Media Izzy squashes Khamzat rumors

[GluttonforPunishment]

izzy looked like a fish out of water on his back against Jan. He’s just a kickboxer with ok takedown defense, and he hasn’t really faced any wrestlers. Khamzat is probably the most dominant wrestler in UFC right now besides Islam, it wouldn’t end well for him.

We seen what khamzat did to a dominant wrestler in Usman

And youre ignorant and hate black people

 

[ComfortablyNumb55]

Dumb fight for Izzy when he can immediately fight for a title in his return.

 

[VinceArch]

You have yet to show me examples of Kelvin using his elite wrestling in UFC.

We both know he has a great wrestling background, right? The fact he hasn't used it recently is something beyond my control. This has clearly bugged you in some way and I do hope you are able to get over it lol.

 

[chinarice]

We both know he has a great wrestling background, right? The fact he hasn't used it recently is something beyond my control. This has clearly bugged you in some way and I do hope you are able to get over it lol.

Yeah I'm also trying to understand when during his UFC tenure, did Kelvin ever display good wrestling against someone worth a damn? I seriously can't recall a single time.

He got owned by the ghost of Chris Weidman, whose wrestling and grappling and fighting in general has regressed big time.

Just because you were good at wrestling when there's no punching, kicking, elbowing or submissions involved, doesn't mean you're a good wrestler when those things are added to the equation. The only way to make that claim, is to prove it during the fights.

 

[VinceArch]

Yeah I'm also trying to understand when during his UFC tenure, did Kelvin ever display good wrestling against someone worth a damn? I seriously can't recall a single time.

He got owned by the ghost of Chris Weidman, whose wrestling and grappling and fighting in general has regressed big time.

Just because you were good at wrestling when there's no punching, kicking, elbowing or submissions involved, doesn't mean you're a good wrestler when those things are added to the equation. The only way to make that claim, is to prove it during the fights.

Weidman is also much bigger and wasn't quite as broken down as he is now though, have to keep that in mind. His wrestling was good enough to keep a close striking battle between him and Woodley and also against Hendricks and to a lesser extent Kennedy as well. DC has much better wrestling than Kelvin and he couldn't get much going against Stipe so he had to resort to underhanded tactics and he still couldn't beat him. It doesn't make him less of a wrestler for failing to get him down.

 

[chinarice]

Weidman is also much bigger and wasn't quite as broken down as he is now though, have to keep that in mind. His wrestling was good enough to keep a close striking battle between him and Woodley and also against Hendricks and to a lesser extent Kennedy as well. DC has much better wrestling than Kelvin and he couldn't get much going against Stipe so he had to resort to underhanded tactics and he still couldn't beat him. It doesn't make him less of a wrestler for failing to get him down.

He never wrestled with Woodley and neither attempted a takedown during their fight. It was purely a striking match.

DC has proven to be a good wrestler and there are several instances to back that up, in a MMA setting. There's actually a whole lot of instances to back up DC being a good wrestler.

I can't think of a single fight that Kelvin displayed good wrestling. I think his wrestling most likely regressed big time from when his sole focus was wrestling.

On paper doesn't really mean much. If it did, GSP wouldn't have owned all those high level wrestlers he owned during his career.

 

[VinceArch]

He never wrestled with Woodley and neither attempted a takedown during their fight. It was purely a striking match.

That's my point though. Usually when wrestlers are matched up with one another it becomes a striking battle which is what we got. Woodley was usually gunshy throughout his career and wanted to be on top looking for chokes or he was up against the fence looking for that one shot KO. I'm sure if Woodley knew he could keep Kelvin down he would have instead of getting a split decision win in a close contested fight.

 

[chinarice]

That's my point though. Usually when wrestlers are matched up with one another it becomes a striking battle which is what we got. Woodley was usually gunshy throughout his career and wanted to be on top looking for chokes or he was up against the fence looking for that one shot KO. I'm sure if Woodley knew he could keep Kelvin down he would have instead of getting a split decision win in a close contested fight.

I can't recall a single instance where Woodley ever displayed good offensive wrestling during his UFC run.

His defensive wrestling was also highly overrated.

 

[FrankNStein]

Izzy never beat an elite wrestler in his career. Cause there were none at MW. Now we have Khamzat & Bo.

