Opinion It is not bigoted to want a homogenized American culture.

[Jack V Savage]

I feel like after the industrial revolution, the west just had a different theme almost every decade, and the culture just kind of swayed with the generations

Let me kno if this is a retarded thought

Good piece by Scott Alexander that relates to this:

https://slatestarcodex.com/2016/07/25/how-the-west-was-won/

I am pretty sure there was, at one point, such a thing as western civilization. I think it included things like dancing around maypoles and copying Latin manuscripts. At some point Thor might have been involved. That civilization is dead. It summoned an alien entity from beyond the void which devoured its summoner and is proceeding to eat the rest of the world.

An analogy: naturopaths like to use the term “western medicine” to refer to the evidence-based medicine of drugs and surgeries you would get at your local hospital. They contrast this with traditional Chinese medicine and Ayurvedic medicine, which it has somewhat replaced, apparently a symptom of the “westernization” of Chinese and Indian societies.

But “western medicine” is just medicine that works. It happens to be western because the West had a technological head start, and so discovered most of the medicine that works first. But there’s nothing culturally western about it; there’s nothing Christian or Greco-Roman about using penicillin to deal with a bacterial infection. Indeed, “western medicine” replaced the traditional medicine of Europe – Hippocrates’ four humors – before it started threatening the traditional medicines of China or India. So-called “western medicine” is an inhuman perfect construct from beyond the void, summoned by Westerners, which ate traditional Western medicine first and is now proceeding to eat the rest of the world.

“Western culture” is no more related to the geographical west than western medicine. People who complain about western culture taking over their country always manage to bring up Coca-Cola. But in what sense is Coca-Cola culturally western? It’s an Ethiopian bean mixed with a Colombian leaf mixed with carbonated water and lots and lots of sugar. An American was the first person to discover that this combination tasted really good – our technological/economic head start ensured that. But in a world where America never existed, eventually some Japanese or Arabian chemist would have found that sugar-filled fizzy drinks were really tasty. It was a discovery waiting to be plucked out of the void, like penicillin. America summoned it but did not create it. If western medicine is just medicine that works, soda pop is just refreshment that works.

...

Here’s what I think is going on. Maybe every culture is the gradual accumulation of useful environmental adaptations combined with random memetic drift. But this is usually a slow process with plenty of room for everybody to adjust and local peculiarities to seep in. The Industrial Revolution caused such rapid change that the process become qualitatively different, a frantic search for better adaptations to an environment that was itself changing almost as fast as people could understand it.

The Industrial Revolution also changed the way culture was spatially distributed. When the fastest mode of transportation is the horse, and the postal system is frequently ambushed by Huns, almost all culture is local culture. England develops a culture, France develops a culture, Spain develops a culture. Geographic, language, and political barriers keep these from intermixing too much. Add rapid communication – even at the level of a good postal service – and the equation begins to change. In the 17th century, philosophers were remarking (in Latin, the universal language!) about how Descartes from France had more in common with Leibniz from Germany than either of them did with the average Frenchman or German. Nowadays I certainly have more in common with SSC readers in Finland than I do with my next-door neighbor whom I’ve never met.

Improved trade and communication networks created a rapid flow of ideas from one big commercial center to another. Things that worked – western medicine, Coca-Cola, egalitarian gender norms, sushi – spread along the trade networks and started outcompeting things that didn’t. It happened in the west first, but not in any kind of a black-and-white way. Places were inducted into the universal culture in proportion to their participation in global trade; Shanghai was infected before West Kerry; Dubai is further gone than Alabama. The great financial capitals became a single cultural region in the same way that “England” or “France” had been a cultural region in the olden times, gradually converging on more and more ideas that worked in their new economic situation.

 

[oldshadow]

no... it was an idea floated around in the 1700's ffs.

Sure thr idea but it came to the forefront in the 60s and the civil rights movement. I guess the country was founded on the idea but in the 60s is when it seems to have started to take hold .

Well that's how I see it, but there is plenty of room for discussion on it.

 

[58miles]

Despite all the fantasy's the USA has never ever had an homogenized culture. Since day one the south behaved as a nation within a nation for example.

 

[tenniswhiz]

The republicans are called bigots for wanting this, but I kind of agree with them on this matter despite having liberal views on other issues.

We can be a country of many races, but if those races don't unify towards a strong foundational culture and ethic, it will lead to Balkanization. This is how every large empire ultimately falls; they over expand and have too many conflicting cultures and ideas within it and eventually population and resources will begin dividing the people into various ethnic groups most often based on language and culture.

For this reason, there is nothing wrong with demanding every citizen of this country assimilate into a generic American culture.

The Republicans don’t “want” this.
They love immigrants too, but a more regulated kind of immigration.

 

[CatchnShoot]

Actually... I'm going to change my mind and say.... sure, it's racist.

The concept seeks to strip individuality of culture from everyone and make them the same.

So now, I'll say stupid & racist.

That said ideas that are progressive in a particular WHEN might become objectionable/problematic down the line. I know that's a hard reality for 2nd amendment nuts to understand, but it's just true. So, I'm not trying to say that whomever came up with the idea was a bozo or anything, I just don't think folks imagined the amount of global emigration, and the hundreds of distinct cultures that are a reality today.... or maybe they did, and they actually thought making everybody the same was a good idea?


NOBODY..... including the founding fathers...is omniscient, & nobody has perfect forethought.
From time to time it behooves a country/a family/ an individual to examine the status quo, re-evaluate your position and adapt to the current reality. In software terms, a sanity check...just to determine if your current operating procedures are still in alignment with your actual goals.

