Would Jon Jones vs Ngannou be the biggest fight in UFC history

JKS said:
It's not speculation sport! First, It's pretty straight forward contract negotiations at that level. Conor did just like that, Jones does it just like that and so do many boxers. Second, I actually have friends and clients who are in the industry here and in Vegas that called it exactly as such in terms of what Francis would do and why the UFC passed. If you can't see this then you no clue what you're talking about.

Francis is just fine and is getting the fights he wants right now. But he did miss on a big fight with Jones which would have done big things for his legacy as a mma fighter. Now, he's just a guy who won the belt and left. So not beating Jones certainly hurts his legacy. Like I said, both the UFC and Francis lost that fight.

The UFC didn't fumble anything sport. If they wanted to pay and give Francis what he wanted, they very well could have. They simply just chose not to. They didn't see the worth. And you can't argue that, they just didn't want to give Francis what he wanted as it wasn't worth for them. Why do you think the UFC didn't budge??
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You just can't use logic with people on here that post on emotions due to their illogical hate of Dana White and being insufferable cucks toward Francis.
It seriously clouds their rational judgment.
 
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Not even close.

McGregor, Lesnar, Rousey, and Liddell had bigger fights.
 
Yeah unless you live in a box under rocks the next frank fight with aj will be huge
 
the version of stipe that fought dc is a way better fight for jones
2 great champions

nganou has like 1 title defense and struggled

but yeah as of the moment jones vs nganou is the fight to make
 
John12 said:
It's fine if you want to speculate a bunch of stuff, just don't act like these are facts that would've actually happened. Those fights would only help his legacy if he won, you said it yourself and him winning wasn't a guarantee. What if he got destroyed, KO'd and lost three fights in a row? His legacy would taken a hit so him leaving didn't hurt his legacy because we don't know what've actually happened in those fights. The Strikeforce roster was full of former UFC and Pride fighters yet it was Cormier who won the Grand Prix and went on to win 2 UFC belts, a homegrown Strikeforce fighter, name recognition doesn't automatically make you a better fighter. You know who else had his debut in Strikeforce? Cain, the UFC signed him when he only had 2 fights and he destroyed almost everyone. UFC fans would've called them no name bums who can't compete in the UFC if they stayed in Strikeforce, same thing some of them think about PFL/Bellator fighters but the truth is that there's a lot of talent in different promotions, all UFC fighters come from different promotions these days unless you are CM Punk
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I think now where gonna get somewhere lol.

First, of course it's speculation and a lot of things in business and negotiations are, and I am speaking from the perspective of the UFC. I never stated these as facts. I simply said that the UFC in their negotiations with Francis saw boxing as a potential problem and was one of the reasons why they didn't want to allow him to box. And not allowing him to box is the main reason why he didn't sign back with the UFC. They did reference the challenges in negotiations with Conor after the boxing fight with Floyd when his profile got elevated. It was well known in the media that Conor after his boxing fight demanded much more and fought less. You can understand the UFC didn't want to potentially have the same pitfalls with Francis. And just to clarify, I am not speculating this was the UFCs thought process, these are things that come from people in the industry.

On the topic of the legacy, I think we're on the same page that if Francis won he would be in the running for the best UFC HW of all time, but if he lost it hurts his legacy. That goes for any fighter. I am a huge Fedor fan and to this day, certain fans second guess his legacy for not fighting in the UFC. So while it could have gone either way for Francis depending on if he won or lost in terms of his legacy. Fans will still second guess his legacy now because he didn't take those fights. The unknown is something that fans will always criticize. And it's the same thing with Khabib, he called his career early and while he had a great run, fans and media are now secnd guessing his legacy as a result. And from my perspective, I see the same with fans and the media in relation to Francis. They know that there really aren't many fights out there in mma to make his legacy greater than what it could have bee in the UFC. Now, I think you'll be happy for me to say that overall as a fighter, his legacy can increase big time by boxing. And I think it already has simply by his great performance vs Fury. And with a win over Joshua, perahps winning a boxing title, I think that is worth more than his legacy in the UFC. So while I do think his legacy as a mma fighter will get hurt, overall the legacy of Francis Ngannou can be great and among the most memorable as a fighter.



The other points you're making. I don't disagree that SF has inrecible talent, I mean Rockhold, Cormier, Jacare among more were elite level fighters on the level of the UFC. So yes, there is great talent of the UFC with PFL, Bellator no doubt. However, I think it has to be worth mentioning that guys like Rockhold and Cormier, became elite level fighters by beating the top guys that were either top UFC fighters or former top Pride fighters. Those guys had the name and resumes. The issue is that the PFL guys right now simply don't. So comparing Cormier who fought Monson (former UFC title challengers), Silva who owned several wins over elite HWs and Barnett a former UFC champ and top HW is different than Francis beating Dejila or Ferreira who don't have the resumes. They could potentially be UFC elite level, but there is nothing to show that yet because PFL lacks those names.

