Debate with controversial 17-year-old blue belt Gracie Combatives "head instructor"

[trustdoesntrust]

Alright pump your brakes kid. In 9-12 months at a normal school, you will do your fair share of live rolling. Having trained for about 3 years, most schools have these people:
1) Relentlessly getting to your back and choking you guy.
2) Big dude, side-control, smother you, and kimura/americana guy.
3) Small, fast, triangle you quickly guy.
4) Knee on Belly affection-ado/wrestler, break your soul, and choke you guy.

The biggest take away from beginning BJJ, the "maintaining distance" on the ground is learning how not to get crushed, move before being cornered, how to move forward while having balance. You get that from sparring with lots of different body types, not just light sparring with someone in your garage.

It's like trying to grab someone's sleeve and collar, and magically do a footsweep... because I watched it on youtube and my brother let me do it on him a few times. Try doing that in a Judo school during randori or even a BJJ school that practices stand-up.

You need alot of bodies and failed attempts to make the move work for you, to find your go-to moves, and have skills that work.

I'm glad you mentioned all this, because I hate how this Gracie University BS has shaped the debate as being whether traditional BJJ is worthy or unworthy as "self defense." I would stop training BJJ in a second if it became a daily obsession with some hypothetical street altercation that may never occur; that is not fun, and it trends way too far in the direction of all the self-defense-obsessed BS martial arts like Krav Maga.

 

[lechien]

Alright pump your brakes kid. In 9-12 months at a normal school, you will do your fair share of live rolling. Having trained for about 3 years, most schools have these people:
1) Relentlessly getting to your back and choking you guy.
2) Big dude, side-control, smother you, and kimura/americana guy.
3) Small, fast, triangle you quickly guy.
4) Knee on Belly affection-ado/wrestler, break your soul, and choke you guy.

The biggest take away from beginning BJJ, the "maintaining distance" on the ground is learning how not to get crushed, move before being cornered, how to move forward while having balance. You get that from sparring with lots of different body types, not just light sparring with someone in your garage.

It's like trying to grab someone's sleeve and collar, and magically do a footsweep... because I watched it on youtube and my brother let me do it on him a few times. Try doing that in a Judo school during randori or even a BJJ school that practices stand-up.

You need alot of bodies and failed attempts to make the move work for you, to find your go-to moves, and have skills that work.

Especially when most of their self defense techniques are to take the fight to the ground.
You better be ready to be good on the ground.

 

[yetanother]

My first class ever was on how to correctly do a reaping ankle lock. And take a trip to AoJ, I'm sure those half ass instructors teach berimbolos to their white belts (;

I would bet my money on a lot of the AoJ kids beating the Gracie combatives instructor in a street fight.

 

[Alonbenav]

I would bet my money on a lot of the AoJ kids beating the Gracie combatives instructor in a street fight.

Not if the Gracie Combatives instructors are badass teenage girls!

Boom!

 

[Evan_The_Kid_1]

Please explain your definition of getting "ripped off".

Was Houston not up front, open and honest about what he was offering to teach them?

His customers are paying for programs he is certified to teach, correct?

If you choose to buy a Tesla Model S, instead of a Nissan Leaf, are you getting "ripped off"?

Now if you thought you were paying for a Telsa, but got a Leaf instead, then I would agree that you got "ripped off".

Here's another scenario..

Let's say you are a brand new student with no experience or knowledge of self defense or how to survive a street fight. You choose to join a BJJ school the advertises "Learn Self Defense". However, you spend your first 9-12 months drilling for points, berimbolos, worm guard, DLR, spider guard, footlocks, jumping guard, etc. with little to no consideration for distance management with punch protection.

Regarding a new student's initial desire to learn a martial art for self-defense, IMO this is a more applicable definition of getting "ripped off". You were mislead and didn't receive what you thought you were paying for.

yeah and you spend white to blue in combatives not sparring at all. i would rather do full resistance sparring plus drilling moves over just drilling moves and doing reflex whatever the hells

 

[Questions]

In other news . Several of my traini g partners and Josh Mancuso's did well at the tournament today doing "self defense" style of jiu jitsu ��

 

[Evan_The_Kid_1]

In other news . Several of my traini g partners and Josh Mancuso's did well at the tournament today doing "self defense" style of jiu jitsu ��

cool story bro. when they start to dominate high level competition, let us know.

 

[nooper]

cool story bro. when they start to dominate high level competition, let us know.

The vast majority don't take up BJJ to engage in high level competition. one might even ask if BJJ should actually be about that in the first instance.

 

[TheGZA]

The vast majority don't take up BJJ to engage in high level competition. one might even ask if BJJ should actually be about that in the first instance.

Did you find a gym yet, playboy?