 

[Andy Capp]

Nope. Forcing different cultures to tolerate eachother isn't proof that it works. Just like an engine with a misfire will still function, it doesn't prove engines with misfires are in any way beneficial or good in any way.

"Forced tolerance" is it now? LOL

 

[submerged88]

Sure, at least loosely. It's not really a priority other than a baseline set of values and cultural norms. It does create some problems when we don't all speak the same language or celebrate the same holidays, but I'm kind of in the "do what you want if it's not a crime and isn't harming anybody" camp. Though I can say I'm much more inclined to spend a day in Chinatown than I am in any Haitian neighborhood.



They already have been trying to force that on the people in more than a few countries. Turns out "citizen of the world" and walking on eggshells isn't a set of values, it's just getting rolled over by and subsidizing anyone who shows up who does have an actual culture.

Christ, you clowns get pissed about "gentrification" when too many white people move in and clean up neighborhoods in their own country, but absolutely nothing when it's people from another country doing the same thing but making the neighborhoods worse?

Progressive values and culture come frim white Americans. They are more likely to be the descendants of the union army who defeated the south so they are the dominant group who white people from the south should be subordinate to, right?

 

[CyberRubberDuck]

"Forced tolerance" is it now? LOL

Pretty much yes. Unless you can actually dispute what I'm saying , I'd suggest you jog on. So far you've made 2 replies to me that aren't actually saying anything apart from showing you want to disagree with what I'm saying but without giving a reason.

 

[Prefect]

The republicans are called bigots for wanting this, but I kind of agree with them on this matter despite having liberal views on other issues.

We can be a country of many races, but if those races don't unify towards a strong foundational culture and ethic, it will lead to Balkanization. This is how every large empire ultimately falls; they over expand and have too many conflicting cultures and ideas within it and eventually population and resources will begin dividing the people into various ethnic groups most often based on language and culture.

For this reason, there is nothing wrong with demanding every citizen of this country assimilate into a generic American culture.

White people food sucks ass. That should be enough of a reason to want diversity. My quality of life is better for just having access to good ethnic food than hurt by the fact that my neighbor puts up lights during Diwali. Go live in Oklahoma if you love crappy white people shit. Anyone that talks about diversity hurting things has never lived in the rural Midwest.

 

[CyberRubberDuck]

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/lfc-celebrates-black-history-month

I think you're confusing race with culture kid.

 

[nostradumbass]

Progressive values and culture come frim white Americans. They are more likely to be the descendants of the union army who defeated the south so they are the dominant group who white people from the south should be subordinate to, right?

You been drinking? While we all appreciate a good twisted fantasy, pining for a war 170 years ago that you weren't in doesn't seem too "progressive". And no anyway, "progressives" are just more likely to be mad at their dad for walking out on them.

 

[flektarn]

The republicans are called bigots for wanting this, but I kind of agree with them on this matter despite having liberal views on other issues.

We can be a country of many races, but if those races don't unify towards a strong foundational culture and ethic, it will lead to Balkanization. This is how every large empire ultimately falls; they over expand and have too many conflicting cultures and ideas within it and eventually population and resources will begin dividing the people into various ethnic groups most often based on language and culture.

For this reason, there is nothing wrong with demanding every citizen of this country assimilate into a generic American culture.

Haha man wouldn't some social cohesion and common values be nice? But no, we get self segregation and tribalism. Country isn't a melting pot, it's beef stew.

 

[jk7707]

The greatest human accomplishment of all time was putting a man on the moon. To see how we got there, we need to look at the culture that dominated the landscape the previous 50 years. I say we return to that culture. It was patriarchal, rigid in demands to allegiance to the country and Constitution, very nuclear family based, and very unaccommodating to cultures which were antithetical to the standard. Japan today is like this, and their country is flourishing with little crime. No reason we can't do this in America despite being of different racial background. One country, one culture, many races.

So the early 1900s, when there were ethnic enclaves that were full of people who spoke their native languages and lived around others from their particular European region, in every major US city? That's your "one culture"?

 

[Denter]

Finding a few examples here and there of Native Americans taking slaves is a little bit different than the institutionalized chattel slavery that the US employed on a large scale.

That's true, because nothing the natives did was on a large scale.

 

[58miles]

So the early 1900s, when there were ethnic enclaves that were full of people who spoke their native languages and lived around others from their particular European region, in every major US city? That's you "one culture"?

The problem with with the people who go around talking about this one culture nonsense is that they are pining for an America that only ever existed in their fantasies and not reality.

 

[Darkballs]

America does have a unified culture. That of a nation of immigrants that has existed before it's founding as a nation.

Having some generic ethno state runs contrary to everything this country has ever been.

 

[curryjunkie]

I think you're confusing race with culture kid.

I'm pointing out one of the benefits of multiculturism, a long history of black footballers amongst other things . Plus possibly the greatest thing ever to have graced the shores of Britain.....the curry house..

 

[Iconoclast]

Thanks for proving my point. The instant anyone says something the progressive disagrees with, they're called white nationalists. I'm a Brown man. This has nothing to do with race. It's about culture and wanting to preserve it.

That's the worst uncle Jose. Self hatred is a problem. I'm Brown as well. Get it together homey

 

[Anewt]

White people food sucks ass. That should be enough of a reason to want diversity. My quality of life is better for just having access to good ethnic food than hurt by the fact that my neighbor puts up lights during Diwali. Go live in Oklahoma if you love crappy white people shit. Anyone that talks about diversity hurting things has never lived in the rural Midwest.

What is white people food ?

 

[pinger]

If everybody looked the same we'd get tired of looking at each other