Ken Shamrock vs Sam Adkins

Hellhammer84 said:
Its so many stories from so many legit guys from that era that describe how much of a destroyer he was in the gym but yet theres alot of controversy surrounding his actual fighting career.
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He had a pretty darn good record in the UFC before he left for pro wrestling. He also did well in Pancrase, but I'm not sure how legit all those fights were. I have serious doubts that Suzuki could submit Ken in 2 minutes in 1995...when neither Royce (rematch) nor Oleg came close to submitting him around the same time.

Most of the controversy happened during Ken's later years (40s to early 50s) when he lost a lot of fights and sometimes appeared to look for a way out of fights. But there's no doubt Ken was one of the world's best fighters circa 1994 to 1996 (the year he left for pro wrestling).
 
mkt said:
He had a pretty darn good record in the UFC before he left for pro wrestling. He also did well in Pancrase, but I'm not sure how legit all those fights were. I have serious doubts that Suzuki could submit Ken in 2 minutes in 1995...when neither Royce (rematch) nor Oleg came close to submitting him around the same time.

Most of the controversy happened during Ken's later years (40s to early 50s) when he lost a lot of fights and sometimes appeared to look for a way out of fights. But there's no doubt Ken was one of the world's best fighters circa 1994 to 1996 (the year he left for pro wrestling).
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I actually recall reading somewhere that Ken admitted a few of his pancrase fights were works
 
Hellhammer84 said:
I actually recall reading somewhere that Ken admitted a few of his pancrase fights were works
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I believe Matt Hume admitted that his fight with Ken in Pancrase was a work. It's pretty obvious when watching it. I think Ken's original opponent had to withdraw last minute and Matt Hume was picked as the guy's replacement to fight Ken. Ken and Matt Hume then decided to basically choreograph a pro wrestling match instead of actually fighting each other. I can't find a legitimate source on this anymore though.
 
Within the Living Death said:
I believe Matt Hume admitted that his fight with Ken in Pancrase was a work. It's pretty obvious when watching it. I think Ken's original opponent had to withdraw last minute and Matt Hume was picked as the guy's replacement to fight Ken. Ken and Matt Hume then decided to basically choreograph a pro wrestling match instead of actually fighting each other. I can't find a legitimate source on this anymore though.
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Was actually an exhibition, Hume got injured before the fight, so they agreed to 'choregraph' it...
 
Within the Living Death said:
I believe Matt Hume admitted that his fight with Ken in Pancrase was a work. It's pretty obvious when watching it. I think Ken's original opponent had to withdraw last minute and Matt Hume was picked as the guy's replacement to fight Ken. Ken and Matt Hume then decided to basically choreograph a pro wrestling match instead of actually fighting each other. I can't find a legitimate source on this anymore though.
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Hume was injured ken worked it to do him a favour
Both got paid
Ken has admitted it as work
 
Hellhammer84 said:
Thats what has always fascinated me most with Ken. Its so many stories from so many legit guys from that era that describe how much of a destroyer he was in the gym but yet theres alot of controversy surrounding his actual fighting career.
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Not really controversy
He was hw champ in UFC and Japan
 
Achilles00 said:
By '03 I think Ken was spent. He was never the same after the first Tito fight. I know he worked Kimo over, but that's not saying a whole lot. I've always been a fan, and I credit Ken with sparking my interest in MMA and I'll always idolize him to some extent, but once his natural athleticism started deteriorating he couldn't keep up with anyone anymore. I mean, he strikes me as a guy who was simply stronger, tougher, and more athletic than most other fighters. He had a limited skill set when most people didn't have any real skill set. But once he couldn't just bully guys anymore, his career fell apart. I think one of his saddest fights was against Pedro Rizzo, who just walked right though him.
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Balanced post
Imo prime ken is top 3 hw today
 
