International Chomsky: Israeli intervention in US ‘vastly overwhelms' anything Russia has done

No, instead you see the vast majority of the Russian population living in absolute depravity while Putin and his dick sucking oligarchs loot the country to the bone.

No need to surround Ukraine ghettos with machine guns (although border towns do get shelled consistently), you just have to infiltrate and pay off some cronies to create lebensraum propaganda for a Russian state. A feature of trying to take over land that belongs to a people that is ethnically and culturally extremely similar.

My point is, although Bibi is a giant douche, he at least makes sure that Israelis prosper. Putin has no redeeming qualities from either side.



<DisgustingHHH>

1) Okay that isnt true. Most leaders live far above the average person except in Uruguay lol. Putin takes some extea for himself but so do all leaders cant blame them after alm sacrifice they do. Only plebs disagree because they dont know ideology and sacrifice or love or hierarchy. Putin has made Russia 100x better than it was in the 90s.

2) Like or dislike him you have to be joking to act like he has not had any positive effect for the Russian masses. Or improved the country vs its state in the late 80s and 90s.

3) Ukraine is run by ultranationalists. And neo nazi facists literally. They dont deny this. They out lawed russian as a language in schools and honor nazis in western ukraine.

4) Ukraine coup was helped by US and UK.

5) Eastern ukraine wants to be its own country maybe some want to be part of Russia. Ukraine after the coup new ultranationalist government had to send in troops and enact oppressive laws to keep the east from splitting off willingly. Only luhansk and dontesk have held out in armed conflict still.
 
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So basically you view "intervention" as something that is covert and illegal and not overt and legal. I understand you've grown into an Israeli asskisser but you don't have to pretend like they don't have a large influence on American politics. Our congress inviting and applauding Bibi in defiance of our President was disgusting, although that is just the most blatant example, I know I don't have to explain to you that the Israeli lobby is powerful and has been for decades.
So do the Brits, French, Germans, Japanese, and every other one of our friends. They all lobby for their causes, to some degree, and they all "intervene" in our plans via diplomacy in order to influence our policy.

The Russians are digitally attacking our Joint Chief of Staffs, laundering the leak of our most sensitive military and cybersecurity secrets through a hacktivist body like Wikileaks, perpetrating hacks on our party servers like the DNC while failing in their attempt on the RNC, spinning up troll mills on our social media like Twitter with millions of fake accounts to create divisions, surreptitiously collecting information on all of our citizens via deceitful Kremlin-attached professors who access special permissions on Facebook under the guise of academic study (the terms of which he was happy to violate), and I'm supposed to be alarmed that a foreign civil leader importuned my congressman to consider his nation's point of view with a fucking speech?

I suppose I can infer that you're a "Palestinian asskisser", but I didn't realize your got your morning cup of jo while reading the Mint Press.
 
So do the Brits, French, Germans, Japanese, and every other one of our friends. They all lobby for their causes, to some degree, and they all "intervene" in our plans via diplomacy in order to influence our policy.

The Russians are digitally attacking our Joint Chief of Staffs, laundering the leak of our most sensitive military and cybersecurity secrets through a hacktivist body like Wikileaks, perpetrating hacks on our party servers like the DNC while failing in their attempt on the RNC, spinning up troll mills on our social media like Twitter with millions of fake accounts to create divisions, surreptitiously collecting information on all of our citizens via deceitful Kremlin-attached professors who access special permissions on Facebook under the guise of academic study (the terms of which he was happy to violate), and I'm supposed to be alarmed that a foreign civil leader importuned my congressman to consider his nation's point of view with a fucking speech?

I suppose I can infer that you're a "Palestinian asskisser", but I didn't realize your got your morning cup of jo while reading the Mint Press.
This isn't either or, you just brought up the illegal aspect when that wasn't what was up for discussion, to pretend that Israel isn't influential in D.C.

The point is that Israel has influenced our politics even when it isn't in the best interest of the American people all while being our ally.
 
So do the Brits, French, Germans, Japanese, and every other one of our friends. They all lobby for their causes, to some degree, and they all "intervene" in our plans via diplomacy in order to influence our policy.

