Muslim Refugees Taught To Lie About Being Christian By NGOs

[Fazz]

Cool. Enjoy your 72 virgins. Or, is it 72 raisins?



I think I’ve had more raisins in a bowl of Raisin Bran.

When people go off topic and on to ad homenim tangents, you know the conversation is over. Not only did you fail to prove any of your points about the Quran, you also failed to defend your own belief. Probably best to avoid these types of conversations in the future.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Tokiya scarry they drink with you then stab you.

 

[babycart]

Yes.

Not only that, but I'm insinuating that hating the game and not the player is a big part of becoming an educated adult. Brock Lesnar does not deserve a title shot. Conor McGregor is not the best MMArtist on the planet. You and I know this, but people who don't really understand MMA have no idea what's going on.

Listen to what this girl is saying. She isn't saying "yeah, fuck borders. I love refugee dick!" She's explaining the rules of the game. She's saying that border guards have in their mind what a suffering person looks like and that being stoic through suffering will actually ruin your chances at entering the country, so you have to act like a fuckin drama queen.

"The squeaky wheel gets the grease." That's not an Islamic saying, it's a wisdom long understood in the Western world.

You can agree that the system is a farce without hating the lowest level participants. If the choices are between integrity and a better life for one's family, what do you expect people to choose?

So when someone had a chance to play or walk away but still chose to play, that someone gets a free pass because hating the game and not the players is the mature thing to do? Did Ariel Ricker had a knife to her throat to participate this way?

Scoff at your "educated adult." The "game" proliferates because there are "players" wanting to play the game. The "game" of sending African natives to be slaves elsewhere was stopped more than a century ago. Why? Cuz the masses decried those who participated in this game, changing the social mores of those times. Now we have another "game," when those people chose to play, they themselves have to bear the consequences of their choices.

It’s a weak argument as it doesn’t tackle my point that Quranic scripture and exegesis do not command Muslims to go around killing unbelievers for being unbelievers. Al-Qaeda are a political entity, a terrorist group whose goals are political in nature. When Bin Laden declared his war against the US in 98, he gave his reasons and the six main reasons were all political. So citing a terrorist group with political goals and virtually no mainstream scholarly backing does not address my point.

So Osama Bin Laden was spouting bullshit when he exhorted others to "JIHAD." The term "Jihad" itself has religious implications. Not to mention the ISIS caliphate. What were the terms that enabled themselves to be styled as "establishing a caliphate?"

 

[babycart]

Really? So God ordered men to go and burn whole towns to the ground killing all the the children, adults and livestock because some people of the town began to follow and preach a different religion? You believe in the God that gave such orders? You do understand this is not some old timey God but the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost of Christian thinking, right? The Jesus of your belief was fully involved in giving such orders, or do you shy from such thinking?

If the holy book or scriptures of some other religion contained similar commands what right would a Bible believer have to complain or point the finger?

Back during the time of David, it was YHWH who was known to have given the directive. And YHWH was considered to be the root deity aka the same as the God of Abraham, which in turn sprouted two other religions: Christianity and Islam. The bloody record of YHWH cannot be overturned and spills over to Jesus Christ cuz the Father is greater than the Son.

 

[Fazz]

So when someone had a chance to play or walk away but still chose to play, that someone gets a free pass because hating the game and not the players is the mature thing to do? Did Ariel Ricker had a knife to her throat to participate this way?

Scoff at your "educated adult." The "game" proliferates because there are "players" wanting to play the game. The "game" of sending African natives to be slaves elsewhere was stopped more than a century ago. Why? Cuz the masses decried those who participated in this game, changing the social mores of those times. Now we have another "game," when those people chose to play, they themselves have to bear the consequences of their choices.



So Osama Bin Laden was spouting bullshit when he exhorted others to "JIHAD." The term "Jihad" itself has religious implications. Not to mention the ISIS caliphate. What were the terms that enabled themselves to be styled as "establishing a caliphate?"

Unless you are suggesting the word ‘Jihad’ means going around killing unbelievers randomly, the point is moot. None of their actions (like killing innocent people etc) had any basis in Quranic scripture. Whilst they definitely tried to twist the religious texts in order to achieve their very specific political goals, there was no Quranic backing to their tactics and actions.

