Why does Fedor suck so much in a cage?

Discussion in 'Worldwide MMA Discussion' started by PubliusVentidius, Jan 12, 2018.

  1. Snuc3315

    Snuc3315 avoiding the grave for a while

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    The Sambo matches are in a circle the size of international "amatuer" wrestling. Hypothetically this experience would indicate Fedor would prefer the cage.... but I do agree that 30 plus mma fights in a ring may screw with his head in a cage.
     
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  2. Edwin

    Edwin My father wears his sneakers in the pool.

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    Don't argue with @Clear Winner, he's a PRIDE hater and a fan of girly sports like soccer lololololol
     
  3. emefer

    emefer Purple Belt

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    Why did Fedor get old?
     
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  4. PRIDE_DREAM_RIZIN

    PRIDE_DREAM_RIZIN Blue Belt

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    Well said, Mauro also talked about the ring being almost a completely different sport than fighting in a cage.
     
  5. RAFI BOMB

    RAFI BOMB Yellow Belt

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    Well this is what Fedor's coaches said after he knocked out Arlovski

    https://www.mmamania.com/2009/01/26/trainer-fedor-won-with-his-old-tricks-not-his-training

    So the simplest and likely most accurate explanation is that Fedor didn't train seriously enough for his fights in strikeforce. As a consequence he made more mistakes in the fights and ended up losing.

    On a more technical side, there are different ring generalship strategies when in a cage vs a ring. Take this image below

    [​IMG]

    This can help explain some of the ring generalship tactics found in boxing, kickboxing, muay thai and mma in a ring. Firstly, the worst place to be is in the corners of C, and the best place to be is in the middle of the base of C (where A meets C).

    As the fight starts, both fighters move towards region A. An infighter or slugger will want to back their opponent up to region C but will also settle for region B. Region B is a less useful place to put your opponent in because they have more room to move and can move into region C on either side, whereas when they are in region C they are trapped. So as a fight goes on there is a bit of a chess match going on if you have two intelligent fighters. Each wants their opponent in region C and each wants to avoid getting stuck in region C. They also know that their opponent wants the same thing. So part of the game is to try and outwit your opponent with footwork and strikes to get them trapped in region C without getting trapped their yourself.


    With an octagon or cage (in its various shapes) there is much more room to move around. It is difficult to get trapped anywhere and it can also be difficult to cut off the cage because there really aren't any regions to trap a fighter. You could argue that being trapped along the cage is equivalent to getting trapped along the ropes. While this is true most mma fighters don't have a clue what to do when they get their opponent there. They should try and keep their opponent on the cage and make them feel trapped by knowing which exits they have and then cutting them off. Then they should us strikes to punish them for getting caught there. Something like staying in the center and keeping your opponent in the red triangles

    [​IMG]

    So for Fedor the ring generalship tactics are different and that can make it difficult to strategize, which can result in a change in performance.
     
  6. PRIDE_DREAM_RIZIN

    PRIDE_DREAM_RIZIN Blue Belt

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    Very nice post! This is what Sherdoggies should do more of instead of posting.. “I just rewatched..”.

    I appreciate this kinda post.
     
  7. PrideUltimate

    PrideUltimate Yellow Belt

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    Miles hit harder to different cars and women too. Some cars and women can run well past their prime, some don't. Same with men. Some has their prime condition at 20s some after 30s. You cant compare them like that - he was this and that younger.
     
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  8. RagingBeringola

    RagingBeringola Purple Belt

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    Some fighters back in the day would point the difference that it was to fight in a ring or in a cage, with quite different rulesets either.

    For Fedor, plenty of people were saying that he needed to improve his training methods, camp and training partners. While he had undeniable talent, MMA was evolving, and Fedor was still practicing at his old fashioned club at Stariy Oskol with the likes of Kiril Sidelnikov. I don't want to disrespect the teams or teammates, but it might have been that they lost track of MMA evolution at some point.
    Fedor would later go to other facilities to improve or keep up his game, but might have been too late.
     
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  9. Rudeboyben84

    Rudeboyben84 Purple Belt

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    Judo and Sambo aren’t fought in a ring.

    Show me where the cage came into play in his losses.

    Fedor doesn’t train hard or at a good camp with good sparring partners. It’s obvious why he looks bad now.