He fought Yoel, who is a far better wrestler than Khamzat. The fight ended up being boring as hell, but people seem to forget that Israel was the one calling out Yoel, even though he was the worst stylistic matchup in the division at the time, and everyone else was trying to avoid him. Yoel was coming off 2 straight losses at the time, Israel didn't have to give him a title shot, he could have easily avoided him, but he wanted to specifically because he was the worst matchup for him in the division.


Same thing with Pereira. He was nowhere near deserving a title shot, but Israel gave him one, even though he already lost twice to him in kickboxing, because he wanted to for his legacy.


I'm not a fan of Israel, but the guy fights all comers. He's never ducked anyone.

 

[Laheys'Liquorland]

Izzy didn't duck anyone and has more title fights than Khamzat has UFC fights.

If you know me you'd know I trash Hamfat more than anyone else. KING DUCK

 

[Jihad-MMA]

He fought Yoel, who is a far better wrestler than Khamzat. The fight ended up being boring as hell, but people seem to forget that Israel was the one calling out Yoel, even though he was the worst stylistic matchup in the division at the time, and everyone else was trying to avoid him. Yoel was coming off 2 straight losses at the time, Israel didn't have to give him a title shot, he could have easily avoided him, but he wanted to specifically because he was the worst matchup for him in the division.


Same thing with Pereira. He was nowhere near deserving a title shot, but Israel gave him one, even though he already lost twice to him in kickboxing, because he wanted to for his legacy.


I'm not a fan of Israel, but the guy fights all comers. He's never ducked anyone.

Likewise with the never ducking part.

 

[Motivated BJ Penn]

Yeah I'm also trying to understand when during his UFC tenure, did Kelvin ever display good wrestling against someone worth a damn? I seriously can't recall a single time.

He got owned by the ghost of Chris Weidman, whose wrestling and grappling and fighting in general has regressed big time.

Just because you were good at wrestling when there's no punching, kicking, elbowing or submissions involved, doesn't mean you're a good wrestler when those things are added to the equation. The only way to make that claim, is to prove it during the fights.

Only time I can remember is in the TUF finals vs Uriah Hall when he grapple fked him. But his defensive wrestling has been complete garbage all his carreer, for a short stocky guy with a wrestling background he should be hard to takedown. But Neil Magny of all people was able to take him down at will.

 

[MRT]

Right? Why did they even give Usman a fight with Khamzat? He should have been fighting the lowest ranked MW on the roster. He absolutely did not deserve a fight with Khamzat, with his 0 wins at MW.

Not a good analogy.

- Usman took that fight on less than two weeks notice, it was not a planned matchup.
- Usman was previously a longtime, dominant WW champion and deserves more consideration in a new division than someone with comparatively much more limited accomplishments, like Khamzat.
- Khamzat was not even highly a ranked at MW, never mind a previous champ like Izzy, so it was hardly some underserved 'privilege' for Usman to fight him...in fact, Usman was saving his spot on the card.

 

[chinarice]

Not a good analogy.

- Usman took that fight on less than two weeks notice, it was not a planned matchup.
- Usman was previously a longtime, dominant WW champion and deserves more consideration in a new division than someone with comparatively much more limited accomplishments, like Khamzat.
- Khamzat was not even highly a ranked at MW, never mind a previous champ like Izzy, so it was hardly some underserved 'privilege' for Usman to fight him...in fact, Usman was saving his spot on the card.

Rankings don't matter and never have. Sean Strickland got a titleshot against Izzy with a couple wins over the great Abus and Nassourdine Imavov.....

Were all the guys ahead of Sean in the rankings asked to fight Izzy? If not, rankings don't matter

 

[MRT]

Rankings don't matter and never have. Sean Strickland got a titleshot against Izzy with a couple wins over the great Abus and Nassourdine Imavov.....

Were all the guys ahead of Sean in the rankings asked to fight Izzy? If not, rankings don't matter

Izzy had already beaten many other contenders or they were injured...having someone lower ranked move up is not such a stretch, given the context.

Khamzat hasn't even faced anyone in the current top 15 of the division...it is hardly out of place to ask that he face a ranked guy or two before anointing him worthy of getting a shot at someone of Izzy's status.

 

[chinarice]

Izzy had already beaten many other contenders or they were injured...having someone lower ranked move up is not such a stretch, given the context.

Khamzat hasn't even faced anyone in the current top 15 of the division...it is hardly out of place to ask that he face a ranked guy or two before anointing him worthy of getting a shot at someone of Izzy's status.