 

[Barbas619]

When people go off topic and on to ad homenim tangents, you know the conversation is over. Not only did you fail to prove any of your points about the Quran, you also failed to defend your own belief. Probably best to avoid these types of conversations in the future.

What do you have to say about the video I posted? Will you receive 72 virgins (which sounds like a terrible idea, tbh), or will you be receiving 72 raisins?

Serious question, btw.

 

[Damien Karras]

The reasoning behind it, I am assuming, is to remove prejudice from the selection process in which religious beliefs should never be considered in its vetting to begin with.

Still, lying about one's religious beliefs, or conspiracy to systematically lie about it like the activist has been doing, seems to be fraudulent (IANAL) so I don't condone it.

I hardly see it as grossly immoral or unethical. Illegal yes, but immoral, meh. Goes back to the question "is it immoral to steal bread to feed your hungry family?"

 

[uppercutbus]

What do you have to say about the video I posted? Will you receive 72 virgins (which sounds like a terrible idea, tbh), or will you be receiving 72 raisins?

Serious question, btw.

I just like how moderate muslims have an explanation for literally every bad thing in Islam to make it into "not real Islam" or a variant of "it's not like that" when large segments of self-identified muslim practitioners and Islamic governments are following it under the banner of Islam.

Maybe if they tried to convince their fellow muslims hardliners about the "real Islam" instead of infidels on message boards maybe things will progress. Non-muslims think it's all bullshit, real/not-real, so forming an argument about how real it is won't change anyones minds when people commit crimes/terrorism in the name of an ideology.

The reasoning behind it, I am assuming, is to remove prejudice from the selection process in which religious beliefs should never be considered in its vetting to begin with.

Still, lying about one's religious beliefs, or conspiracy to systematically lie about it like the activist has been doing, seems to be fraudulent (IANAL) so I don't condone it.

I hardly see it as grossly immoral or unethical. Illegal yes, but immoral, meh. Goes back to the question "is it immoral to steal bread to feed your hungry family?"

Do you think governments should have the autonomy to think differently and punish those that help cheat the system (aka stop Soros bill).

 

[Leagon]

So when someone had a chance to play or walk away but still chose to play, that someone gets a free pass because hating the game and not the players is the mature thing to do? Did Ariel Ricker had a knife to her throat to participate this way?

Scoff at your "educated adult." The "game" proliferates because there are "players" wanting to play the game. The "game" of sending African natives to be slaves elsewhere was stopped more than a century ago. Why? Cuz the masses decried those who participated in this game, changing the social mores of those times. Now we have another "game," when those people chose to play, they themselves have to bear the consequences of their choices.

This is what I meant by "educated". You seem to think slavery was ended due to mass outcry. That is not how slavery was ended.

That is not how any game ends. There's an entire field of study into game theory that shows how little sense your premise makes. You're just babbling to try to keep your faith system intact.

 

[Fazz]

What do you have to say about the video I posted? Will you receive 72 virgins (which sounds like a terrible idea, tbh), or will you be receiving 72 raisins?

Serious question, btw.

Still off topic. Why get into a conversation and then run away from it? If you don't know something, just hold your hands up and say you'll look into it and reply when you have more knowledge.

 

[ShinkanPo]

I'm not sure whether it's scary or comical how misinformed so many people here are with all things Muslim. Taqiya is predominantly a Shia term (10% of Muslims) and even then it does not give licence for people to lie willy-nilly. The irony is that the term is so minuscule and irrelevant within Islam that the average Muslim has never heard of it. I went through Islamic schools and studies for years and didn't come across the term once. Like most Muslims who have heard of the word, I heard it from one of those anti-Muslim right-wing websites and then researched it after. The mainstream belief in Islam is that lying is one of the biggest sins and something that causes corruption to the spiritual heart. This is the belief that average Muslims are bought up with and instil in their kids. The average Sherbro is not interested in reality however, so I'm probably wasting my words.

Takiya is scary

 

[Barbas619]

Still off topic. Why get into a conversation and then run away from it? If you don't know something, just hold your hands up and say you'll look into it and reply when you have more knowledge.

