Media Michael jai white need a ego check

Finally a well thought out response.

I seem to feel that MJW def is a martial artist, and therefore entirely within the realm of possibility he could do well and win a few UFC fights. Without much proof as to where his skills lie in a more real based fighting style such as MMA there are def doubts, and well founded.

I think what drove peoplke are the first few pages where people were vehemently saying MJW would kill Perry and be a top ten fighter. There's one thing to admit hay, maybe with a training regime dedicated to MMA he could do fairly well, but come out saying he'd walk in and destroy fools, that got people riled up
Def ridiculous to say he'd do well or not since none of us have seen him fight. But he claims he's sparred with UFC guys and boxers and still seems confident. He is an actor so it could be all an act. But I think his speed and technique and experience actually fighting on the streets gives him a decent chance at least.

But yeah, most of the world is ridiculous in so many ways, lol. So many ways.
 
What you’re missing is that it doesn’t take a decade of boxing to be able to throw a jab. Or a hook. Or to show footwork around a bag. To sit on your punches. To distribute your weight appropriately. To show balance. To pivot. It really doesn’t.

what does take a long time is to be able to maintain all of those fundamentals against another person trained to apply those same fundamentals against you.

What takes a long time is knowing how to adapt your techniques depending on the skillsets of your opponent.

what takes a long time is learning how defense and offense work together. How spacing works. How to set up attacks.

you see none of that. You see a jab. And a cross. And dancing around a heavy bag.
Nobody suggested it took a decade. But you can certainly tell when someone has put in the time.

I'm not just seeing a jab, cross and dancing around the heavy bag. I've made that clear. As I said, we expose ourselves with every movement demonstrated. For better or worse. There are also levels to everything. You speak as if every technique and attribute shown are created equal.

The point isn't that he is some truly elite boxer. he isn't. However, he certainly has some skill and respect for boxing in a very purist way, which is uncommon among those with a predominantly karate / traditional base.

Ultimately his traditional background is still his defining attribute.

How that translates to a real fight CAN be another animal entirely and I've made that clear so I don't see why you're still arguing, as if I've suggested otherwise.

I would add that the kyokushin point fighting style generally excellent at moving in and out, spacing / distance management in a very chess like manner, balance, center of gravity tends to be very good, excellent posterior chain and trunk movement, footwork, ability to fight off the back foot which lends itself well to both countering ability and avoiding damage. Utilizing kicks, like the teep / side kick etc as a means of measuring and controlling the range and stifling their opponents offense.

based on what we've seen overall, presumably MJW has many of those same elements to his style.

Typically when the effectiveness of a traditional martial artist is questioned, it's because they've learned many techniques that simply aren't tangible in the real world. There is a very real track record for the style and skill set he brings to the table having success, even bringing MMA fighters to the highest level of a sport.

That doesn't necessarily mean he's guaranteed to have that warrior energy in him, How well he's capable of taking a punch, reacting to being hit, etc.

However long ago it was, he has competed and presumably a lot more than just that singular video. He knows what that feels like. he has the ability to spar with elite MMA fighters any time he wants and likely does so based on what we've seen and heard.

So, to suggest this is a person who would be completely foreign to what it feels like seems a bit illogical.

On paper, the tools are there. elements of his style have a proven track record for tangible success. The only real question is his toughness. Does he have the same sort of dog in him that Perry does. We really don't know.

Someone like that utterly embarrassing a fighter like Perry wouldn't be crazy by any stretch of the imagination however.
 
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Def ridiculous to say he'd do well or not since none of us have seen him fight. But he claims he's sparred with UFC guys and boxers and still seems confident. He is an actor so it could be all an act. But I think his speed and technique and experience actually fighting on the streets gives him a decent chance at least.

But yeah, most of the world is ridiculous in so many ways, lol. So many ways.
I can respect it

You acknowledge the possibility and pay respect to his skills as a martial artist.

Very few people have attempted to acknowledge both sides / possibilities. Feels like So many just go to some extreme.

So it's refreshing to see a more balanced take.
 
Finally a well thought out response.