    Take a poll and I’d bet your in a tiny minority who thinks he beats Crocop now
     
  10. manboy<3

    manboy<3 don't card me bro

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    Fedor vs Henderson - Fedor gets reversed against the cage wall while attempting finish Henderson.Would not work in the ring.

    Fedor vs Maldonado. Fedor has Maldondado against the cage. Maldando simply moves to the side and Fedor get's countered and dropped . Would not work in the ring.

    Fedor vs Bigfoot, Fedor cannot close the distance effectively against Bigfoot and eats a lot of punches trying to do so.Would be different in a ring

    Fedor doesn't train hard? He is always in great shape...Look at Fedor's fight vs Ishii and look at his Fight vs Henderson..similar level of opponent but totally different approach

    I don't know of a single decent performance by Cro Cop in the cage. And when Fedor went back to the ring to Fight Ishii he looked great vs a good opponent (By comparison, Cro Cop looked horrible in his two fights against Ishii despite winning them)

    Cro Cop's current run includes a win over a small light heavyweight wrestler in king Mo and that's it. Other than that is nothing to be impressed with at all.He fought a Sumo wrestler, an old and damaged Gonzaga, Laboured in 2 bad fights vs Ishii...took out a super drained Aliakbari that was barely able to stand up and KO'd a 50 year old Japanese LHW. He would have possibly lost all those fights if there were in the cage BTW.

    Nothing to be impressed with so yes I do think that Fedor would beat him right now. Also Do you think Cro Cop has better trainning partners then Fedor ? Do you think he works harder than Fedor?

    He fights in the ring in Japan where he is most comfortable. Fedor also went to RIZIN and took out JDS with ease in the ring. If Fedor stayed in RIZIN he would be on an 8 fight win streak right now

    Get real, Cro Cop ran away to Japan that's the secret of his "resurgence"
     
  11. manboy<3

    manboy<3 don't card me bro

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    Also, you don't get knocked out by Frank Mir and then 3 years later go on to win a K-1 Tourny unless the cage is a massive problem for you

    Again, getting knocked out by Mir and then going on to win a K-1 tourny..

    The ring vs cage difference is huge and affected both Fedor and Cro Cop to a huge degree
     
  12. tekkenfan

    tekkenfan Purple Belt

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    i think the cage is a small part of it.. alot of russian guys do have issues with it at first with khabibs first 2 ufc fights he fought my old wrestling coach kamal in his debut and had issues taking him down against the fence and he didnt get tibau down but he started learning how to useit better the cage is a art in itself tbh if u dont work it and know the technical ways to use to your advantage you cant wrestle fuck guys
     
  13. giusti825

    giusti825 ßanned

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    he flashed a feminist rally in brazil
     
  14. bjpenngoat

    bjpenngoat Red Belt

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    He fought calculated and smart against ishii, monsoon and rizzo. He is completely reckless in the states but Ihink it is because he wants to put on a great show and deliver a ko. He's probably 85% shot at this point. He has a 15% of being great on any given night. Bad luck and reckless behavior and diminished timing is a recipe for failure in mma at 40.
     
  15. Shishio

    Shishio Brown Belt

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    As to my understanding it has to do with being jetlagged as shit....most cage fights are in the states, this is also why American fighters look like crap in Japan....good example would be Teruto Ishihara vs Artem Lobov, fight was in Ireland where Lobov trains and you could see Ishihara had zero energy, Ian McCall looked like ass in Japan during Rizin's tourney
     
  16. george14

    george14 Blue Belt

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    1) He was a small HW who had a ton of mileage
    2) Werdum is a legend, not a bad loss
    3) Bigfoot was roiding
    4) Hendo was on TRT
    5) People are worse at the end of their career than the beginning, shocking.
     
  17. Hotora86

    Hotora86 by armbar

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    EOT
     
  18. Mike01010101a

    Mike01010101a Brown Belt

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    The cage fence is more stronger than ring ropes so the pure strength is more important and useful in cage. In ring the technique is dominant. Fedor is a small and light guy in HW division.
     
  19. neil_totally

    neil_totally Purple Belt

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    awesome dude, thanks for posting this!

    This is basically a proper explanation of "well fighting in a ring is different to fighting in a cage". Which is, coupled with him not taking shit as seriously, like you said, why the dude hasn't been great.
     
  20. TankvsNelmark

    TankvsNelmark Green Belt

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    More like henderson the 185lber knocked him out cold and he's never been good since or never really was good
     
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