I never said it was out of place.

Who should Izzy fight then? Another rematch? That sounds like crap. The options ahead of Khamzat right now in the ranking are Brendan Allen and Roman Dolidze.

Khamzat could surely beat the same guy Dolidze beat in Hermansson. He already dominated him in wrestling, which is basically how the guy beats people. I guess that will earn him a shot against Izzy.

 

[MRT]

I never said it was out of place.

Who should Izzy fight then? Another rematch? That sounds like crap. The options ahead of Khamzat right now in the ranking are Brendan Allen and Roman Dolidze.

Khamzat could surely beat the same guy Dolidze beat in Hermansson. He already dominated him in wrestling, which is basically how the guy beats people. I guess that will earn him a shot against Izzy.

Why is Khamzat even ranked where he is? For beating Usman? You just said rankings don't matter, so why does he have to fight up? There are 13 other guys in the top 15 besides himself and Izzy. Pick one.

Who someone 'could' beat is not the point. Accomplishments should motivate matchmaking...not potential, not hype.

And I agree with you that 'rankings don't matter' all too often in matchmaking...that's my point...they should. Khamzat should have to EARN a shot at someone like Izzy, IMHO.

 

[chinarice]

Why is Khamzat even ranked where he is? For beating Usman? You just said rankings don't matter, so why does he have to fight up? There are 13 other guys in the top 15 besides himself and Izzy. Pick one.

Who someone 'could' beat is not the point. Accomplishments should motivate matchmaking...not potential, not hype.

And I agree with you that 'rankings don't matter' all too often in matchmaking...that's my point...they should. Khamzat should have to EARN a shot at someone like Izzy, IMHO.

Like I said, he can tool Jack for 3 rounds or finish him inside the 15 min time limit and get that ranking that Dolidze has, seeing as that's his biggest win to date.

Rankings don't matter. Costa is ranked where he is while literally not having a win over anyone on the UFC roster.

 

[MRT]

Like I said, he can tool Jack for 3 rounds or finish him inside the 15 min time limit and get that ranking that Dolidze has, seeing as that's his biggest win to date.

Rankings don't matter. Costa is ranked where he is while literally not having a win over anyone on the UFC roster.

What I care about is merit-based matchmaking...merit stemming from accomplishment, not hypothetical potential or skill sets. Accomplish things, get rewarded. It's that simple. I don't think Khamzat has accomplished enough in the MW division to have earned a fight with Izzy.

I don't obsess much over rankings either as they are too subjective and often only a moderate proxy for accomplishment (as you point out yourself). They also ignore context. In some cases, the 5th ranked guy is deservedly 'next' because the champ has beaten the other four, or injuries sideline them, or whatever.

In this case, it just does not make any sense why Khamzat gets Izzy right now. What happened to working up through a division? It's not like Khamzat has a string of title defenses (or even a bunch of top tier wins!) in an adjacent division to make the case for fast-tracking him at MW.

I would not much care whether Khamzat is unranked, ranked 15, or ranked 5. Sure, maybe he tools every other guy in the division...but we shouldn't decide that on paper...let Khamzat accomplish something to earn a shot at a top guy like former dominant champ Izzy.

 

[chinarice]

What I care about is merit-based matchmaking...merit stemming from accomplishment, not hypothetical potential or skill sets. Accomplish things, get rewarded. It's that simple. I don't think Khamzat has accomplished enough in the MW division to have earned a fight with Izzy.

I don't obsess much over rankings either as they are too subjective and often only a moderate proxy for accomplishment (as you point out yourself). They also ignore context. In some cases, the 5th ranked guy is deservedly 'next' because the champ has beaten the other four, or injuries sideline them, or whatever.

In this case, it just does not make any sense why Khamzat gets Izzy right now. What happened to working up through a division? It's not like Khamzat has a string of title defenses (or even a bunch of top tier wins!) in an adjacent division to make the case for fast-tracking him at MW.

I would not much care whether Khamzat is unranked, ranked 15, or ranked 5. Sure, maybe he tools every other guy in the division...but we shouldn't decide that on paper...let Khamzat accomplish something to earn a shot at a top guy like former dominant champ Izzy.

So you never answered my question. Who should Izzy fight? Another rematch? Cannonier is the only one worth having him fight if that's the case and their first fight was extremely boring.