Data Shows Racial Bias in Miami-Dade, Florida Marijuana Arrests

oleDirtyBast4rd said:
And I offered a possible explanation for how that could be something other then racism.

You're just kind of stupid
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no, you offered a random unfounded assumption

to explain away racist tactics

very clear and very basic ideas here.
 
This isn't complicated. This does not show bias any more then the bullshit "driving while black fantasy" actually showed any bias. Blacks are 4x as likely to commit assault or attempted murder on cops then whites. Blacks aren't just more aggressive with cops they are more aggressive to an absurd extent. There are many other factors to consider but I would think that would be the most important one. In many jurisdictions cops are uncomfortable every time they stop a black male and it is a hell of a lot more justified then the average black guys fear of being stopped by the police. I won't run down the litany of black crime statistics because I am sure we all know them. But the narriative of police picking on blacks is complete and utter fantasy.

If you don't know about the whole "driving while black thing". They ended up doing studies in New Jersey because blacks were getting more tickets then whites when the cops swore that they were applying the exact same standard. A judge ordered a study be done to analyze both the behavior of the cops and the driving habits of black and white motorists. What the study concluded was that while blacks excessively speed 25% more often then whites, they were ticketed 21% more often. This showed a small bias in favor of black motorists.

https://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/21/nyregion/study-suggests-racial-gap-in-speeding-in-new-jersey.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2002/LAW/03/27/nj.speeding.study/index.html
 
Kindacrazy said:
This isn't complicated. This does not show bias any more then the bullshit "driving while black fantasy" actually showed any bias. Blacks are 4x as likely to commit assault or attempted murder on cops then whites. Blacks aren't just more aggressive with cops they are more aggressive to an absurd extent. There are many other factors to consider but I would think that would be the most important one. In many jurisdictions cops are uncomfortable every time they stop a black male and it is a hell of a lot more justified then the average black guys fear of being stopped by the police. I won't run down the litany of black crime statistics because I am sure we all know them. But the narriative of police picking on blacks is complete and utter fantasy.

If you don't know about the whole "driving while black thing". They ended up doing studies in New Jersey because blacks were getting more tickets then whites when the cops swore that they were applying the exact same standard. A judge ordered a study be done to analyze both the behavior of the cops and the driving habits of black and white motorists. What the study concluded was that while blacks excessively speed 25% more often then whites, they were ticketed 21% more often. This showed a small bias in favor of black motorists.

https://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/21/nyregion/study-suggests-racial-gap-in-speeding-in-new-jersey.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2002/LAW/03/27/nj.speeding.study/index.html
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so you dont even care to look at the numbers regarding the thread youre responding to

and people say racism isnt an issue anymore
 
Couldn't possibly be that more black people obstruct justice and resist arrest while being detained for narcotics.
 
panamaican said:
Wait, bias is evident by telling people that the regression analysis matches the reported information and that the regressions analysis can be requested?
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Does it match the data we've been shown? How do you know that? Does it show things that might conflict with the conclusion being presented they don't want us to see? I think that's likely. I have a suspicion the Whites (not Hispanic Whites) may see substantial disproportionate discrimination themselves once that analyses is applied.

Sure would be nice to know, but academia has resorted to occluding meaningful data.
How does that support bias? Not doing the regression or not letting people access the analysis might suggest bias. But doing them and telling you how you can get them for personal review doesn't line up with bias.
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Because they aren't interested in meaningfully qualifying their data.

If they did, they also might read a DEA report on drug trafficking. Again, Black Hispanics being targeted on drug charges in Florida is not surprising given the near-monopoly by Dominicans on the drug supply to the Eastern United states, and particularly in Florida.
 
Madmick said:
Typically this is one area where the data has supported a racist bias. Nevertheless, at ~2x the arrest rate, I simultaneously wonder if they controlled for prior records or parole as @Cubo de Sangre has already mentioned. There is zero discussion of these other factors.

Cops often use little shit to hang up people they suspect of larger crimes, but can't prove (i.e. those "nuisance" crimes), in order to get that person off the street, to continue building their record against them, and to disrupt future potential criminal activity.

data-shows-racial-bias-miami-dade-florida-marijuana-arrests-1.jpg


Know who overwhelmingly controls and is responsible for the highest amount of drug trafficking in Florida and along the entire Eastern Seaboard? Dominicans (i.e. Black Hispanics).

Why are Whites proportionally represented while White Hispanics are overwhelmingly those shown leniency? Why isn't that discussed in the headline? Does it make drawing race-based conclusions a bit illogical, perhaps?
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The whole black hispanic and white hispanic is nonsense.
Dominicans aren't in control of the drug trafficking either. Its Mexicans across the nation but in Florida Cubanos have some sway.
Dominicans are just runners.
 
