Betsy DeVos and the Trump administration battle the #metoo movement

[Slick_36]

Theoretically, maybe. Realistically...not so sure. It seems like anything more than filing a complaint and being believed, is met with resistance. As if its somehow cruel to ask the alleged victim to back their shit up.

What do you want though in terms of backing it up? It's not like there's visual evidence, it's unlikely there's written evidence aside from the accusation, if there were witnesses it would be a lot more open and shut. Even in the few cases of sperm it could be argued that it was consensual and it just becomes he said/she said.

 

[HereticBD]

What do you want though in terms of backing it up? It's not like there's visual evidence, it's unlikely there's written evidence aside from the accusation, if there were witnesses it would be a lot more open and shut. Even in the few cases of sperm it could be argued that it was consensual and it just becomes he said/she said.

Sure, but how is automatically believing them any more fair? How do you expect the accused to defend themselves? Where are their rights?

It's all very messy, unfortunately, but the answer certainly isn't to give the accusers carte blanche.

 

[Slick_36]

Sure, but how is automatically believing them any more fair? How do you expect the accused to defend themselves? Where are their rights?

It's all very messy, unfortunately, but the answer certainly isn't to give the accusers carte blanche.

That's what I'm trying to figure out. It's not simple at all, it's not a conspiracy against men. I don't want to create a system that makes it easy for people to get away with rape, I don't want men to be easy targets of false accusations because I've been threatened with it myself and I understand how helpless it feels and the ramifications of it.

 

[Ripskater]

I don't want to create a system that makes it easy for people to get away with rape, I don't want men to be easy targets of false accusations because I've been threatened with it myself and I understand how helpless it feels and the ramifications of it.

We agree with you on this.

 

[HereticBD]

That's what I'm trying to figure out. It's not simple at all, it's not a conspiracy against men. I don't want to create a system that makes it easy for people to get away with rape, I don't want men to be easy targets of false accusations because I've been threatened with it myself and I understand how helpless it feels and the ramifications of it.

Unfortunately, the only fair way to do it is to equally apply pressure to both parties to prove their cases. I say unfortunately, because these crimes can be very difficult to prove, and you will have people slip through the cracks. That's no excuse to green light witch hunts though.

 

[Slick_36]

We agree with you on this.

Doesn't seem like it. You seem pretty firmly entrenched on one side without offering any solutions.

I'd be interested in seeing statistics to see if there are more false accusations or more unreported rapes. It's a Sophie's choice.

 

[Ripskater]

Doesn't seem like it. You seem pretty firmly entrenched on one side without offering any solutions.

I'd be interested in seeing statistics to see if there are more false accusations or more unreported rapes. It's a Sophie's choice.

I already told you the solution. Their are 2 sides to every story, sometimes there are witnesses, you weigh all the evidence. And make the decision from there. Sometimes it's a he said she said, and you won't know.

 

[Slick_36]

I already told you the solution. Their are 2 sides to every story, sometimes there are witnesses, you weigh all the evidence. And make the decision from there. Sometimes it's a he said she said, and you won't know.

It will always be he said/she said. I'm asking you what evidence is adequate for a guilty verdict.

 

[Ripskater]

It will always be he said/she said. I'm asking you what evidence is adequate for a guilty verdict.

I don't know, ask the lawyers here. I'm not one.

In the case of Larry Nassar, he had independent multiple victims telling the exact same story. That's a good piece of evidence. But you weigh all the evidence.

 

[Slick_36]

I don't know, ask the lawyers here. I'm not one.

In the case of Larry Nassar, he had independent multiple victims telling the exact same story. That's a good piece of evidence. But you weigh all the evidence.

If you're not a lawyer, maybe you shouldn't be telling us how we need handle this legally. You're demanding evidence but can't even tell us what evidence would be valid. Figure that out before you start making demands.

 

[sangreporsangre]

DeVos may be one of the swampiest of Trump's crooked ass appointees, but this is a step in the right direction. Even a broken clock is twice a day, although for the Trump administration a better metaphor is probably that even a leap year calendar is right once every 4 years.

 

[Slick_36]

DeVos may be one of the swampiest of Trump's crooked ass appointees, but this is a step in the right direction. Even a broken clock is twice a day, although for the Trump administration a better metaphor is probably that even a leap year calendar is right once every 4 years.

Yeah I may not think it's the best approach to the problem but I certainly think it's the best thing she's done so far. It's a crying shame that she's in the position she's in when our country already lags so far behind in education right now. I'm not necessarily for one side or another when it comes to handling this problem, but I'm glad it's being addressed and considered at the very least.

 

[Ripskater]

If you're not a lawyer, maybe you shouldn't be telling us how we need handle this legally. You're demanding evidence but can't even tell us what evidence would be valid. Figure that out before you start making demands.

I may not be a lawyer, but I do post in the War Room.

 

[Slick_36]

I may not be a lawyer, but I do post in the War Room.

Yes you do, poorly.

 

[n...not crazy]

I'm against crimes. This encompasses rape, etc AND false accusations. However we can combat both of these at the same time, I'm for it.

 

[Seano]

A necessary step. Too many BS claims that destroy people's lives with no repercussions for the accuser.

 

[Seano]

You are setting up a false choice between no scrutiny and allowing an opposing attorney to cross examine a sexual assault victim.

And your Salem Witch Trial example still sucks, insulting me doesn't help your shit example.

I think the witch trial example is pretty good actually. A lot of people will jump on a false claim if its presented to them in a certain way.

 

[Seano]

Betsy Devos is a stupid person doing stupid shit. If my daughter gets sexually assaulted in college, the dude is getting the Whitey Bulger pad lock in a sock treatment.

What if your son gets accused of sexual assault?

 

[Slick_36]

I have a dream, that one day people who are supposedly better than @Ripskater won't always insult him unprovoked. That one day they'll actually be as good as they claim to be. I have a dream.

The dude is either a troll or the worst kind of Christian who does a disservice to my religion either way. He's hateful to entire groups of people he doesn't know, I call him out personally. There's a difference there and I'm not going to apologize for it.

 

[Seano]

I have a dream, that one day people who are supposedly better than @Ripskater won't always insult him unprovoked. That one day they'll actually be as good as they claim to be. I have a dream.

Rip is better than them all. Never seen the guy say a really harsh word to anyone and yet morons will tag the guy into a thread just to insult him. Awfully clever.