UFC 239 Jones vs Santos PBP/Discussion

[zeckdo]

Jones won the official decision but Santos's stock just went through the roof. I suggest Santos fights the winner of Oezdmir/Latifi, Reyes, or Smith then fights Jones again in 2020.

 

[BaruchSpinoza]

Sure.

Not sure if you know this or not but there are more scenarios than the one that you actually see.

Yes, of course. But robbed, really?

I feel like we still don't know what would happen if the fight would have taken a less sensational route.

 

[zeckdo]

Was an entertaining card but the ME was just slightly better than Gadelha-Markos

you weren't entertained by Thiago Santos kickboxing toe to toe with the supposed GOAT JBJ in a razor close fight? It was fairly low output but I was enthralled the whole time.

 

[DevilsPt2]

Yes, of course. But robbed, really?

I feel like we still don't know what would happen if the fight would have taken a less sensational route.

I feel like I know and I know that I dont know everything but I do know that if Askren put hand on him, it's going to the mat and its staying there. Actually had Askren ITD as well.

 

[DevilsPt2]

you weren't entertained by Thiago Santos kickboxing toe to toe with the supposed GOAT JBJ in a razor close fight? It was fairly low output but I was enthralled the whole time.

lol I see it

 

[BaruchSpinoza]

I feel like I know and I know that I dont know everything but I do know that if Askren put hand on him, it's going to the mat and its staying there. Actually had Askren ITD as well.

Ok.......

 

[GrantSorenson]

Askren only has himself to blame though. That was some of the most amateur shit I've ever seen and he deserved to be KO'd like that.

 

[mkess101]

He only fights to the level that his opponent is. His shittiest fights were against OSP and Santos. Then, he dominates Anthony Smith, Cormier, Gustafssadssaon.

There's a crazy part - some would call arrogance, inside him that doesn't respect the likes of OSP and Santos and doesn't feel like they're worth the effort for him to wake up and do something to them. Even with the title on the line.

That's what's infuriating. This isn't the NBA where you play 82 games in a season and it's no big deal if you "take a night off". Jones fights maximum 4 times per year, and generally 3 (when he's healthy and not suspended). IDGAF who you are fighting, when you headline a big ppv card every time out and you are one of the 2-3 biggest stars in the sport, you should give maximum effort every time out. He looked terrific vs Gus off the layoff (granted in hindsight Gus may have already been done---doesn't matter, Jones looked sharp and on point). Then he clearly dominates Smith but shows little to no inclination to finish. And tonight...ugh.

You only have to perform about 3 times per year. Go out and crush guys the way you are capable of.

 

[DevilsPt2]

Ok.......

So if Askren puts hand on Masvidal you think Masvidal stays on his feet? Ok... You think Masvidal gets to his feet and creates space? Ok... You think Masvidal can strike comfortably with the threat of going back to his back? Ok...Irrelevant now and neither rmyself or Askren can prove it.

 

[Deleted member 560591]

Ben Askren got baptised

 

[LEMONZEST]

I'm tiring of Jones, a lot. When he was younger he was so amazing to watch. Now he's the ME and twice in a row we see him look like he doesn't care that much. Can't deny how great he is, most talented guy I've ever seen. But coasting to split decision wins against guys that he would have mauled 4 years ago...not a good look. Props to Santos, he kept fighting and initiated every meaningful exchange.

I guess I'm pissed because when you are blessed with the talent that Jones has, more is expected of you. But what the hell do I know, I was 1-0 in an amateur fight a hundred years ago and never fought professionally. Couldn't shine these guys shoes. But as a fan...bad taste in my mouth. I want more.

I think everyone including Dana feels the same way. He is a guy with many self contradictions.

 

[PolarBearPaulVarelans]

I'm tiring of Jones, a lot. When he was younger he was so amazing to watch. Now he's the ME and twice in a row we see him look like he doesn't care that much. Can't deny how great he is, most talented guy I've ever seen. But coasting to split decision wins against guys that he would have mauled 4 years ago...not a good look. Props to Santos, he kept fighting and initiated every meaningful exchange.

I guess I'm pissed because when you are blessed with the talent that Jones has, more is expected of you. But what the hell do I know, I was 1-0 in an amateur fight a hundred years ago and never fought professionally. Couldn't shine these guys shoes. But as a fan...bad taste in my mouth. I want more.

Excellent post. Yeah, Jones from the early 2010's demolishes this version of Thiago Santos.

All the props to Thiago Santos for putting on the best fight of his life, and battling through a serious injury. Unlike Jones, he is a true warrior.

That being said, I remember watching Santos beating Kevin Holland less than a year ago and thinking, "yeah, this guy is a solid borderline top-10 gatekeeper at 185, nothing more". If you would have told me THIS guy fought to a 50/50 decision against Jon Jones on one leg starting with round 2, I would have laughed at you.