Final Say said:
so you dont even care to look at the numbers regarding the thread youre responding to

and people say racism isnt an issue anymore
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I have looked at the numbers, I have looked at about 200 sets of numbers. They always turn out to be bullshit. They are always grossly slanted and never take into account the actual reality of the situation. These studies are done by the type of people who produce the, "something have to be done, 25% of all suicides are women", or the "Blacks are killed by the police at twice the rate of whites!". They are grotesquely out of context and quite often contain numerous complete fabrications.

But for the record, yes I did look at the numbers. That is why I pointed out that Blacks are hyper aggressive with cops. Its the single biggest reason that they get arrested more often for the same behavior, because they can't shut up.

Chris rock was pretty much dead on about this issue.


Police, teachers, government officials have all been pointing this out for years but nobody ever actually takes it to heart. Go on youtube and watch some videos by retiring teachers and see what they say about teaching at black schools. Their are literally hundreds of videos of hyper aggressive black students, and guys confronting the police in a way that you virtually never see people of other races do. I could take arguments against this type of anecdotal information if the statistics didn't back these anecdotes up 100%.

When I hear people talk about issues, tell their anecdotal stories and then go look at the data and find it in line with those anecdotes, I do what every other rational person does and believe them.
 
Adding those two numbers doesn't get you 10,000 lol. High IQ reporter

Police will target who they believe they can catch. I can tell you I'd never be caught with weed on my person, nor would I leave it in my car. Nor would anyone with an iota of intelligence. You need to be actually caught doing something wrong to get a citation. Stop acting like an idiot and the police literally can't do anything.
 
Madmick said:
Does it match the data we've been shown? How do you know that? Does it show things that might conflict with the conclusion being presented they don't want us to see? I think that's likely. I have a suspicion the Whites (not Hispanic Whites) may see substantial disproportionate discrimination themselves once that analyses is applied.
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How do I know? Well, if I was concerned...I'd request it.

I certainly wouldn't allege "bias" before asking for the data, especially when they say "If you want the data, we'll provide it."

Madmick said:
Sure would be nice to know, but academia has resorted to occluding meaningful data.

Because they aren't interested in meaningfully qualifying their data.
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And you figured that because they said that people can ask for the regression analysis, instead of printing it?

Madmick said:
If they did, they also might read a DEA report on drug trafficking. Again, Black Hispanics being targeted on drug charges in Florida is not surprising given the near-monopoly by Dominicans on the drug supply to the Eastern United states, and particularly in Florida.
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That paragraph has nothing to do with alleging that the people who produced the paper are biased. Except for you substituting your random opinion over that of the printed information which states that the regression analysis was done and you, Madmick, can ask for it. Did you request the data and were denied?

If not, how can you accuse them of being biased when you haven't even attempted to follow up on what they stated.

The irony is that you're making an unsupported assertion about why the data shows what it shows while accusing the people who provided you with the data of "bias" because they provided the data and said "There's even more data that you can ask for."

That doesn't make any logical sense. How can they be biased when they provided the data but you're not biased when you don't have data at all to contradict them?

I get that you don't like having to request the regression analysis but it's huge leap to then start accusing them of bias.
 
panamaican said:
How do I know? Well, if I was concerned...I'd request it.
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Concession accepted. You don't know. That doesn't bother you. It bothers me.

I wonder if it would bother you if a study into police murder of unarmed victims only presented white victims vs. black victims without adjusting for per capita rates, and said, "Unarmed whites are twice as likely to be shot as unarmed blacks. You can email us if you want to see per capita figures" presuming population figures weren't readily available to calculate these easily yourself.
I certainly wouldn't allege "bias" before asking for the data, especially when they say "If you want the data, we'll provide it."

And you figured that because they said that people can ask for the regression analysis, instead of printing it?

That paragraph has nothing to do with alleging that the people who produced the paper are biased. Except for you substituting your random opinion over that of the printed information which states that the regression analysis was done and you, Madmick, can ask for it. Did you request the data and were denied?

If not, how can you accuse them of being biased when you haven't even attempted to follow up on what they stated.
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I'm alleging bias by occlusion of meaningful data. Why perform those regression analyses, but not present them when you already have them? What was the point of going to the trouble in the first place?

<seedat>
 
Madmick said:
Concession accepted. You don't know. That doesn't bother you. It bothers me.

I wonder if it would bother you if a study into police murder of unarmed victims only presented white victims vs. black victims without adjusting for per capita rates, and said, "Unarmed whites are twice as likely to be shot as unarmed blacks. You can email us if you want to see per capita figures" presuming population figures weren't readily available to calculate these easily yourself.

I'm alleging bias by occlusion of meaningful data. Why perform those regression analyses, but not present them when you already have them? What was the point of going to the trouble in the first place?

<seedat>
Click to expand...

That's an awful image choice. Probably because it's awful language usage.

