Would GSP be as successful if he were fighting in today's UFC?

NordWorld86 said:
Rakhmonov would have the edge just as Chimaev
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Not sure how khamzat beats prime GSP outside of a punchers chance, and Shavkat's TDD is untested against elite MMA wrestlers. He was taken down multiple times in a fight right before he came to the UFC.
 
"The overall ability has dropped in MMA" - Jon Fitch


(timestamped)

Cliffs:

- Fighters are better athletes but less technically sound than used to because a lot of the ground and grappling training has been abandoned for the show of standup and being flashy to favour the promoters

- Fighters who you can take down and put in bad positions pretty easily because they are just not used to opposition doing it

- There are a lot of guys who have shorter careers because they focus too much in the standup

- "If we (him and Swick) were to come up at this time, we could be as succesful technically...but if you don't sell tickets the way the promoter wants, they have much more control over fighters nowadays. You literally need a certain number of social media followers to even get signed"
 
pankrat said:
He was in the high 180s in fight night with very low body fat.
He would ve an average sized WW today but would definitely avoid the cut to LW.
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He walked around 185-190lbs

Islam 190-200
Olivera 183-185
Poirier 190
Gaethje 180
Khabib 190
Chandler 190
 
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Young GSP was TST
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Canadian Kicker said:
He walked around 185-190lbs

Islam 190-200
Olivera 183-185
Poirier 190
Gaethje 180
Khabib 190
Chandler 190
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It seems you don't grasp the difference between walk around weight and fight night weight.

Walk around weight says nothing. Joe Stevensson walked around at 190-200, some FWs do as well. So what? It only means they get out of shape in between camps or they bulk up like retards.

What matters is their weight in fighting shape, after a fight camp, and particularly in fight night. GSP is 185lbs while being very lean. Simply there is nothing where he can cut 30lbs from. There is not much bulk and barely any fat. Even if it was physically possible, it's obvious it would badly affect his performance.

I mean, you need to be blind or purposely obtuse to not see that GSP is a bigger man than Chandler, and would have a much harder time making 155lbs
 
pankrat said:
It seems you don't grasp the difference between walk around weight and fight night weight.

Walk around weight says nothing. Joe Stevensson walked around at 190-200, some FWs do as well. So what? It only means they get out of shape in between camps or they bulk up like retards.

What matters is their weight in fighting shape, after a fight camp, and particularly in fight night. GSP is 185lbs while being very lean. Simply there is nothing where he can cut 30lbs from. There is not much bulk and barely any fat. Even if it was physically possible, it's obvious it would badly affect his performance.

I mean, you need to be blind or purposely obtuse to not see that GSP is a bigger man than Chandler, and would have a much harder time making 155lbs
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It seems that you don't grasp the difference between weight cutting in 2004 vs 2023.

When everybody wanted him to move up to fight Sliva, he said it would be easier for him to cut to 155 then bulk to 185.
During the Khabib fantasies it was GSP that wanted 155. These were years (and a few pounds) after his debut.

But hey, maybe he was just delusional because pankrat says he would never make it.
 
SSgt Dickweed said:
He might not even be allowed to compete if all he would do is grapplefck the other guy thanks to WME/TKO. If he were to have purple cornrows, he might.
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He still has the chance to make that happen. He ain't bald.
 
Canadian Kicker said:
It seems that you don't grasp the difference between weight cutting in 2004 vs 2023.

When everybody wanted him to move up to fight Sliva, he said it would be easier for him to cut to 155 then bulk to 185.
During the Khabib fantasies it was GSP that wanted 155. These were years (and a few pounds) after his debut.

But hey, maybe he was just delusional because pankrat says he would never make it.
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There is one thing we dont need to speculate. Anderson Silva could and actually did make WW and even became champion there. By the weight cutting methods of two decades ago.

Regarding GSP at LW, we do need to speculate. It's physically possible but how it would compromise his performance, it's uncertain.
Not because pankrat says so but because his own boss Dana White expressed these same doubts:

https://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/ufc...-st-pierre-but-unsure-if-gsp-can-make-155lbs/

And even GSP himself did:

https://www.essentiallysports.com/m...n-on-which-he-will-fight-khabib-nurmagomedov/

Regardless, to build your argument aound the walk-around weight of other LWs who get way more out of shape / bulked up in between fights than GSP used to do is either uneducated or disingenuous.
 
pankrat said:
It seems you don't grasp the difference between walk around weight and fight night weight.

Walk around weight says nothing. Joe Stevensson walked around at 190-200, some FWs do as well. So what? It only means they get out of shape in between camps or they bulk up like retards.

What matters is their weight in fighting shape, after a fight camp, and particularly in fight night. GSP is 185lbs while being very lean. Simply there is nothing where he can cut 30lbs from. There is not much bulk and barely any fat. Even if it was physically possible, it's obvious it would badly affect his performance.

