Mayweather vs. Ortiz September 17 (don't start new threads)

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Cracky said:
I think Mosely was pretty much right in front of May the whole fight.. trying to use upper body movement and clenching to slow the tide of Mayweather's assault.. I thought that performance was every bit as aggressive as his performance against Ortiz.. I thought he rattled Mosley much more than he rattled Ortiz(yes I know he knocked Ortiz out, but Im talking about while each was actively engaged in the fight)..his aggression actually seemed to shock Mosley.. and take his courage.. as if Mosley only came to the dance with one plan and that plan had just failed miserably. He was actually telling Mosley to fight a few times because Mosley was trying like hell to slow the pace of the bout..lol.. Yeah that fight impressed the hell out of me.. Maybe it was the fact that Ortiz was on his toes and using good upper body movement and lateral movement that was giving May a few issues.. dunno. Like I said, I just had never seen him miss like that.. at least not while he was a champ.

I agree with Seano that he was using the jab as a range finder a bit, but I also saw him miss badly with the jab, the right, and the hook on multiple occasions.. and perhaps because he was trying to be the May from the 90's, but is pulling the trigger a bit more slowly these days.


Also, Seano Mosley is decent defensively.. he uses angles and clenching to hold most of his opponents to 25% or less.. that aint too bad... kind of hopkins esque with the holds.. swings for the fences, and clenches before he gets the bill
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He might have come at him with the same aggression, but that doesn't mean he fought him the same way. Like you said Mosley was intentionally trying to slow down the pace of the fight and that prevented Mayweather from throwing combinations. Mosley changed the way Floyd fights because that's how Floyd fights; by adapting.

The compubox numbers don't lie about Mayweather's jump in output. If you saw him miss more, it's because he was punching more (regardless of why he was punching more).

In the first (almost) 4 rounds against Ortiz Floyd threw 208 punches.
In the first 4 rounds against Mosley he threw 125.

He didn't give Ortiz the feeling out period he gave Mosley either. Even in the last 4 rounds when he was the most active against Mosley he threw 190, and that was because Mosley wasn't throwing back and when he did Floyd had 8 previous rounds to figure him out.

When he came out to Ortiz he hadn't figured him out yet (at least in the first person), but you can see as the rounds progressed he was timing him well. If that fight continues past the 4th I don't see Floyd becoming anything except more accurate, but probably with similar output.
 
FROM ESPN DAN RAFAEL


Tim (San Fran)


Dan i have a feeling Mayweather vs Ortiz has done over 1.5 million buys. Would this suprise you? And would you change your mind on Pacquiao vs Mayweather getting 50-50 purses the figures were over 1.5?


Dan Rafael
(12:38 PM)


Based on what Schaefer and HBO are telling me the fight has no chance to hit that number.




Patrick (NYC)


Pro-Mayweather sites are reporting 1.3 million ppv buys for Mayweather-Ortiz. Any truth to that?


Dan Rafael
(1:04 PM)


Sites can report whatever they want but is only speculation as there are NO official reports yet.
 
TexasDrugAddict said:
@Cracky

Floyd was missing with the jab on pruposed, that way Ortiz would keep slipping to the left and Floyd could crack him with the right, that couldnt miss. It was all part of his master plan, that you cant seem to grasp. He was setting traps, like when he would back up to the ropes for no reason, it was to give ortiz a false confindice, so that way he would keep coming forward and keep him for shelling up in the later rds and making it harder for floyd to get the KO. Floyd was playing Chess while Ortiz was Checkers. You will learn,that why your here to learn and We will teach you.:)
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mmmmmmmyeah.. a jab to the nose sets up the right better than a jab to the air beside somebodies head.. Even if I bought that, FLoyd was missing so bad that he was out of position which would negate the purpose of purposely missing

Also, when he went to the ropes, he wasn't countering off of them as well as Im used too.. he was ducking and dodging and trying to spin off.. I think he wanted to be in the middle of the ring.
 
KyleInAction said:
He might have come at him with the same aggression, but that doesn't mean he fought him the same way. Like you said Mosley was intentionally trying to slow down the pace of the fight and that prevented Mayweather from throwing combinations. Mosley changed the way Floyd fights because that's how Floyd fights; by adapting.