There's no concession because you have yet to answer my question and address the logical failing. I'll type it again -

How does the statement that you can request additional data demonstrate bias?

Not "What is Madmick's unsupported opinion for why the data shows it what shows?" You realize that there is no occlusion if you're told exactly how you obtain the data that matters to you. And they presented the results of the regression analysis in summary form, followed by explaining how to get the full data later.

It's like accusing a scientist of bias because he prints just his abstract.

Scientist: "Here's my abstract. It's a summary of my paper. I'll send you the full paper if you request it."
@Madmick: "That's bias - why not just give us the whole paper. Occlusion. Dark Web. Deep state."

It doesn't make any sense. It's bias to print a summary of their data and tell you how to get the full data. Yet you haven't tried to get the full data and you don't have contradictory data. Despite you're lack of, well, anything you're convinced that they're showing bias by offering you more data.

That's just silly.
 
panamaican said:
That's an awful image choice. Probably because it's awful language usage.

There's no concession because you have yet to answer my question and address the logical failing. I'll type it again -

How does the statement that you can request additional data demonstrate bias?

Not "What is Madmick's unsupported opinion for why the data shows it what shows?" You realize that there is no occlusion if you're told exactly how you obtain the data that matters to you. And they presented the results of the regression analysis in summary form, followed by explaining how to get the full data later.

It's like accusing a scientist of bias because he prints just his abstract.

Scientist: "Here's my abstract. It's a summary of my paper. I'll send you the full paper if you request it."
@Madmick: "That's bias - why not just give us the whole paper. Occlusion. Dark Web. Deep state."

It doesn't make any sense. It's bias to print a summary of their data and tell you how to get the full data. Yet you haven't tried to get the full data and you don't have contradictory data. Despite you're lack of, well, anything you're convinced that they're showing bias by offering you more data.

That's just silly.
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Except that's stupid because this isn't the abstract. This is the full report.

I'm irritated because that data is the most meaningful data, but it isn't presented, and you conveniently dodged addressing my hypothetical about that with per capita figures. Context is incredibly important to intellectual honesty. I've never known academics to withhold data simply because it reinforced their conclusions. Of course it isn't redundant. It's an entirely different data set.

Bring this "substantively similar" data to me, and I'll be satisfied. Until then it's an ACLU report co-authored by sociologists from the University of Miami-- has it been peer-reviewed, yet, or is it destined for that? Frankly, I have trouble caring because the ratios between Whites and White Hispanics are as disproportionate as the ratios between Blacks and Whites, which if you review their maps, appears to indicate the strongest correlation in drug policing is not to live on the northern coast, but inland Miami. I've explained why I'm not terribly alarmed by the apparent targeted policing of Black Hispanics.
 
Kindacrazy said:
But for the record, yes I did look at the numbers. That is why I pointed out that Blacks are hyper aggressive with cops. Its the single biggest reason that they get arrested more often for the same behavior, because they can't shut up.
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the numbers prove this huh? and i bet youll claim you have no racial bias whatsoever

this quote is an example of racism, for the record.
 
Madmick said:
Except that's stupid because this isn't the abstract. This is the full report.

I'm irritated because that data is the most meaningful data, but it isn't presented, and you conveniently dodged addressing my hypothetical about that with per capita figures. Context is incredibly important to intellectual honesty. I've never known academics to withhold data simply because it reinforced their conclusions. Of course it isn't redundant. It's an entirely different data set.

Bring this "substantively similar" data to me, and I'll be satisfied. Until then it's an ACLU report co-authored by sociologists from the University of Miami-- has it been peer-reviewed, yet, or is it destined for that? Frankly, I have trouble caring because the ratios between Whites and White Hispanics are as disproportionate as the ratios between Blacks and Whites, which if you review their maps, appears to indicate the strongest correlation in drug policing is not to live on the northern coast, but inland Miami. I've explained why I'm not terribly alarmed by the apparent targeted policing of Black Hispanics.
Click to expand...

Except it's not the full report.

If you read the publication, they present the key findings, not the totality of the raw numbers. If you look at the tables and the charts throughout the publication, the exact figures are not always presented in typed form.

So, once again, how does stating that you can request the regression analysis show bias? (because that's your claim)

I don't care about your random opinion on the data's conclusions. It doesn't matter that you're "irritated". You're alleging bias based on a single sentence in a 50 page publication. Justify that please.
 
panamaican said:
Except it's not the full report.

If you read the publication, they present the key findings, not the totality of the raw numbers. If you look at the tables and the charts throughout the publication, the exact figures are not always presented in typed form.
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<Huh2><SelenaWow>

4c3f0494-15b2-4e0a-aed5-359163446ece.png


My quote was taken directly from the PDF linked at the bottom, there.

It's impossible to extract an earnest position from you on these matters.
 
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