I seem to feel that MJW def is a martial artist, and therefore entirely within the realm of possibility he could do well and win a few UFC fights. Without much proof as to where his skills lie in a more real based fighting style such as MMA there are def doubts, and well founded.

I think what drove peoplke are the first few pages where people were vehemently saying MJW would kill Perry and be a top ten fighter. There's one thing to admit hay, maybe with a training regime dedicated to MMA he could do fairly well, but come out saying he'd walk in and destroy fools, that got people riled up
Lol yeah I'm gonna go ahead and blame myself for most of this thread

usually not that much of a dickhead as early on in the thread.
 
Ok, cool.

It was well spoken.

Not surprised though.

Only thing you've done throughout this thread is expose yourself. May as well continue the trend.
There was only one of us exposed here bud
 
Bruce Lee believed in cross training arts long before mma was ever around.

He respected elite boxers, even trained and garnered respect from them. Trained with Gene lebell, trained in wrestling and other martial arts.

He was a pioneer in his martial arts philosophies and ahead of his time in many ways.

anyone who doesn't respect that is just clueless, probably not even a martial artist themselves and needs to shut the fuck up.
<RomeroSalute>
 
It's been awesome and entertaining

You make some quality points, but people don't want to comprehend a pro fighter can lose

It's possible
I don't think that's the issue at all. Like stated before, the issue here is gut feeling and conjecture versus proven track records. Hard evidence should and must always prevail over gut feeling and conjecture, it's that simple. Jai white has done nothing to provide any evidence he can actually fight, not ever. Perry and the other examples mentioned in this thread have. You can argue about nuances and footage of hitting a bag but that's what it boils down to. Like Bolo said "brick not hit back". You put "bag" where brick is and that's all that footage will ever amount to.

So far it's just been 40 plus pages of mildly entertaining and paragraph-long posts of " I think he can fight but I'm not sure".
 
I can respect it

You acknowledge the possibility and pay respect to his skills as a martial artist.

Very few people have attempted to acknowledge both sides / possibilities. Feels like So many just go to some extreme.

So it's refreshing to see a more balanced take.
You know, I've noted that the ability of ppl to debate without it becoming emotional has suffered and diminished with time, over my own lifetime. The way ppl debated 20 yrs ago is almost extinct. Now everything is "all in" - it's to defend your position at ANY cost and to be emotional at others critiquing it.

We don't debate to learn or broaden or inform our views anymore - in fact most ppl don't even believe it's possible anymore. They believe the "other side" is "wrong" and they are "right" and furthermore, that the other side are "idiots/morons/tools/asswipes/etc" for having an opinion that differs from theirs.

I think the powers that be have worked their magic on us through constant conditioning from all angles until they've produced an animal like population who reduce complex potentialities and overlapping perspectives down to caricatured certainties and then get emotionally attached to these simplifications at the cost of respecting their common man. All we respect is our simplistic ideas these days and the emotions informing them. And others who echo them back to us.

Humanity is in a sad state. And, brother, the fact that you can so clearly see the difference between real debate (including consideration of both sides of an argument, and the value of those both sides) and emotional "proving" shows you have not come as strong under the modern spell of divide, coerce, and conquer, as most of us have.

So good on you man. You're an upright man in a world full of mental animals and automatons.
 
There was only one of us exposed here bud
My friend, you ignored about 90% of the points made and refused to consider the possibilities / implications of what I presented at any point.

Your points were incoherent, muddied, confused, which made it obvious you have some issues with reading comprehension.

On top of that, you asked me for a response for clarification, I spent a long time breaking down my thought process respectfully and you didn't even bother to read it.

You wonder why I still bring up the hydroxycloroquine thread where I first met you? You perpetually sided with whatever mainstream source was being presented. You ignored any contradictory evidence, sources, documents and didn't even bother to do your own research. Just piggy backed off other people's ideas.

Yet you felt an incessant need to chime in. In spite of clearly being completely out of your element.

You're doing much of the same here. This has never been about the truth for you. It's about challenging me, playing a contrarian game and trying to find ways to make me wrong.

you exposed yourself as someone who can't be taken seriously in any kind of intelligent discussion since day 1 and you're continually proving it.
 
