Trump Administration to Step Up US Arms Sales(Trump Getting Personally Involved)

[Kframe]

I don't think American military spending is as altruistic as you are making out.

I believe it is done for its own benefit and other countries benefit in exchange for concessions or support of Americas interests.

If America wanted to help there are vastly more cost effective ways.

They have no reason to actually spend real money on their own defense as long as we park our bases there. They know, we know it. We are the ones getting bent. Just closing most or all of the US bases around the world and bringing our guys home to defend our lands would reduce the cost of our military with out reducing our actual strength. Money that can be spent on bettering our own Social programs.

 

[HIMBOB]

They have no reason to actually spend real money on their own defense as long as we park our bases there. They know, we know it. We are the ones getting bent. Just closing most or all of the US bases around the world and bringing our guys home to defend our lands would reduce the cost of our military with out reducing our actual strength. Money that can be spent on bettering our own Social programs.

Totally disagree.

Let's consider Chinese plans to build a base in Vanuatu. Do you think that base is being built out of a desire to keep Vanuatu safe? Or as a way to protect Chinese interests in the Pacific?

 

[HomerThompson]

Totally disagree.

Let's consider Chinese plans to build a base in Vanuatu. Do you think that base is being built out of a desire to keep Vanuatu safe? Or as a way to protect Chinese interests in the Pacific?

"China respects the sovereignty of Vanuatu, Joe!"

 

[Prutfis]

Overly simplistic assessment, man. We foment the conflicts, and arm both sides. We're creating a much more dangerous world by doing this. And, once again, we're creating a more dangerous world for short term profit.

Thank god Trump is draining the swamp.

MIC BTFO!!!

So Trump is Destro

 

[Kframe]

Totally disagree.

Let's consider Chinese plans to build a base in Vanuatu. Do you think that base is being built out of a desire to keep Vanuatu safe? Or as a way to protect Chinese interests in the Pacific?

I truly don't care about them. I am only about the US and our bases overseeing protection in the EU. They consistently do not meet their Nato military spending requirements. Purposely keeping their strength low because a. they want to spend that money on social programs, and b. they know we have bases near by and will protect them.

No what the reasoning, us having bases all over is costing the US untold BILLIONS that could be better spent here. With our military and bases parked over there, they have no reason to do real spending on their own defense. They are leaching money that can be better spent on improving SNAP and other social programs.

 

[HockeyBjj]

Gotta make up for the deficit the tax plan will cause, right?

 

[HIMBOB]

I truly don't care about them. I am only about the US and our bases overseeing protection in the EU. They consistently do not meet their Nato military spending requirements. Purposely keeping their strength low because a. they want to spend that money on social programs, and b. they know we have bases near by and will protect them.

No what the reasoning, us having bases all over is costing the US untold BILLIONS that could be better spent here. With our military and bases parked over there, they have no reason to do real spending on their own defense. They are leaching money that can be better spent on improving SNAP and other social programs.

I mentioned Vanuatu not because I think you care about Chinese spending but because it might have enabled you to see that foreign bases are not built to help others but to project power.

Until you understand that you can't really understand the topic.


That being said I do think that excessive military spending is the greatest risk faced by America. It's unsustainable and consistently gets worse.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Not to mention the fact that they are not so secretly bombing Syria.. Lord help us if they catch Russians in the process. What is it with Jewish people and pissing everyone off for the last 4000 years?

On some level I don't blame them. They're kind of blamed for the sins of their ancestors. They were huge assholes at first, just like all the other peoples of the ancient world. And of course the whole killing Jesus thing means bad PR forever. But they were treated like dogshit as minorities so I think there was always a barrier to their integration into host societies from both sides. Western European Jews in the late 19th and early 20th century thought they could integrate into their host countries and look what happened to them .

What's sad to me is that the Muslim world used to be more hospitable to Jews than the West but now is far less and Muslims are even making Western countries less hospitable to them. The fact that the Jewish and Christian minorities preferred Muslim rule in the Middle East was partly why the Muslims were able to so quickly establish and entrench their rule there. That's a lesson from the past the Muslims could stand to learn from.

If the region could just somehow resolve the Gordian knot that is the Israel-Palestine issue I have hope for a new era of Jewish-Muslim relations. The Palestinian Authority said that the US revoking aid is an act of war but they should see it as an opportunity to remove the US from the peace process and try to resolve it with regional partners like Jordan since the US is so biased in favor of Israel.

 

[Kframe]

I mentioned Vanuatu not because I think you care about Chinese spending but because it might have enabled you to see that foreign bases are not built to help others but to project power.