And I think you do have to agree that the talent level in PFL is just not on the level of the UFC for the most part. I mean you have Mercier as a champion who was barely top 15 in the UFC, you had Lins as HW champ who had an average record in the UFC and lost to Bosser and old Arlovksi, you had Carlos Jr as LHW champ and was even ranked in the UFC. Their current LHW champ in Kasanganay couldnt't even cut in the UFC on a lower level.

Cain became a great fighter because he built his skills and legacy in the UFC. It had nothing to do with SF, he had his mma debut in SF and that's it. The Cain that had his mma debut, is not the same guy who was HW champ.
 
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Khabib vs. Conor would still be bigger.
 
Tyler Durden said:
You just can't use logic with people on here that post on emotions due to their illogical hate of Dana White and being insufferable cucks toward Francis.
It seriously clouds their rational judgment.
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No doubt, but I continue to try and reason lol
 
Biggest fight in UFC history? What is Francis' highest selling fight so far? I don't even think Jon has had a PPV with over 1M buys, and it wouldn't even be Jon's biggest fight.
 
Jones would absolutely murk Ngannou.
 
JKS said:
I think now where gonna get somewhere lol.

First, of course it's speculation and a lot of things in business and negotiations are, and I am speaking from the perspective of the UFC. I never stated these as facts. I simply said that the UFC in their negotiations with Francis saw boxing as a potential problem and was one of the reasons why they didn't want to allow him to box. And not allowing him to box is the main reason why he didn't sign back with the UFC. They did reference the challenges in negotiations with Conor after the boxing fight with Floyd when his profile got elevated. It was well known in the media that Conor after his boxing fight demanded much more and fought less. You can understand the UFC didn't want to potentially have the same pitfalls with Francis. And just to clarify, I am not speculating this was the UFCs thought process, these are things that come from people in the industry.

On the topic of the legacy, I think we're on the same page that if Francis won he would be in the running for the best UFC HW of all time, but if he lost it hurts his legacy. That goes for any fighter. I am a huge Fedor fan and to this day, certain fans second guess his legacy for not fighting in the UFC. So while it could have gone either way for Francis depending on if he won or lost in terms of his legacy. Fans will still second guess his legacy now because he didn't take those fights. The unknown is something that fans will always criticize. And it's the same thing with Khabib, he called his career early and while he had a great run, fans and media are now secnd guessing his legacy as a result. And from my perspective, I see the same with fans and the media in relation to Francis. They know that there really aren't many fights out there in mma to make his legacy greater than what it could have bee in the UFC. Now, I think you'll be happy for me to say that overall as a fighter, his legacy can increase big time by boxing. And I think it already has simply by his great performance vs Fury. And with a win over Joshua, perahps winning a boxing title, I think that is worth more than his legacy in the UFC. So while I do think his legacy as a mma fighter will get hurt, overall the legacy of Francis Ngannou can be great and among the most memorable as a fighter.



The other points you're making. I don't disagree that SF has inrecible talent, I mean Rockhold, Cormier, Jacare among more were elite level fighters on the level of the UFC. So yes, there is great talent of the UFC with PFL, Bellator no doubt. However, I think it has to be worth mentioning that guys like Rockhold and Cormier, became elite level fighters by beating the top guys that were either top UFC fighters or former top Pride fighters. Those guys had the name and resumes. The issue is that the PFL guys right now simply don't. So comparing Cormier who fought Monson (former UFC title challengers), Silva who owned several wins over elite HWs and Barnett a former UFC champ and top HW is different than Francis beating Dejila or Ferreira who don't have the resumes. They could potentially be UFC elite level, but there is nothing to show that yet because PFL lacks those names.

And I think you do have to agree that the talent level in PFL is just not on the level of the UFC for the most part. I mean you have Mercier as a champion who was barely top 15 in the UFC, you had Lins as HW champ who had an average record in the UFC and lost to Bosser and old Arlovksi, you had Carlos Jr as LHW champ and was even ranked in the UFC. Their current LHW champ in Kasanganay couldnt't even cut in the UFC on a lower level.

Cain became a great fighter because he built his skills and legacy in the UFC. It had nothing to do with SF, he had his mma debut in SF and that's it. The Cain that had his mma debut, is not the same guy who was HW champ.
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Sure we can speculate about their perspective but I wouldn't be surprised if they allowed Conor to box again if the money is right. I just think it's pointless to speculate about this whole thing, specially knowing that Dana and the UFC backtrack on so many things, like when he said that women would never fight in the UFC lol. I understand your pov about the legacy thing but I disagree with the notion that Fedor, Khabib or Francis got their legacies hurt by the unknown, some people might feel that way but I find it silly. The UFC has more depth but my whole point was that there's talent everywhere, someone like Cain didn't have a resume full of former UFC fighters or name recognition when he signed with the UFC but that clearly didn't matter, Bellator has actually signed many former UFC fighters through the years and they are merging with PFL now
 
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I don't think so.

