The (DYEL Status) Pub

[ballhawkdawk]

I agree it was a rubbish article, I just threw it in there as it was referencing Lomu in the context of the NFL.
LZD put it well earlier; it's unlikely that anyone outside of the US would end up in the NFL, that doesn't mean that they're inferior athletes.

Not by any means. I do think that the NFL is the most athleticism driven sport on the planet, so most of the focus is on being a well-rounded athlete. There's a high level of skill involved, but skill isn't the center of the sport like it is with many other sports throughout the world. If the NFL existed elsewhere and there was an equal emphasis on agility and leaping ability and such, I'm sure other countries would produce some pretty ridiculous all around athletes. Under the right guidance, Lomu had the potential to be a star in the NFL if he chose to go that route. He wouldn't be anything the NFL hasn't seen before, but he'd still be an upper echelon talent. Even some of those guys washout though because there is still a skill component, and some of the most athletic guys lack the skill or discipline to not flake out.

 

[JimRussel]

Like Brock Lesnar. He couldn't crack the Vikings roster, iirc.

 

[JudoChop!]

I wrote some lengthy rebuttal as to why you guys are so far off base. Of course as soon as I hit "Submit Reply" I got kicked out of Sherdog, then my browser timed out. But after typing all of that I came to this relization...

Without a scientifically defined set of criteria and weighting as to what makes up "Athleticism" this argument is ridiculous.

One could easily point out instances such as the fact that former NFL elite athlete Shaw Marriman gave American Ninja Warrior a shot, and didnt make it half way through the first round. Surely such an elite athlete should be able to finish the first round right? Also, one of the Hamm brothers gave Ninja Warrior a try, and aced the first round until he got to the warped wall. He was too tired to make it up. Being that Hamm made it further than Marriman does that mean Hamm is a better athlete? Possibly, but not definitively. Maybe Hamm is just better at obstacle courses than Merriman, just like Merriman is better bench pressing than Hamm.

Who fucking knows. I dont, and neither do you.

 

[NurseKnuckles]

Honestly Doc, I think the TM set-up is pretty decent on its own.

Is your bench really that important to focus on? TM or madcow, will increase your bench, but at a much slower pace than smolov, or some russion PL program. Something is probably better than what you're doing now.

My elbows are my weakness. When I bench more, my elbows hurt more. Something I'm not willing to go through since my elbow health is important to my squat.

 

[ssdd]

From Friday, talking about a Texas Method style progression vs. heavy/light/medium for my bench:


Any thoughts?

The original program uses 5x5 but I've had good success with 3x5 in the past. The gist of it is this:

Mon: 3x5, sets across
Wed: lighter day (the original program is 2x5 @ 80% of Monday's weight, I'm doing 5 sets of push-ups)
Fri: Work up to heavy singles, doubles, or triples, trying for PRs every week.

Instead I was thinking of doing 3x5 sets across @ 90% of Monday's weight on Friday. So basically a heavy/light/medium setup. So instead of doing 3-5 heavy reps I'll be doing 15 moderately heavy reps.

Push ups are no substitute for benching on Wednesday. Those 2 sets are probably what makes the volume adequate over the course of the whole week. If you're going to leave them out, go back to 5x5 on monday. Cutting down monday AND Wednesday is really butchering that program.

 

[JudoChop!]

Like Brock Lesnar. He couldn't crack the Vikings roster, iirc.

Only partially true. He couldnt make the 53 man roster due to his lack of football X's and O'x knowledge. Mike Tice wanted Lesnar to put a year in at NFL Europe to learn "the game" more. His athleticism was right in line with Vikings starters.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

Not by any means. I do think that the NFL is the most athleticism driven sport on the planet, so most of the focus is on being a well-rounded athlete. There's a high level of skill involved, but skill isn't the center of the sport like it is with many other sports throughout the world. If the NFL existed elsewhere and there was an equal emphasis on agility and leaping ability and such, I'm sure other countries would produce some pretty ridiculous all around athletes. Under the right guidance, Lomu had the potential to be a star in the NFL if he chose to go that route. He wouldn't be anything the NFL hasn't seen before, but he'd still be an upper echelon talent. Even some of those guys washout though because there is still a skill component, and some of the most athletic guys lack the skill or discipline to not flake out.

We can all agree Crossfit is stupid but; Crossfit defines 10 "general physical skills":

1. Cardiovascular/respiratory endurance
- The ability of body systems to
gather, process, and deliver oxygen.

2. Stamina - The ability of body systems
to process, deliver, store, and
utilize energy.

3. Strength - The ability of a muscular
unit, or combination of muscular units,
to apply force.

4. Flexibility - the ability to maximize
the range of motion at a given joint.

5. Power - The ability of a muscular
unit, or combination of muscular units,
to apply maximum force in minimum
time.

6. Speed - The ability to minimize the
time cycle of a repeated movement.

7. Coordination - The ability to combine
several distinct movement patterns
into a singular distinct movement.

8. Agility - The ability to minimize
transition time from one movement
pattern to another.

9. Balance - The ability to control the
placement of the bodies center of
gravity in relation to its support base.

10. Accuracy - The ability to control
movement in a given direction or at a
given intensity.

Does the above make up "athleticism"? If so, is the NFL combine the best test/demonstration of athleticism?

 

[JudoChop!]

We can all agree Crossfit is stupid but; Crossfit defines 10 "general physical skills":



Does the above make up "athleticism"? If so, is the NFL combine the best test/demonstration of athleticism?