Very embarrassing performance by Jones, and the UFC pimping him as the "greatest of all time", aside from being criminally stupid (NEVER declare a still-active fighter in his/her prime as the GOAT) reflects very poorly upon their own promotion.

 

[BaruchSpinoza]

So if Askren puts hand on Masvidal you think Masvidal stays on his feet? Ok... You think Masvidal gets to his feet and creates space? Ok...

Hm I really don't feel like I have to explain myself. You're the one claiming that, after seeing him getting KO:ed in 5 seconds, Ben Askren should have been a -900 favorite over Masvidal. And not only is it a belief–you know it to be true. Ok.......

 

[LEMONZEST]

Excellent post. Yeah, Jones from the early 2010's demolishes this version of Thiago Santos.

All the props to Thiago Santos for putting on the best fight of his life, and battling through a serious injury. Unlike Jones, he is a true warrior.

That being said, I remember watching Santos beating Kevin Holland less than a year ago and thinking, "yeah, this guy is a solid borderline top-10 gatekeeper at 185, nothing more". If you would have told me THIS guy fought to a 50/50 decision against Jon Jones on one leg starting with round 2, I would have laughed at you.

Very embarrassing performance by Jones, and the UFC pimping him as the "greatest of all time", aside from being criminally stupid (NEVER declare a still-active fighter in his/her prime as the GOAT) reflects very poorly upon their own promotion.

Im tired of the GOAT conversation. The UFC is so full of shit when it comes to promotion. Whoever is currently winning is the best ever blah blah blah....its patronizing to fans. Its like I have a memory....

 

[PolarBearPaulVarelans]

Im tired of the GOAT conversation. The UFC is so full of shit when it comes to promotion. Whoever is currently winning is the best ever blah blah blah....its patronizing to fans. Its like I have a memory....

Exactly. I cringed hard when they called Nunes the "women's GOAT" multiple times.

The UFC called Ronda Rousey the women's GOAT until late 2015.

Then, the UFC called Joanna J. the women's GOAT until late 2017.

Then, the UFC called Cris Cyborg the women's GOAT until late 2018.

Gee, this "women's GOAT" changes hands more often than the consensus pound-for-pound best, doesn't it?

Of course, all of that pales in comparison to the UFC calling TJ Dillishaw "the greatest bantamweight champion ever" after he beat Cody Garbrandt a second time.

 

[mkess101]

Im tired of the GOAT conversation. The UFC is so full of shit when it comes to promotion. Whoever is currently winning is the best ever blah blah blah....its patronizing to fans. Its like I have a memory....

The sad thing is...in my 20 years seeing this sport Jones IS the best I've seen. I don't care about stupid GOAT talk, I agree. I'm saying he's the best fighter I've seen. WHEN he cares.

Jones post fight interview tonight felt like listening to a kid with genius level IQ try to explain to their parents why they should be proud of the kid graduating with a C average. I'm sitting there like "No shithead, you are a.fighting savant. This performance was NOT acceptable..."

 

[Macaque]

Looking back now, Heavy Hands did really well previewing Jones v. Santos.

 

[Macaque]

I'm gettin on board the Walker hype train, walker for ktfo Jones

I hope to God.
WAR WALKER

 

[betterthanjones]

That's what's infuriating. This isn't the NBA where you play 82 games in a season and it's no big deal if you "take a night off". Jones fights maximum 4 times per year, and generally 3 (when he's healthy and not suspended). IDGAF who you are fighting, when you headline a big ppv card every time out and you are one of the 2-3 biggest stars in the sport, you should give maximum effort every time out. He looked terrific vs Gus off the layoff (granted in hindsight Gus may have already been done---doesn't matter, Jones looked sharp and on point). Then he clearly dominates Smith but shows little to no inclination to finish. And tonight...ugh.

You only have to perform about 3 times per year. Go out and crush guys the way you are capable of.

He's just too high up on his pedestal is all. Don't feel like he needs to do anything to prove anyone right or wrong.

 

[DevilsPt2]

Hm I really don't feel like I have to explain myself. You're the one claiming that, after seeing him getting KO:ed in 5 seconds, Ben Askren should have been a -900 favorite over Masvidal. And not only is it a belief–you know it to be true. Ok.......

I feel like I know and I know that I dont know everything

There are fghts that ended early and then looked completely different even with the mental block of having lost to that person or even having lost badly. I'm essential explaining why I felt Jorge had no shot when I say he gets put on his back and doesnt get up at first contact(theres a free joke, go ahead), when I ask does he create space if he does somehow get up? How cautiously does he strikes if he can make space? I didnt say this but also does he land a 1 shot KO or does he have to follow(Another 1!)? What does a 5 second KO really tell you? Of course you dont have to anwser any of my questions but what could you lose by doing so? An argument? Ok...