UFC Fight Night: Cannonier vs Gastelum - Discussion Thread

2020Tracked said:
I think Madson is going to easily beat Guida and people are just over thinking the fight
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They do be overrating a win over an MJ who got outwrestled by Stevie Ray.

You look at Clay's record and can see that he's not fought a single strong wrestler in years, Bobby Green perhaps being the closest thing to that.
 
2020Tracked said:
I think Madson is going to easily beat Guida and people are just over thinking the fight
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I agree. Madson has had alot of time to heal and work on his game.

I think it is because Rafa Garcia vs Chris
Guetzemacher is still fresh in people's minds.

Chris kind of looks like Guida.
 
Spath said:
I wonder how Madsen is going to constantly get a hold of Guida as his best takedowns are from the clinch. He needs to get close and get his hands locked. I think Guida will be moving around like the maniac he is and scrambling constantly to not get held down.

Maybe Madsen floors him with a punch or grabs a hold of his neck while Guida thrashes around but who knows. Their last performances taken into consideration.. I don’t think Madsen should be as big of a favorite
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If you watch Guida he bounces around but then he will stop, plant, and throw wild combos. I think. Madsen likely uses those opportunities to drive Guida back against the cage. I honestly could see a lot of time with Guida pressed against the cage in this one.
 
KingRyan said:
There is a Brave FC card Saturday night as well and my bookie is offering lines.

Brad Katona is fighting might play him.
Looks like alot of Dagastani favorites on the card anyone have any leans???
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Not a single Dagestani on this card
 
Noel Wards said:
I just favour the far better fighter here. The odds for guida should be as a +1000 underdog.
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Now I know how you got your yellow card. Setting aside your fighter bashing you also say doltish things like this lol.
 
Peculiar things I don't like about Cannonier, thought I would share.

1. He's low output and his significant head strikes evaporate vs top guys.. Blachowicz (17 landed in 3 rounds), Silva (5 in 1st round), Jack (4 in 1st round).. he landed 4 on Reyes before getting TKO'd and he landed 17 to Whittaker's 59 (3 rounds). Terrible.

2. His wins aren't great. Looking at the last 4 years.. Roehrick (nobody), Branch (aged and tired), Silva (leg kick).. Hermansson is the best win, but he still lost the 1st round before getting the TKO early in the 2nd.

3. He's a 37yo muscled middleweight who relies on athleticism. Wear him down and what is he?

Gastelum:

1. Had decent significant head strikes vs Adesanya with 33 to Adesanya's 27 (for 3 rounds), but has dropped off since... Darren Till (8 landed in 3 rounds), Heinisch (20 in 3 rounds) and within the first 3 rounds, Gastelum landed 24 to Whittaker's 76.

2. Looking at Gastelum's win record is not inspiring. The last 6 years have been nothing but old and retiring fighters where youth and speed served him.. plus an Ian Heinisch who's the lowest level he's fought in 7 years. The best thing he's done was take 2 rounds off Adesanya (2 years ago) and he's been on auto-pilot since.

Gastelum is at a good gym, there's no excuse why he can't look as good or better than the Adesanya fight at only 29yo. His speed, wrestling and gas should have sharpened, yet he looks underwhelming.

Both guys will enjoy not having an elusive Whittaker in front of them. Both have speed and see well. Both will kick and be kicked... Gastelum (the wrestler) needs to gameplan a clinch/ grapple pace to wear the plodding 37yo power puncher out (a non-wrestler)... Don't give Cannonier space to charge his battery and laugh at infrequent takedown attempts.. Don't allow Cannonier the space to hammer leg kicks and look for flat and off-balance openings.

Still digesting..
 
Syndrm said:
Peculiar things I don't like about Cannonier, thought I would share.

1. He's low output and his significant head strikes evaporate vs top guys.. Blachowicz (17 landed in 3 rounds), Silva (5 in 1st round), Jack (4 in 1st round).. he landed 4 on Reyes before getting TKO'd and he landed 17 to Whittaker's 59 (3 rounds). Terrible.

2. His wins aren't great. Looking at the last 4 years.. Roehrick (nobody), Branch (aged and tired), Silva (leg kick).. Hermansson is the best win, but he still lost the 1st round before getting the TKO early in the 2nd.

3. He's a 37yo muscled middleweight who relies on athleticism. Wear him down and what is he?

Gastelum:

1. Had decent significant head strikes vs Adesanya with 33 to Adesanya's 27 (for 3 rounds), but has dropped off since... Darren Till (8 landed in 3 rounds), Heinisch (20 in 3 rounds) and within the first 3 rounds, Gastelum landed 24 to Whittaker's 76.

2. Looking at Gastelum's win record is not inspiring. The last 6 years have been nothing but old and retiring fighters where youth and speed served him.. plus an Ian Heinisch who's the lowest level he's fought in 7 years. The best thing he's done was take 2 rounds off Adesanya (2 years ago) and he's been on auto-pilot since.

Gastelum is at a good gym, there's no excuse why he can't look as good or better than the Adesanya fight at only 29yo. His speed, wrestling and gas should have sharpened, yet he looks underwhelming.