I mean, you need to be blind or purposely obtuse to not see that GSP is a bigger man than Chandler, and would have a much harder time making 155lbs
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Its not just a weight issue but also a frame issue. These new welterweights like Shavkat, Khamzat, Garry, Edwards are much taller, are just as heavy without being bulky, and have about an equally long reach as GSP, all because they have a naturally bigger frame.

GSP also enjoyed a significant strength advantage over his opponents. Could you comfortably say that GSP would have a big strength advantage over guys like Shavkat, Khamzat, Usman?

I think the whole idea that the new generation has gotten much better is blown way out of proportion, but I do think that welterweight specifically for some reason is seeing an influx of guys with MW frames somehow making WW consistently. There was a time when Condit was the tall guy of the division at like 6'1/maybeee 6'2, while looking kinda scrawny, and now we have a guy like Garry whos like 6'3 and makes WW without looking emeciated.
 
NationWideNinja said:
Its not just a weight issue but also a frame issue. These new welterweights like Shavkat, Khamzat, Garry, Edwards are much taller, are just as heavy without being bulky, and have about an equally long reach as GSP, because they have a naturally bigger frame.

GSP also enjoyed a significant strength advantage over his opponents, would you comfortably say that GSP would have a big strength advantage over guys like Shavkat, Khamzat, Usman?

I think the whole idea that the new generation has gotten much better is blown way out of proportion, but I do think that welterweight specifically for some reason is seeing an influx of guys with MW frames somehow making WW consistently. There was a time when Condit was the tall guy of the division at like 6'1/maybeee 6'2, while looking kinda scrawny, and now we have a guy like Garry whos like 6'3 and makes WW without looking emeciated.
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Of course, it's a trend we see in evey weightclass.
The average weight for MWs involved in tittle fights during Silva's era was around 200lbs or not even that. Today, its around 210lbs.

It happens at WW too. Yeah, GSP would not have the size nor the athleticism advantage he enyojed back in the day, It comes with the evolution I guess. It doesnt mean he could just drop to 155 to enjoy that same size/strenght advantage he enjoyed back in the day but now a weight class below without compromising his performance. It doesn work like that.

Regardless, GSP could very well be competitive today at 170, as a matter of fact the most succesful WWs of recent times aren't even that big for the weightclass, not even frame-wise compared with GSP, such as Leon, Colby, Burns or Belal. Or undefeated Bellator champion Amosov.
 
Yes because GSP had an impeccable ability to take someone down and dry hump the shit out of them for 25 minutes without them being able to do much about it.
 
GSP would probably still be champion today, yes.

He's a "total package" kind of guy, so he would have likely done a good job against anybody...
Great kicks

very athletic

much defense IQ

Wow tactical mind


Uber takedowns


WAR GSP THE LEAPER
 
pankrat said:
Of course, it's a trend we see in evey weightclass.
The average weight for MWs involved in tittle fights during Silva's era was around 200lbs or not even that. Today, its around 210lbs.

It happens at WW too. Yeah, GSP would not have the size nor the athleticism advantage he enyojed back in the day, It comes with the evolution I guess. It doesnt mean he could just drop to 155 to enjoy that same size/strenght advantage he enjoyed back in the day but now a weight class below without compromising his performance. It doesn work like that.

Regardless, GSP could very well be competitive today at 170, as a matter of fact the most succesful WWs of recent times aren't even that big for the weightclass, not even frame-wise compared with GSP, such as Leon, Colby, Burns or Belal. Or undefeated Bellator champion Amosov.
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Yeah I dont disagree that he would have a tough cut to 155, but I wasnt really arguing that, my point was that he would be undersized today maybe not from a weight perspective but in a different way. A lot of the advantages he liked over his opponents such as being lenghty, or being strong in the grappling, would be much less pronounced against the current crop of welterweights.

I 100% think he could still be a defending champ, just dont think he breezes through the division like he did during his reign.
 
In his prime? He'd probably be even more dominant than he was. He could probably come back now and beat Strickland.
 
gsp' skillset is better than any welter weight today. the only one that comes close in terms of skill is shavkat rakhmonov. stop with the bs 'today fighters have evolved and are more well rounded bla bla bla. gsp is more well rounded than any of the fighters in the ww division and his wrestling is better too. he could takedown anyone of them, even usman
 
pankrat said:
It seems you don't grasp the difference between walk around weight and fight night weight.

Walk around weight says nothing. Joe Stevensson walked around at 190-200, some FWs do as well. So what? It only means they get out of shape in between camps or they bulk up like retards.

What matters is their weight in fighting shape, after a fight camp, and particularly in fight night. GSP is 185lbs while being very lean. Simply there is nothing where he can cut 30lbs from. There is not much bulk and barely any fat. Even if it was physically possible, it's obvious it would badly affect his performance.

I mean, you need to be blind or purposely obtuse to not see that GSP is a bigger man than Chandler, and would have a much harder time making 155lbs
Click to expand...
"GSP would have to chop off a leg to make 155." --Dana White
 
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