"Guessing"

Says it all right there.

Sure, being able to feel someone out plays a factor.

But as I stated in my last few long posts, there are a great many factors being considered which contribute to my stance on the matter.

and again, unless you are smarter than the person in question, utilizing the Dunning Kruger effect to explain away what a person is saying.

There's been a few people who are either fighters or martial artists that seemed to see where I was coming from. So, there is a method to my madness. You call it the Dunning Kruger effect because you simply don't understand what's being seen.

To a person who doesn't have legitimate experience, knowledge, a tangible foundation and you hear such things, it's understandable you think a person is talking out of their ass.

When the issue truly lies with you.
You are FAR from the only person here with experience and training, and yet almost everyone partaking in this discussion has told you how delusional you've been here.

There comes a time when you have to think, maybe there's a reason everyone keeps telling me I'm being unreasonable...but hey, clearly this isn't going to get through to you, so have fun kid.
 
You are FAR from the only person here with experience and training, and yet almost everyone partaking in this discussion has told you how delusional you've been here.

There comes a time when you have to think, maybe there's a reason everyone keeps telling me I'm being unreasonable...but hey, clearly this isn't going to get through to you, so have fun kid.
never said I was

I started off rough in this thread.

But I've constructed some good arguments, articulated my stance well enough, with a far more respectful tone in the latter portion of the thread.

I'd say, at the very least I've demonstrated that I can acknowledge both sides, as well as some of the grey areas in between.

And more than a few seem to get where I'm coming from. I would say I've been more than reasonable as of late.

Doesn't sound like you're contributing much, other than telling me how delusional I am or suggesting I believe I'm smarter than I actually am but doing nothing to back up that statement.

if you can prove otherwise, free free.

Otherwise, it's just empty words.

There is truth in the minority, just because group think might go against an idea or philosophy doesn't suddenly give it more validity. People here have a habit of following what is more widely believed, absolving themselves from any critical or independent thought of their own. There is a sort of niche lost on people like this.
 
Nobody suggested it took a decade. But you can certainly tell when someone has put in the time.

I'm not just seeing a jab, cross and dancing around the heavy bag. I've made that clear. As I said, we expose ourselves with every movement demonstrated. For better or worse. There are also levels to everything. You speak as if every technique and attribute shown are created equal.

The point isn't that he is some truly elite boxer. he isn't. However, he certainly has some skill and respect for boxing in a very purist way, which is uncommon among those with a predominantly karate / traditional base.

Ultimately his traditional background is still his defining attribute.

How that translates to a real fight CAN be another animal entirely and I've made that clear so I don't see why you're still arguing, as if I've suggested otherwise.

I would add that the kyokushin point fighting style generally excellent at moving in and out, spacing / distance management in a very chess like manner, balance, center of gravity tends to be very good, excellent posterior chain and trunk movement, footwork, ability to fight off the back foot which lends itself well to both countering ability and avoiding damage. Utilizing kicks, like the teep / side kick etc as a means of measuring and controlling the range and stifling their opponents offense.

based on what we've seen overall, presumably MJW has many of those same elements to his style.

Typically when the effectiveness of a traditional martial artist is questioned, it's because they've learned many techniques that simply aren't tangible in the real world. There is a very real track record for the style and skill set he brings to the table having success, even bringing MMA fighters to the highest level of a sport.

That doesn't necessarily mean he's guaranteed to have that warrior energy in him, How well he's capable of taking a punch, reacting to being hit, etc.

However long ago it was, he has competed and presumably a lot more than just that singular video. He knows what that feels like. he has the ability to spar with elite MMA fighters any time he wants and likely does so based on what we've seen and heard.

So, to suggest this is a person who would be completely foreign to what it feels like seems a bit illogical.

On paper, the tools are there. elements of his style have a proven track record for tangible success. The only real question is his toughness. Does he have the same sort of dog in him that Perry does. We really don't know.

Someone like that utterly embarrassing a fighter like Perry wouldn't be crazy by any stretch of the imagination however.
Yes, you can tell he put in the time to learn how to hit a bag with some technique and athleticism. Again, it’s not very unique. Or even hard.