Until you understand that you can't really understand the topic.


That being said I do think that excessive military spending is the greatest risk faced by America. It's unsustainable and consistently gets worse.

I believe that the US considers it projection of power. I do not believe that is what the "host countries" see it as, not fully. Fact remains the US having bases in over their means they don't have to spend on their own defense. Closing most of the bases will allow much more money to be saved.

Their are a number of ways to pair back military spending while still remaining a Super power.

 

[HIMBOB]

I believe that the US considers it projection of power. I do not believe that is what the "host countries" see it as, not fully. Fact remains the US having bases in over their means they don't have to spend on their own defense. Closing most of the bases will allow much more money to be saved.

Their are a number of ways to pair back military spending while still remaining a Super power.

I'm not saying cuts can't be made (I think they should) but overseas bases are far from the biggest waste issue.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Allies lime saudi arabia and pakistan

Do they put it in the coconut, and drink 'em bot' up?

 

[Madmick]

yeah... its not a but. but, but thing -- its a pointing out that a Majority of presidents in the modern era sold mass amount of weaponry; its not a presidential thing, its an american thing. You're obviously against that sort of thing so i am going to look for your thread chastising Obama and Bush about it. You did do one for them, right?

But i didnt know you couldnt point out recent history in a thread about US arms dealing. Cool!

Yes, it's been common among Presidents across aisles, and guess what? It's also become commonly unpopular among the people across both aisles.

This scapegoatism isn't winning Trump points. This is a business the American people want to get out of.

 

[Ruprecht]

Egypt is a more normal country but I doubt they can match our arms production, both in quantity or quality. There's a reason they come to us. Part of it is we sweeten the deal with military aid so the money we give them is basically a gift card to be spent on our hardware so our companies can keep jobs and pumping out stuff. But its also because we're good at it.

Look, you have a point that if we didn't do it they would find someway to get their hands on arms but it would be a huge blow to these countries as they'd have to find less generous and effective benefactors. Israel for instance does not care that much about human rights, as evidenced by the fact that they're selling arms and training to Myanmar despite the human rights concerns there, and they have a very high tech weapons industry. But I'm just hard pressed to believe the gap left by a US restriction on arms sales to such countries could be filled quickly, it would take decades if it ever happened at all.

Egypt does produce a lot of their own equipment, they just licence the designs.
They'll be producing Russian T-90s from next year.

 

[Kframe]

I'm not saying cuts can't be made (I think they should) but overseas bases are far from the biggest waste issue.

Bases are very expensive. Closing them would save billions.

 

[ShinkanPo]

That just sounds dumb. They will arm themselves no matter what feel good Arms control measure you put in place. Either they will buy it from someone or make it themselves.. Nothing changes until you figure a way to stop all wars.. Wars can be fought with out guns and bombs and be just as devastating.

Yep Major arms control treatiesis usually for short term specially for conventional weapons.

Nations will secretly fund weapona building and later break treaties like the London and Washington Naval treaties.

It will also be difficult to enforce that without having the bigger stick.

 

[ShinkanPo]

I mentioned Vanuatu not because I think you care about Chinese spending but because it might have enabled you to see that foreign bases are not built to help others but to project power.

Until you understand that you can't really understand the topic.


That being said I do think that excessive military spending is the greatest risk faced by America. It's unsustainable and consistently gets worse.

A lot of people dont understand this actually. It is like a model for modern imperialism. The more you can project power the more you can secure resources.

Back in WW2 the loss of the Philippine Islands caused ruber production problems for the US and lost its access to other countries in the region and posibly access to minerals from Malay archipelago.

This why the Chinese are trying to put bases in
Vunuato. The Americans knows this and the Japanese knows this they have tried to play this game before.


And probably why Mr.Abe always visits your country Abe be like. "Hey remember when we fought you in the pacific? Yeah you beat us bad there but remember how shitty those Island hopping campaigns drag on?"

 

[Islam Imamate]

Egypt does produce a lot of their own equipment, they just licence the designs.
They'll be producing Russian T-90s from next year.

Which would be 8 years after the Russians stopped ordering them.

 

[Ruprecht]

Which would be 8 years after the Russians stopped ordering them.

I don't think they do much exporting, and they are the most basic versions.
Military juntas tend to overspend on their toys.
The military is now in charge of a lions share of the goods and services produced in Egypt.

 

[jamel]

Ollie North somewhere mad as shit right now.


And that mother fucker acted on orders!

 

[cincymma79]

But...but...but...

I’m sure if we search your history we’ll see all your antiobama threads on this