One thing that made Conor fights so big was his activity. The fights kept getting bigger because he was staying relatively active and people kept tuning in.

With how sparse Jones and Francis have been fighting it would not have that kind of hype. It would be a big fight and break a million PPVs I'm pretty sure but there have been plenty of fights that have done that over the years.
 
It would sell like 600k ppvs so it would be a big fight but biggest ever? Not even close
 
It will happen when Jones needs more money. So...when they are both in their mid forties because UFC likes to make big fights when it's pointless.
 
Most likely yes, would it translate to record buys? Not sure but in relevancy or significance this is Khabib vs Mcgregor level.
 
JKS said:
I think now where gonna get somewhere lol.

First, of course it's speculation and a lot of things in business and negotiations are, and I am speaking from the perspective of the UFC. I never stated these as facts. I simply said that the UFC in their negotiations with Francis saw boxing as a potential problem and was one of the reasons why they didn't want to allow him to box. And not allowing him to box is the main reason why he didn't sign back with the UFC. They did reference the challenges in negotiations with Conor after the boxing fight with Floyd when his profile got elevated. It was well known in the media that Conor after his boxing fight demanded much more and fought less. You can understand the UFC didn't want to potentially have the same pitfalls with Francis. And just to clarify, I am not speculating this was the UFCs thought process, these are things that come from people in the industry.

On the topic of the legacy, I think we're on the same page that if Francis won he would be in the running for the best UFC HW of all time, but if he lost it hurts his legacy. That goes for any fighter. I am a huge Fedor fan and to this day, certain fans second guess his legacy for not fighting in the UFC. So while it could have gone either way for Francis depending on if he won or lost in terms of his legacy. Fans will still second guess his legacy now because he didn't take those fights. The unknown is something that fans will always criticize. And it's the same thing with Khabib, he called his career early and while he had a great run, fans and media are now secnd guessing his legacy as a result. And from my perspective, I see the same with fans and the media in relation to Francis. They know that there really aren't many fights out there in mma to make his legacy greater than what it could have bee in the UFC. Now, I think you'll be happy for me to say that overall as a fighter, his legacy can increase big time by boxing. And I think it already has simply by his great performance vs Fury. And with a win over Joshua, perahps winning a boxing title, I think that is worth more than his legacy in the UFC. So while I do think his legacy as a mma fighter will get hurt, overall the legacy of Francis Ngannou can be great and among the most memorable as a fighter.



The other points you're making. I don't disagree that SF has inrecible talent, I mean Rockhold, Cormier, Jacare among more were elite level fighters on the level of the UFC. So yes, there is great talent of the UFC with PFL, Bellator no doubt. However, I think it has to be worth mentioning that guys like Rockhold and Cormier, became elite level fighters by beating the top guys that were either top UFC fighters or former top Pride fighters. Those guys had the name and resumes. The issue is that the PFL guys right now simply don't. So comparing Cormier who fought Monson (former UFC title challengers), Silva who owned several wins over elite HWs and Barnett a former UFC champ and top HW is different than Francis beating Dejila or Ferreira who don't have the resumes. They could potentially be UFC elite level, but there is nothing to show that yet because PFL lacks those names.

And I think you do have to agree that the talent level in PFL is just not on the level of the UFC for the most part. I mean you have Mercier as a champion who was barely top 15 in the UFC, you had Lins as HW champ who had an average record in the UFC and lost to Bosser and old Arlovksi, you had Carlos Jr as LHW champ and was even ranked in the UFC. Their current LHW champ in Kasanganay couldnt't even cut in the UFC on a lower level.

Cain became a great fighter because he built his skills and legacy in the UFC. It had nothing to do with SF, he had his mma debut in SF and that's it. The Cain that had his mma debut, is not the same guy who was HW champ.
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Excellent post.
 
MrBlackheart said:
Jones didn’t want a piece of Aspinall/Pav and all of a sudden he wants Francis? Jones just wants to beat old Stipe and frame that paper GOAT certificate in his house.
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Jones doing his best Mayweather. He believes Stipe is a gimme fight otherwise he wouldn't take it.
 
WillyWill said:
John isn;t really even a HW, he's a LHW who doesn't cut. Sll that shit sbout adding muscle mass the right way was just bullshit.
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That's exactly right, just a bullshit excuse to duck Francis for 3 years
 
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