C’mon. The only real question is his toughness????? I just explained that demonstrating technique is only part of “fighting technique”. It’s a lot more than just toughness. It’s not “toughness” that teaches you how to effectively react to your opponents movements. It’s not toughness that teaches you how to be composed against a threat. Its’ not toughness that maintains your technique under duress. It’s not toughness that teaches you to adapt your style against other styles, to adapt your style based on the physical characteristics of your opponent. Experience teaches you those things. Not drills. Again, you cant see any of those things in ANY video of him ever. 1987 gym video notwithstanding. You just have him talking confidently.

And yes, some elements of the fighting style have proven effective for a few fighters who dedicated their lives for years to become elite mma fighters. Wonderboy was more than 5 years removed from kickboxing before he was a real threat as an mma fighter.

Mjw is just another black belt martial artist. He’s about 6’ tall. He’s not some giant of a man. Oh, right....he talks confidently......and oh yeah, he gets paid in part to look like a superhero and to portray himself as a real life superhero.

Again, the chances he can actually effectively apply his technique against real fighters who train to actually fight full time isn’t 0. But it’s going to be pretty small.

Note I do respect you acknowledging your faults in this thread and I am not trying to bash you.
 
Silly me. I thought we were just talking about a 1-1 fight. Not war.

Fights. Not sports.

Whether it's one or many.

Nevertheless that's why athletes attempt psychological strategy (get your opponent emotional, or break him mentally).
 
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I don't understand the full beef between these two...but having watched what he said here...failing to see what's so outrageous about what he said?
 
What you’re missing is that it doesn’t take a decade of boxing to be able to throw a jab. Or a hook. Or to show footwork around a bag. To sit on your punches. To distribute your weight appropriately. To show balance. To pivot. It really doesn’t.

what does take a long time is to be able to maintain all of those fundamentals against another person trained to apply those same fundamentals against you.

What takes a long time is knowing how to adapt your techniques depending on the skillsets of your opponent.

what takes a long time is learning how defense and offense work together. How spacing works. How to set up attacks.

you see none of that. You see a jab. And a cross. And dancing around a heavy bag.




bro! He told kimbo to touch his hand. And kimbo could not touch his hand. that is some ninja shit
 
Imagine thinking perfect looking kicks for cinema translate to elite mma striking skills



Bet you guys think Frank Dux and his 15 black belts is the uncrowned GOAT
It does take a lot of practice and martial arts training in order to obtain good kicks. Not picking sides just making an observation.
 
What you’re missing is that it doesn’t take a decade of boxing to be able to throw a jab. Or a hook. Or to show footwork around a bag. To sit on your punches. To distribute your weight appropriately. To show balance. To pivot. It really doesn’t.

what does take a long time is to be able to maintain all of those fundamentals against another person trained to apply those same fundamentals against you.

What takes a long time is knowing how to adapt your techniques depending on the skillsets of your opponent.

what takes a long time is learning how defense and offense work together. How spacing works. How to set up attacks.

you see none of that. You see a jab. And a cross. And dancing around a heavy bag.

Yep. A guy who's only trained for a month even can look good on the heavy bag and look like a world beater. Put him in the ring against someone and it's different.

edit: there's a lot of gamers here on sherdog so in case anyone doesn't get it.. think of Tekken or street fighter. You can learn a combo that does like 100% damage and not once will you probably ever hit it on anyone who's actually good at the game.
 
Def ridiculous to say he'd do well or not since none of us have seen him fight. But he claims he's sparred with UFC guys and boxers and still seems confident. He is an actor so it could be all an act. But I think his speed and technique and experience actually fighting on the streets gives him a decent chance at least.

But yeah, most of the world is ridiculous in so many ways, lol. So many ways.

2:38. bisping says he was thoroughly impressed, and he kicks fast as hell. bisping implied that vs a striker he could do very well. so you're totally on point.
 

2:38. bisping says he was thoroughly impressed, and he kicks fast as hell. bisping implied that vs a striker he could do very well. so you're totally on point.

Well there you have it. Ppl will still hate on saying anything complimentary about his fight chances because he chose to make mills acting instead of damaging his body and brain.
 
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