The compubox numbers don't lie about Mayweather's jump in output. If you saw him miss more, it's because he was punching more (regardless of why he was punching more).

In the first (almost) 4 rounds against Ortiz Floyd threw 208 punches.
In the first 4 rounds against Mosley he threw 125.

He didn't give Ortiz the feeling out period he gave Mosley either. Even in the last 4 rounds when he was the most active against Mosley he threw 190, and that was because Mosley wasn't throwing back and when he did Floyd had 8 previous rounds to figure him out.

When he came out to Ortiz he hadn't figured him out yet (at least in the first person), but you can see as the rounds progressed he was timing him well. If that fight continues past the 4th I don't see Floyd becoming anything except more accurate, but probably with similar output.
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Good points... I do think.. and have stated in the past that Mays accuracy is closely tied to the way he slows a fight down.. made the analogy of "making a turn at 100 miles per hour compared to 30".

He better drive slow if he fights Pac...lol
 
I'm thinking we all just forget about getting a source for PPV buys on May-Ortiz and take the high 1.8 million estimate. Know why? Well the UFC 135 ppv buyrate is said to be 400-500k. Know how they got that? From Dana? No. From Meltzer? No. If you guessed from some big MMA fan who ran his own pole on twitter asking his buddies how many buys it would get, then you'd be right. That's it. When the UFC don't release any news about PPV buys their fans are willing to accept the words of some twit who ran his own pole USING MMA FANS as the base. What a fucking joke. And here we are waiting on something from HBO. May Ortiz got 1.8 million buys and that's that.
 
Wanderlei4Life said:
FROM ESPN DAN RAFAEL


Tim (San Fran)


Dan i have a feeling Mayweather vs Ortiz has done over 1.5 million buys. Would this suprise you? And would you change your mind on Pacquiao vs Mayweather getting 50-50 purses the figures were over 1.5?


Dan Rafael
(12:38 PM)


Based on what Schaefer and HBO are telling me the fight has no chance to hit that number.




Patrick (NYC)


Pro-Mayweather sites are reporting 1.3 million ppv buys for Mayweather-Ortiz. Any truth to that?


Dan Rafael
(1:04 PM)


Sites can report whatever they want but is only speculation as there are NO official reports yet.
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That's not on his twitter where did you see this?
 
Didn't know about that at all. Cheers.
Saw this there where he explains the delay. Long story short it definitely did over 1 million buys and those rumours about poor sales are a load of crap.

Dan-
I have been in touch with Schaefer and HBO regularly. They simply do not have enough data yet from some huge systems to make an accurate report of the numbers. What people dont realize is that when numbers are announced they are done based on years of experience and extrapalation of numbers based on comparing fights to other similar fights and totals in certain markets. For whatever reason this fight has been harder than others. That said both Schaefer and HBO, without saying a specific number they do not have yet, both have told me that without question the fight is well over 1 million buys. The big question is how much over. They want to announce a number that they believe will be close enough to the real number and since it may be 1.3 or more and edge close to 2nd all-time non heavyweight they want to be right. By the same token, it could be 1.2 or 1.25 and not hit 1.3. They just want to be correct from what they both tell me. But the rumors and innuendo that it did poorly is just a load of crap.
 
ZroC said:
I'm thinking we all just forget about getting a source for PPV buys on May-Ortiz and take the high 1.8 million estimate. Know why? Well the UFC 135 ppv buyrate is said to be 400-500k. Know how they got that? From Dana? No. From Meltzer? No. If you guessed from some big MMA fan who ran his own pole on twitter asking his buddies how many buys it would get, then you'd be right. That's it. When the UFC don't release any news about PPV buys their fans are willing to accept the words of some twit who ran his own pole USING MMA FANS as the base. What a fucking joke. And here we are waiting on something from HBO. May Ortiz got 1.8 million buys and that's that.
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The fight did 1.8 mil buys?? :icon_lol:
 
Cracky said:
mmmmmmmyeah.. a jab to the nose sets up the right better than a jab to the air beside somebodies head.. Even if I bought that, FLoyd was missing so bad that he was out of position which would negate the purpose of purposely missing

Also, when he went to the ropes, he wasn't countering off of them as well as Im used too.. he was ducking and dodging and trying to spin off.. I think he wanted to be in the middle of the ring.
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nope, donaire on radio was talking how he does the same thing with the jab to set up the right.
 
elbowsmash said:
nope, donaire on radio was talking how he does the same thing with the jab to set up the right.
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Maybe it would encourage an inside slip????? but against a right handed southpaw, it's more likely to encourage an outside slip.. which takes steam off the right.

