Is Neil Melanson legit?

Da Speeit said:
Yes, very. He was the grappling coach at Xtreme Couture for a while as well
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I was found it quite odd that while he was the grappling coach at Xtreme Couture, a large portion of the fighters would go out to train with Drysdale for their grappling and hardly any of the went with Neil

The Thrill said:
from what ive always heard he came up in hayastan and was always legit, he could never compete because of an immune system illness where he could go blind or something if he was stressed too much
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Doesn't make sense to me how you can be too compromised or injured to compete but good enough wreck guys and roll hard in the gym
 
Kforcer said:
Yep, he did. Ironically, I guess a lot of people chalked Jacare's kimura win over him to strength.
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In all seriousness, when's the last time we've seen a smaller guy win via kimura against a much heavier guy? I don't follow sport BJJ all that much.
 
EndlessCritic said:
In all seriousness, when's the last time we've seen a smaller guy win via kimura against a much heavier guy? I don't follow sport BJJ all that much.
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Good question. This isn't quite what you were asking for but Sakuraba successfully utilized Kimuras quite often against much bigger opponents, though he didn't necessarily finish with the Kimura itself but more often with an armbar that he transitioned to from a Kimura. His chokeout of Rampage came at the end of a chain that began with a Kimura takedown.
 
TheMaster said:
He is a student of Karo Parisyan so is legit in that his lineage goes via Gokor and Gene LaBell.

He has no competition credentials though so in that sense he is no more, and no less legit as a catch wrester than Tony Cecchine. They are in the same category.

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There was a lot of controversy around Tony Cecchine around the late 00s to early 10s, but at the end of the day... he really was knowledgeable and showing some of the good shit.

Kind of like Scott Sonnon, some guy of murky provenance comes out ahead of the curve showing things that would eventually be popularized by other guys later in time.
 
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He'd kick my ass in a grappling match.

He came to the gym I was training at around winter/spring 2007 with Karo who did a seminar. Not long after that he seemed to go off on his own.

Not a fan of his style but I am curious about his approach to Turtle for MMA (I saw clips of his concepts years ago).
 
The Thrill said:
from what ive always heard he came up in hayastan and was always legit, he could never compete because of an immune system illness where he could go blind or something if he was stressed too much
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Didn't he lose some of sight and have to get some toes removed because of it?
 
rmongler said:
Somewhat tangential; there was a lot of controversy around Tony Cecchine around the late 00s to early 10s, but at the end of the day... he really was knowledgeable and showing some of the good shit.

Kind of like Scott Sonnon, some guy of murky provenance comes out ahead of the curve showing things that would eventually be popularized by other guys later in time.
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Yes, if I recall it was that 5"4 midget Rogan and his guru Eddie Bravo who were overcompensating in trying to bury Cecchine, a tough and legit mofo with legit submission skills who could also box, wrestle and would have buried either of them in any kind of real fight.

It was also a trend of BJJers trying to discredit anything catch related, a trick which largely worked and then on the sly they later decide to adopt catch techniques with a submission only rules set and all of a sudden we have 'nogi BJJ with leg locks'.
Trickery and marketing at its best.
 
Is Melanson a legit grappler? I would say yes. A legit catch wrestler? Not really.

He got his background in a Bart Vale associated shootfighting gym. In Hayastan he only spent somewhere between 1 to 2 years.

He's been a grappling coach at both Xtreme Couture and then later the Blackzilians. Before he used to call himself a catch wrestler he called his style american jiu jitsu.

He got a lot of great skills and techniques but a majority of them wouldn't work in a catch wrestling match because of the pins. If people want catch wrestling he is the wrong person.
 
TheMaster said:
Yes, if I recall it was that 5"4 midget Rogan and his guru Eddie Bravo who were overcompensating in trying to bury Cecchine, a tough and legit mofo with legit submission skills who could also box, wrestle and would have buried either of them in any kind of real fight.

It was also a trend of BJJers trying to discredit anything catch related, a trick which largely worked and then on the sly they later decide to adopt catch techniques with a submission only rules set and all of a sudden we have 'nogi BJJ with leg locks'.
Trickery and marketing at its best.
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The problem with Tony Cecchine, and I watched a few of his instructional back in the day, is that he shows a lot of dubious or gimmicky moves alongside legitimate techniques. I don't know if this is an issue with Catch itself, having a history intertwined with professional/carnival wrestling, with show holds being taught alongside martially viable techniques or whether it's Tony himself just liking to show exotic moves. It's easy to see him showing something dubious, and throw out the baby with the bathwater.
 
Einheri said:
The problem with Tony Cecchine, and I watched a few of his instructional back in the day, is that he shows a lot of dubious or gimmicky moves alongside legitimate techniques. I don't know if this is an issue with Catch itself, having a history intertwined with professional/carnival wrestling, with show holds being taught alongside martially viable techniques or whether it's Tony himself just liking to show exotic moves. It's easy to see him showing something dubious, and throw out the baby with the bathwater.
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Which techniques did you take to be silly? The stopper toe-hold...? I think that's one that is actually applicable, just not super-common. But it can definitely come up, especially out of a same-side leg-control position, when someone tries to turn out. Anyway, just guessing because that was one of the more "off beat" moves.
 
I did watch some videos with concepts he has as he does have some cool concepts, but do not really know much of him but he used to be a student of Bart Vale and then went to Gokor and Karo.
 
Kforcer said:
Which techniques did you take to be silly? The stopper toe-hold...? I think that's one that is actually applicable, just not super-common. But it can definitely come up, especially out of a same-side leg-control position, when someone tries to turn out. Anyway, just guessing because that was one of the more "off beat" moves.
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It's been a long time since I've watched any of his instructionals, probably last when I was a blue belt back in 2012 or so. I recall raising an eyebrow at some of the techniques he showed, while others were very solid.
 
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