Both guys will enjoy not having an elusive Whittaker in front of them. Both have speed and see well. Both will kick and be kicked... Gastelum (the wrestler) needs to gameplan a clinch/ grapple pace to wear the plodding 37yo power puncher out (a non-wrestler)... Don't give Cannonier space to charge his battery and laugh at infrequent takedown attempts.. Don't allow Cannonier the space to hammer leg kicks and look for flat and off-balance openings.

Still digesting..
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Let's be honest, there's a one word reason that Kelvin isn't a WW: food. His talent has never been in question, and at his best there's no doubt he can compete with the absolute best in the world (as evidenced by the war with Izzy). The issue is that you absolutely never know what you're going to get. And honestly, the Izzy fight seems to be more the exception than the rule when it comes to whether Kelvin looks sharp and gives max effort (and who knows about what he puts into his camps). A guy who flat refuses to be in the weight class that he should be simply because he lacks the discipline to eat properly is a big red flag when it comes to the rest of his approach.

Cannonier is a bit of a plodder maybe, but he'll likely have a massive size edge along with a solid reach advantage. Kelvin's punches can look crisp and sharp, but he's never expanded his game much past a straight 1-2 down the pipe. He's not a very tough guy to gameplan for.

One thing Kelvin is though is durable. Dude has a granite chin so far, even against naturally bigger guys. And his cardio is generally solid even if he can't stay away from the buffet table.

I'm playing Cannonier (I just think there's more positives for him than negatives here) and the o4.5. Might take a stab at Cannonier dec too.
 
Syndrm said:
Peculiar things I don't like about Cannonier, thought I would share.

1. He's low output and his significant head strikes evaporate vs top guys.. Blachowicz (17 landed in 3 rounds), Silva (5 in 1st round), Jack (4 in 1st round).. he landed 4 on Reyes before getting TKO'd and he landed 17 to Whittaker's 59 (3 rounds). Terrible.

2. His wins aren't great. Looking at the last 4 years.. Roehrick (nobody), Branch (aged and tired), Silva (leg kick).. Hermansson is the best win, but he still lost the 1st round before getting the TKO early in the 2nd.

3. He's a 37yo muscled middleweight who relies on athleticism. Wear him down and what is he?

Gastelum:

1. Had decent significant head strikes vs Adesanya with 33 to Adesanya's 27 (for 3 rounds), but has dropped off since... Darren Till (8 landed in 3 rounds), Heinisch (20 in 3 rounds) and within the first 3 rounds, Gastelum landed 24 to Whittaker's 76.

2. Looking at Gastelum's win record is not inspiring. The last 6 years have been nothing but old and retiring fighters where youth and speed served him.. plus an Ian Heinisch who's the lowest level he's fought in 7 years. The best thing he's done was take 2 rounds off Adesanya (2 years ago) and he's been on auto-pilot since.

Gastelum is at a good gym, there's no excuse why he can't look as good or better than the Adesanya fight at only 29yo. His speed, wrestling and gas should have sharpened, yet he looks underwhelming.

Both guys will enjoy not having an elusive Whittaker in front of them. Both have speed and see well. Both will kick and be kicked... Gastelum (the wrestler) needs to gameplan a clinch/ grapple pace to wear the plodding 37yo power puncher out (a non-wrestler)... Don't give Cannonier space to charge his battery and laugh at infrequent takedown attempts.. Don't allow Cannonier the space to hammer leg kicks and look for flat and off-balance openings.

Still digesting..
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Yeah the striking volume is a concern for me. Still he went through Silva pretty quick with leg kicks, hard to count that one. I didn't look too far into it but I believe he broke his arm in r1 blocking a kick from Whitaker. Hard for me to really get a good read, Jared's 185 run has been a little weird and we don't know how his cardio holds up.

Kelvin is skilled but you almost seem to get a different version of him every other fight. Kelvin decision or Cannonier KO if I had to guess.
 
I really wanted to like Pantoja but Royval has the size advantage. Both men leave themselves open entering to strike as well. If Royval can use his length I could see Pantoja having a hard time closing distance.
 
Sono07 said:
I really wanted to like Pantoja but Royval has the size advantage. Both men leave themselves open entering to strike as well. If Royval can use his length I could see Pantoja having a hard time closing distance.
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ya I could prove to look silly for this but Royvals my dog on the card. I’d drop a bomb on him if he wasn’t off a very serious injury that I myself have had and understand how difficult it is to come back from.
Pantoja hits hard but Royval is a slippery little fucker.
 
TrueAscension said:
ya I could prove to look silly for this but Royvals my dog on the card. I’d drop a bomb on him if he wasn’t off a very serious injury that I myself have had and understand how difficult it is to come back from.
Pantoja hits hard but Royval is a slippery little fucker.
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If they still had FOTN bets that would be my pick. I think the fight is gonna be fire.
 
So no pbp thread, just keepin' it here tonight?
 
StewDogg11 said:
Now I know how you got your yellow card. Setting aside your fighter bashing you also say doltish things like this lol.
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How is saying he couldn't finish washed BJ Penn and Michael Johnson so he won't finish Madsen doltish?

I'm bashing Clay so some fools don't lose money on this serious mismatch. Anyway actually I got my yellow card for trolling on UFC discussion.
 
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