But, who knows why he was missing.. maybe you guys are right.. I just don't see why somebody would miss so badly that they were often out of position as a result on purpose
 
Floyd Mayweather vs. Victor Ortiz reportedly does 850,000 Pay-per-view Buys

By Dan Ambrose: The fight between Floyd Mayweather Jr. and WBC welterweight champion Victor Ortiz last month was supposed to have brought in huge numbers on pay per view, according to their promoter Richard Schaefer of Golden Boy Promotions.

Schaefer predicted the fight would bring in between 1.4 million to 1.7 million PPV buys. However, Steve Kim is reporting that the Mayweather-Ortiz fight brought in only 850,000 PPV buys, which is rather sad given the popularity of Mayweather and all the hype and marketing that went into the Mayweather-Ortiz fight. HBO put together one of their 24/7 series for this fight, and it was advertised constantly on cable. If 850,000 is the best it brought in with all that marketing than it is truly sad.
Kim said this on his twitter: “I’ve heard as low as 850,000. Still no PPV figures released for the Mayweather-Ortiz yet, which is very telling.”

This isn’t good, is it? If all Mayweather vs. Ortiz brought in was a paltry 850,000 for this fight, it’s going to put Mayweather in a bad bargaining position with Manny Pacquiao, if he ever decides to fight him. With the exception of his fight against Joshua Clottey last year, which brought in only 700,000 PPV buys, Pacquiao has been selling over 1 million PPV buys for each of his fights since then.

It will be hard for Mayweather to ask for equal footing in the bargaining table if he’s bringing in low figures like that against a fighter as well known as Ortiz is with the casual boxing fans. It could be the economy in addition to the high price of the Mayweather-Ortiz card scared away a lot of boxing fans from buying the fight. Or it could be they just saw it as a hopeless mismatch and figured Ortiz didn’t have a chance and why pay to see a mismatch?

Floyd Mayweather vs. Victor Ortiz reportedly does 850,000 Pay-per-view Buys


searching for more info from a better site to see if it's true...
 
I actually hope that the industry takes this as a sign that they need to bring hd ppv's back down to the 59.99 price point... if it's legit that is.

"RT @MediWarrior: i heard that you said May-Ortiz only sold 850k? - no, that's what a source told me. I believe it did right around a mill"

kims latest tweet.. so nothing concrete then..back to the waiting game
 
why aren't there any concrete numbers yet? it's almost been a month.
 
Looshbob said:
why aren't there any concrete numbers yet? it's almost been a month.
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Same for UFC 135. I don't think the time of release ever crossed over into another event before.
 
Garcia warned Cortez that Ortiz would retaliate against Mayweather
by Lem Satterfield
Oct 13th, 2011

RingTV.com: What are your thoughts on the intentional headbutt?

DG: Yeah, well, he headbutted him because I told Joe Cortez right before the fight in the dressing room that might happen.

RingTV.com: That Victor would headbutt him?

DG: Well, I told him that, "You're a good referee, you have a lot of experience, and I really like the way that you do your job. But please, please keep in mind that Floyd Mayweather throws a lot with the elbows."

I told him that I don't want a dirty fight, because Victor's going to fight a good clean fight. But I told him, "if you don't take a point from Floyd or something and control his elbows and stop him from fighting dirty, then Victor's going to do something wrong too."

RingTV.com: You told Cortez that?

DG: I told him that Victor is going to throw a low blow or a headbutt. I told him that, yes, in front of Victor. Within the first four rounds, Victor was getting hit with elbows two or three times good in the mouth
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Full article here: Garcia warned Cortez that Ortiz would retaliate against Mayweather | RingTV
 
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