 

[RTD1]

These are the 36 lessons of Gracie Combatives:

1. Trap and Role Escape
2. Americana Armlock
3. Positional Control Mount
4. Take the Back (Mount)
5. Rear Naked Choke
6. Leg Hook Takedown
7. Clinch (Aggressive Opponent)
8. Punch Block Series (Stages 1-4)
9. Straight Armlock (Mount)
10. Triangle Choke
11. Elevator Sweep
12. Elbow Escape (Mount)
13. Positional Control (Side Mount)
14. Body Fold Takedown
15. Clinch (Conservative Opponent)
16. Headlock Counters
17. Double Leg Takedown
18. Headlock Escape 1
19. Straight Armlock (Guard)
20. Double Ankle Sweep
21. Pull Guard
22. Headlock Escape 2
23. Guillotine Choke
24. Shrimp Escape
25. Kimura Armlock
26. Standing Headlock Defense
27. Punch Block Series (Stage 5)
28. Hook Sweep
29. Rear Takedwon
30. Haymaker Punch Defense
31. Take the Back (Guard)
32. Guillotine Defense
33. Elbow Escape (Side Mount)
34. Standing Armlock
35. Twisting Arm Control
36. Double Underhook Guard Pass

Are they seriously claiming that "sport BJJ" places do not teach bridge and roll or elbow escape from mount, americana, pulling guard, rear naked choke, triangle choke, double leg takedown, etc?

Come the fuck on.

 

[lts5025]

These are the 36 lessons of Gracie Combatives:



Are they seriously claiming that "sport BJJ" places do not teach bridge and roll or elbow escape from mount, americana, pulling guard, rear naked choke, triangle choke, double leg takedown, etc?

Come the fuck on.

Sorry bruh, at my school I'm too busy working on my donkey guard to worry about all that shit.

 

[Evan_The_Kid_1]

The vast majority don't take up BJJ to engage in high level competition. one might even ask if BJJ should actually be about that in the first instance.

I get that but wouldn't you want to train the most effective way possible? If you can't beat them in competition, what makes you think you can beat them in a self defense situation?

 

[SBJ]

Click here to join the live chat.​

 

[chunglii]

and here we go!

 

[DCSpartan]

A 17 year old who has been rolling for a few years and has enthusiasm and can realte to kids might make a great youth instructor.

ANy grown adult paying money for "combatives training" to a 17 yeard old gets what they deserve.

I like the Gracies, but you wont see them taking this kid to any of their LE or MIL training . . . .

 

[BJJ_Rage]

s the guy with glasses for real? hes concern that a person thats been training fro six to seven years cant teach a freaking americana well? 7 years is black belt level, a kid whos been training for 7 years is probably much better than a adult whos been traning for 7 years..

 

[kpoz12]

That was horrendous to listen to. I'm gonna go practice my inverted reverse sportive donkeyoplatta now.

Actually, no, nevermind, I want to study for my junior-technical-undergrad blue belt* so that I can wear a 2nd degree karate belt while teaching Muay Thai

*The Junior Technical Undergrad blue belt is a registered trademark of Gracie Jiu Jitsu(*) and is used under licence
*The Gracie Jiu Jitsu name and Gracie Jiu Jitsu logo are trademarks of Rorion gracie and are used by permission under licence.​

 

[BJJ_Rage]

I agree with reners point, not entirely but in most of his points.

edit: I dont agree with his point on savagery and I dont agree sparring is savage at all, I agree with what josh said, I stand for rolling from day 1.

 

[SlamMan]

It's sad and makes me sick. I got my blue by working hard, and competing. I proved I knew what I was doing by winning tournament matches and MMA fights. This is just diluting what is supposed to be an art that is a proving ground as well.

You sound very bitter.

 

[Guy Marcello]

That was horrendous to listen to. I'm gonna go practice my inverted reverse sportive donkeyoplatta now.

Actually, no, nevermind, I want to study for my junior-technical-undergrad blue belt* so that I can wear a 2nd degree karate belt while teaching Muay Thai

*The Junior Technical Undergrad blue belt is a registered trademark of Gracie Jiu Jitsu(*) and is used under licence
*The Gracie Jiu Jitsu name and Gracie Jiu Jitsu logo are trademarks of Rorion gracie and are used by permission under licence.​

Dude you are so ignorant and misinformed. You clearly are trying to be funny, and never studied at Gracie University.

There is no "junior undergrad technical blue belt" that you can study for. There is a technical blue belt, a junior blue belt, and a graduate technical blue belt but you can only get the last two in person by going to Torrance and passing a multiple choice exam with questions such as:

Who invented Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu?

a) Helio Gracie
b) Rorion Gracie's father
c) Rener Gracie's grandfather
d) Definitely not Carlos Gracie

Why doesn't the Gracie Academy believe in tournaments such as the IBJJF?

a) because many techniques don't pass the "Helio Gracie filter"
b) because there are no time limits on "teh streetz"
c) its not because they are not getting a cut of the profits
d) its definitely not because Mark Laimon beat Ryron in a challenge match, or because Rener failed to win the pan ams