Within the Living Death said:
I believe Matt Hume admitted that his fight with Ken in Pancrase was a work. It's pretty obvious when watching it. I think Ken's original opponent had to withdraw last minute and Matt Hume was picked as the guy's replacement to fight Ken. Ken and Matt Hume then decided to basically choreograph a pro wrestling match instead of actually fighting each other. I can't find a legitimate source on this anymore though.
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Both competed or they didn't t get paid
I don't blame them
 
Lionheart7167 said:
Ken just looked fucking TERRIBLE since he came back from the WWF
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I get what you're saying, but he put on a couple classics after his WWF run in Pride (Frye and Fujita). He should have retired after the Franklin fight, for the sake of his legacy. The Tito fight happened (awesome fight, regardless of how one sided it was) and he was competitive against Franklin - showcased his skill level, but clearly showed his decline. It was truly a passing of the torch of fight.

instead, he kept fighting and became like this bitter rambling old man who probably gets KOed in pillow fights.

Just too bad how the newer fans see him, because he truly could have went down as one of the greats, But he really has no one to blame but himself, for the number of head scratching decisions that he's made pre and post wwf.
 
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electricsheep81 said:
I get what you're saying, but he put on a couple classics after his WWF run in Pride (Frye and Fujita). He should have retired after the Franklin fight, for the sake of his legacy. The Tito fight happened (awesome fight, regardless of how one sided it was) and he was competitive against Franklin - showcased his skill level, but clearly showed his decline. It was truly a passing of the torch of fight.

instead, he became like this bitter rambling old man who probably gets KOed in pillow fights.
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Fights you mentioned was badass
Bet is hard when you're on down side of career and you're fighting a guy in prime
Tito
Ken bet thought he silll had it. Hard to let go
 
electricsheep81 said:
I get what you're saying, but he put on a couple classics after his WWF run in Pride (Frye and Fujita). He should have retired after the Franklin fight, for the sake of his legacy. The Tito fight happened (awesome fight, regardless of how one sided it was) and he was competitive against Franklin - showcased his skill level, but clearly showed his decline. It was truly a passing of the torch of fight.

instead, he became like this bitter rambling old man who probably gets KOed in pillow fights.
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Tito UFC 40 was defo
Even though they fought after that was proper rivalry and ken tried his best at UFC 40
 
Idonotbelieveit said:
Tito UFC 40 was defo
Even though they fought after that was proper rivalry and ken tried his best at UFC 40
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I just really liked that fight, because Ken's jaw was still intact and he could take a punch. He came in there with shot knees and showed more heart, then most fighters you see today. Ken was fighting on pure emotion.
 
electricsheep81 said:
I get what you're saying, but he put on a couple classics after his WWF run in Pride (Frye and Fujita). He should have retired after the Franklin fight, for the sake of his legacy. The Tito fight happened (awesome fight, regardless of how one sided it was) and he was competitive against Franklin - showcased his skill level, but clearly showed his decline. It was truly a passing of the torch of fight.

instead, he kept fighting and became like this bitter rambling old man who probably gets KOed in pillow fights.

Just too bad how the newer fans see him, because he truly could have went down as one of the greats, But he really has no one to blame but himself, for the number of head scratching decisions that he's made pre and post wwf.
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Ken was already out of his Prime when he signed with Pride...

tbh, his leglock attempt vs Franklin was pretty lame, hard to recognize Pancrase Ken...
 
electricsheep81 said:
I just really liked that fight, because Ken's jaw was still intact and he could take a punch. He came in there with shot knees and showed more heart, then most fighters you see today. Ken was fighting on pure emotion.
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Yep
Rogan commentary was awesome too "ken shamrock has the heart of a lion "
 
gono btw said:
Ken was already out of his Prime when he signed with Pride...

tbh, his leglock attempt vs Franklin was pretty lame, hard to recognize Pancrase Ken...
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He tried it , rolling leg lock he did catch him just not fully locked in . Not bad for 41
He put rich on crutches for 2 weeks
 
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