competition is easier. We'd rather have the motherfucker who trudged across hundreds of miles of desert wasteland to cross a border and work 80 hours a week for a decade just to give his kids a chance at a better life. If you're not willing or able to outcompete that guy, we don't want you.

How do you feel about bagging groceries at a Trader Joes in NJ?

 

[lifelessheap]

• • the mother of jose children could be eligible but i highly doubt jose is
    
    
  
  what is this based on?

They get in state tuition and preferential treatment on campus.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

If you are going to make an argument should get the basic facts correct.

The Federal tax on $52000 is about $7000. State income (if any) is a small portion of that. Share with me how you came up with $20,000.

Illegal immigrants can not collect welfare.

Illegal immigrants in many states, I live in one, do not qualify for in State tuition.

Illegal immigrants do not qualify for food stamps.

Schools are paid for by property taxes. If Joe and Jose are both renting, their landlords pay the property taxes out of the rent. If they own, they pay the taxes themselves. Either way they are paying the taxes.

Most illegal immigrants have care insurance because they get arrested without it. They may not have a drivers license, but they almost always have insurance.

Anecdotally, I don't know a single illegal here in Atlanta that does not work six or seven days a week.

and none of this matters, because with more, without or with less illegals, this country will still run, and be no worse for wear.

 

[xcvbn]

I refuse to blame the American citizens for it as well. The people in power bring them here. They are no different from me and you. If I'm gonna live with them, I'm gonna work with them.

You don't blame the people who knowingly and illegally hire employees with fraudulent SSN's or completely under the table?

 

[xcvbn]

I in no way shape or form have a problem with their willingness and desire to have a better life. It's the fact it's so easy to get in and work the system.

Why do you think that is? And who do you think is working to put an end to it?

 

[all caps]

You don't blame the people who knowingly and illegally hire employees with fraudulent SSN's or completely under the table?

I'd like to see some of these people who *knowingly* hire illegals. Do you know what goes in to a background check for your average job? Who is supposed to be naming the illegals? You're putting that on joe blow the supervisor making $14/hr who hates his job?

 

[xcvbn]

I'd like to see some of these people who *knowingly* hire illegals. Do you know what goes in to a background check for your average job? Who is supposed to be naming the illegals? You're putting that on joe blow the supervisor making $14/hr who hates his job?

Lol I worked in construction and agriculture in the central valley of California. It's absolutely rampant and painfully obvious. These employers are not stupid at all they know damn well what they're doing and there's zero incentive for them to stop.

My uncle was a contractor. He openly talked about how he was "forced" to hire illegals in order to compete with other contractors. He was also a multimillionaire at the time so he really hired them because he was a cheap ass. He also refused to hire me out of high school because he couldn't "pay me a fair wage" and instead got me into a union job so maybe I should thank him.

Where are you from? What industries are you familiar with?

 

[Leagon]

Well at least in my experience, the ones suffering more because of ilegalls here in mass are the ones who are part of the Black community, due to the impossibility of competing with workers that accept semi slave wages and accepting to be fired without warnings nor compensation. It is more complicated than a matter of competency.

That actually supports my point. The people who find it hardest to compete with illegal immigrants are the ones who were only recently allowed to participate in the competition. To any Americans who have only been allowed to evenly compete for 1 generation, best of luck. It's gonna be tough.

To all the other Americans who have been competing in this country for hundreds of years and losing every step of the way, you fuckin suck. It's a hard truth, but it's a reality. Not everyone is meant to be president. Not everyone is smart enough to work at Google. And not everyone can cut it in America.

This country didn't become great because we imported the laziest and least successful people from around the globe. We became greatest because we imported greatness. If it takes you five generations to reach "construction worker," you're not great.

 

[Darkballs]

I remember this as one of those shitty chain emails my southern relatives passed along to everyone they knew. But that was 10 years ago. Does this shit just get rehashed among republicans?

 

[Leagon]

How do you feel about bagging groceries at a Trader Joes in NJ?

Everyone has hard times. He had that job for a year because he needed it to get back on his feet.

All work is essential. If someone is a construction worker, that's fine. Shit has to get built. But if you're a construction worker and you're complaining about your job, stfu and get a better job or go somewhere else. This is America ffs. That's like someone playing in the NBA and complaining that all the other players are too tall. Go fuckin play in the North Korean basketball league then.

 

[aitkenmike]

Sounds odd that he'd pay 31% tax on that income in the US. Sweden is known for high taxes but here someone with that income would pay 23.7% in income tax (slight variations based on which municipality you live in), and that of course includes not having to have health insurance etc.

Don't expect people complaining about tax to understand marginal tax rates. It's much easier to criticise when you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

 

[Cajun]

Bam, right off the bat you don't know what you're talking about. Upwards of 70% of undocumented immigrants do pay taxes through a counterfeit or false SSN. And many who don't pay taxes through ITIN's (individual taxpayer identification numbers). And the ones who don't fall into either group are usually working freelance.

You seriously think a construction company could work a big project without reporting wages and not come under immediate scrutiny?


Irony.

Dont know about large construction companies but lots of independent contractors here in texas. Many use illegals. I do see issues with no borders. I am married to a Mexican but not a fan of open borders