I’ve answered every question you’ve posed.

You, on the other hand...not in the slightest.

 

[Fazz]

I’ve answered every question you’ve posed.

You, on the other hand...not in the slightest.

Lmao you haven't even answered or proven your initial point about "Taqiya" being a mainstream Quranic concept. Since then you have continued to fail to answer every point including some from other posters about your own beliefs.

 

[Fazz]

Takiya is scary

What is it? So many seem to love using the word but no-one can tell me anything about it, or provide evidence for their claim when challenged.

 

[Barbas619]

Lmao you haven't even answered or proven your initial point about "Taqiya" being a mainstream Quranic concept. Since then you have continued to fail to answer every point including some from other posters about your own beliefs.

We’re going around in circles, Fazz. Let’s move on, buddy.

Happy Friday!

 

[Fazz]

We’re going around in circles, Fazz. Let’s move on, buddy.

Happy Friday!

Good day to you too.

 

[svirk]

Cool. Enjoy your 72 virgins. Or, is it 72 raisins?



I think I’ve had more raisins in a bowl of Raisin Bran.

Great response. Exactly what I would expect from someone like you. You don't have a clue about your own faith let alone Islam.
As for the video, it is just random ignorance.

 

[svirk]

So Osama Bin Laden was spouting bullshit when he exhorted others to "JIHAD."

Exactly. Now you begin to understand.

 

[svirk]

What do you have to say about the video I posted? Will you receive 72 virgins (which sounds like a terrible idea, tbh), or will you be receiving 72 raisins?

Serious question, btw.

It is not a serious question. It is the question of an ignorant man avoiding the legitimate questions raised about his own faith. It is a weasel question from an immature internet Crusader who is incapable of reasoned discussion.

On the off chance that I am wrong, please quote me this verse about 72 raisins or virgins from the Quran which you imagine you are questioning.

The first reference to the afterlife in the Quran reads as such:

"And give good tidings to those who believe and do righteous deeds that they will have gardens [in Paradise] beneath which rivers flow. Whenever they are provided with a provision of fruit therefrom, they will say, "This is what we were provided with before." And it is given to them in likeness. And they will have therein purified spouses, and they will abide therein eternally. Indeed, God is not timid to present an example - that of a mosquito or what is smaller than it. And those who have believed know that it is the truth from their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, they say, "What did God intend by this as an example?" (Quran 2:25,26)

 

[svirk]

I just like how moderate muslims have an explanation for literally every bad thing in Islam to make it into "not real Islam" or a variant of "it's not like that" when large segments of self-identified muslim practitioners and Islamic governments are following it under the banner of Islam.

Religion (or any strongly held belief) is used by many to gain and maintain power. The religion or belief system is manipulated to commit excess and outright evil. For example, around 500AD apostasy became a capital crime in Christendom. If you lived in the Christian world, anywhere from around 400AD to maybe as late as 1800AD, what conclusions would you have reached about Christianity? Would you say that Jesus preached burning witches, killing pagans and torturing Jews? If there were a Christian of that time who tried to explain to you the message of Jesus would you tell him that Christians kill pagans so that must be part of the religion? Would you point to the edicts issued by the Popes and the speeches of so-called scholars of the time as proof of your claim? St. Augustine argued, "There is a righteous persecution which the Church of Christ inflicts upon the impious. She persecutes in the spirit of love. that she may correct. that she may recall from error. taking]measures for their good, to secure their eternal salvation."

There is great ignorance in the Muslim world which is in a pathetic state at this point in time. Much of what is being preached about Islam is in fact anti-Islamic.

Maybe if they tried to convince their fellow muslims hardliners about the "real Islam" instead of infidels on message boards maybe things will progress. Non-muslims think it's all bullshit, real/not-real, so forming an argument about how real it is won't change anyones minds when people commit crimes/terrorism in the name of an ideology.

Muslims, like myself, have to struggle (jihad) against our more ignorant and fanatical brothers while at the same time try to show Islam for what we believe it is.

Also, I might add, it is America which is committing the worst crimes of our times in the name of their ideology. There is no close second and a pack of slippered fanatics running around in the hills and mountains of Afghanistan has only as much power as America has allowed it.