And if those 10 constitute athleticism are they all weighted equally? If so, then we need to handicap athletes who have emphasis on certain areas over others. This is beyond my desire...so I'm waiving the white flag. At the end of the day I really dont care who the better athlete is. At least not enough to put this much effort into finding out.

 

[DrBdan]

Honestly Doc, I think the TM set-up is pretty decent on its own.

Is your bench really that important to focus on? TM or madcow, will increase your bench, but at a much slower pace than smolov, or some russion PL program. Something is probably better than what you're doing now.

My elbows are my weakness. When I bench more, my elbows hurt more. Something I'm not willing to go through since my elbow health is important to my squat.

Well I would like to actually bench two plates at some point...

Push ups are no substitute for benching on Wednesday. Those 2 sets are probably what makes the volume adequate over the course of the whole week. If you're going to leave them out, go back to 5x5 on monday. Cutting down monday AND Wednesday is really butchering that program.

I think you're over-estimating my bench strength. My last Monday session I did 3x5 @ 170 lb. 80% of that is roughly 135 lb so I think push-ups are probably around that and I did 5x8 rather than 2x5. I think you could make the argument that benching is better simply because it gets in more quality bench reps.

 

[NurseKnuckles]

We can all agree Crossfit is stupid but; Crossfit defines 10 "general physical skills":



Does the above make up "athleticism"? If so, is the NFL combine the best test/demonstration of athleticism?

No, but a 6'2" 300lbs fucker being able to shove his forearm into a basket ball hoop from standing is pretty fucking impressive.

 

[NurseKnuckles]

unrelated my wife saw a physio (a colleague at her work) at work today. She's been having bad lower back pain. Pain to touch even. Physio says its her SI joint that she's having issues with.

Any experience with SI joint fixes here?

I know this is no-go topic, but seriously if she doesn't HAVE to go to a physio, I'm happy.

 

[JudoChop!]

No, but a 6'2" 300lbs fucker being able to shove his forearm into a basket ball hoop from standing is pretty fucking impressive.

Ken Patera was on the radio here a few years ago. He said that when he was in his lifting prime he would go give little motivational talks at schools. This was typically done in the school gymnasium. He would often wow the kids by dunking a basketball in his slacks and dress shoes. Not bad for close to 300 lbs and 6'2".

On another KP note, I have heard him referred to as one of the strongest men ever, but a very poor weight lifter....hence his failure to win the gold as an elite lifter.

 

[belph]

I wrote some lengthy rebuttal as to why you guys are so far off base. Of course as soon as I hit "Submit Reply" I got kicked out of Sherdog, then my browser timed out. But after typing all of that I came to this relization...

Without a scientifically defined set of criteria and weighting as to what makes up "Athleticism" this argument is ridiculous.

One could easily point out instances such as the fact that former NFL elite athlete Shaw Marriman gave American Ninja Warrior a shot, and didnt make it half way through the first round. Surely such an elite athlete should be able to finish the first round right? Also, one of the Hamm brothers gave Ninja Warrior a try, and aced the first round until he got to the warped wall. He was too tired to make it up. Being that Hamm made it further than Marriman does that mean Hamm is a better athlete? Possibly, but not definitively. Maybe Hamm is just better at obstacle courses than Merriman, just like Merriman is better bench pressing than Hamm.

Who fucking knows. I dont, and neither do you.

A 250 lb man didn't run an obstacle course as well as 120 lb man ? Well, I'll be a motherfucker.














That being said, I love Ninja Warrior.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

No, but a 6'2" 300lbs fucker being able to shove his forearm into a basket ball hoop from standing is pretty fucking impressive.

Yeah it is.
I'm intrigued to know if I ever get to some reasonable squat numbers will my vertical leap significantly improve? I can't jump for shit at the moment. I may measure it for future reference.

 

[JimRussel]

Only partially true. He couldnt make the 53 man roster due to his lack of football X's and O'x knowledge.

I know. That's what I was getting at.

 

[JudoChop!]

A 250 lb man didn't run an obstacle course as well as 120 lb man ? Well, I'll be a motherfucker.

First and foremost...Im pretty sure those little Hamm's weigh quite a bit more than 120 lbs.

Secondly, why does weight matter? This is about athleticism and shouldnt the superior athlete do better? If being 250 lbs hinders athleticism doesnt that hurt the case for them being the superior athletes?

How does the absolute strength to relative strength ratio play into athleticism?

 

[belph]

First and foremost...Im pretty sure those little Hamm's weigh quite a bit more than 120 lbs.

Secondly, why does weight matter? This is about athleticism and shouldnt the superior athlete do better? If being 250 lbs hinders athleticism doesnt that hurt the case for them being the superior athletes?

How does the absolute strength to relative strength ratio play into athleticism?

137 for Paul. I shorted him, and probably Merriman by 17 lbs.


Why does weight matter in an obstacle course ? You honestly don't see an advantage in being smaller ? Seriously ?

 

[Aleks Sytsevich]

unrelated my wife saw a physio (a colleague at her work) at work today. She's been having bad lower back pain. Pain to touch even. Physio says its her SI joint that she's having issues with.

Any experience with SI joint fixes here?

I know this is no-go topic, but seriously if she doesn't HAVE to go to a physio, I'm happy.

Was she advised that her hip is externally rotated or the hips are offset? Or is the joint mobile? Or is it nerve impingement?

SmallvilleCK has had SI joint issues, also.

 

[belph]

Didn't Toonie have an SI problem as well ?

 

[Aleks Sytsevich]

Yeah it is.
I'm intrigued to know if I ever get to some reasonable squat numbers will my vertical leap significantly improve? I can't jump for shit at the moment. I may measure it for future reference.

It will not.