The Russians are digitally attacking our Joint Chief of Staffs, laundering the leak of our most sensitive military and cybersecurity secrets through a hacktivist body like Wikileaks, perpetrating hacks on our party servers like the DNC while failing in their attempt on the RNC, spinning up troll mills on our social media like Twitter with millions of fake accounts to create divisions, surreptitiously collecting information on all of our citizens via deceitful Kremlin-attached professors who access special permissions on Facebook under the guise of academic study (the terms of which he was happy to violate), and I'm supposed to be alarmed that a foreign civil leader importuned my congressman to consider his nation's point of view with a fucking speech?

I suppose I can infer that you're a "Palestinian asskisser", but I didn't realize your got your morning cup of jo while reading the Mint Press.
On a thread where obvious facts that are agreed on by nearly 100% of observers, you continue to push your crazy conspiracy theory. You started a whole thread with this, no?

How many Russian agents reside at the highest levels of our government and have for some time?

How many Israeli agents reside at the highest levels of our government and have for some time?

How many wars have US kids died in fighting Russia's enemies?

How many wars have US kids died in fighting Israel's enemies?

Who stole our nuclear secrets and tech? Who attacked and mass murdered Americans and had the power to cover it up by 1967? Whose spies were arrested in the largest spy operation ever uncovered on our soil? Which countries spies were then deported, AFTER INFORMATION CONNECTING THEM TO 9/11 WAS CLASSIFIED BY OUR GOVERNMENT, back to Israel on 'visa violations' by Michael Chertoff, then secretary of homeland security?

HINT: It's the same country that receives jillions of American tax dollars annually to ethnically cleanse their sworn enemies who want nothing, but to live on the land their families had lived upon for generations.

A) Russians

B) Palestinians

C) Israelis
 
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On a thread where obvious facts that are agreed on by nearly 100% of observers, you continue to push your crazy conspiracy theory. You started a whole thread with this, no?

How many Russian agents reside at the highest levels of our government and have for some time?
How many Israeli agents reside at the highest levels of our government and have for some time?

How many wars have US kids died in fighting Russia's enemies?
How many wars have US kids died in fighting Israel's enemies?

Who stole our nuclear secrets and tech? Who attacked and mass murdered Americans and had the power to cover it up by 1967? Whose spies were arrested in the largest spy operation ever uncovered on our soil? Which countries spies were then deported, AFTER INFORMATION CONNECTING THEM TO 9/11 WAS CLASSIFIED BY OUR GOVERNMENT, back to Israel on 'visa violations' by Michael Chertoff, then secretary of homeland security?

HINT: It's the same country that receives jillions of American tax dollars annually to ethnically cleanse their sworn enemies who want nothing, but to live on the land their families had lived upon for generations?

A) Russians

B) Palestinians

C) Israelis
The Russians are not our friends, the Palestinians are definitely not our friends, and my "conspiracy theory" is the consensus assessment across our intelligence community and the independent InfoSec community. Meanwhile, the NUMEC affair involved theft of uranium materials that happened over 50 years ago, and your accepted conclusion hasn't been confirmed, but suddenly you take what is likely as fact. Weren't we enemies with East Germany around that time?

I don't even know what your mass murder cover-up is supposed to reference, and hands down the state that operated the largest spy network on US Soil were the cold war soviets who still have "sleepers" to this day. In our spy swaps with the Russians, these sleepers have even refused to be sent home; instead defecting and declaring themselves American. Backfire. Taste of the free life.

The notion that Israel (or the USA itself) was behind 9/11 has to be the most retarded ongoing conspiracy theory in American history. It was the Saudis, dude. Your real conspiracy was in the mishandling and misrepresentation of American intelligence that was used to steer the Americans into war with Iraq, but that just isn't sexy enough when your life mission is to gas the Jews.
 
Stop pretending that out intel agencies have not lied us into numerous wars and stop pretending that what they call intel is anything more than carefully crafted propaganda for the masses... and not even designed to fool our least critical thinkers.

I am not getting into all your other conspiracy theories, but this is too important to pass over:
The notion that Israel (or the USA itself) was behind 9/11 has to be the most retarded ongoing conspiracy theory in American history.
I agree 100%. Let me repeat that as you constantly and falsley claim things you believe I believe.

I agree 100%.

But... there are agents for international men who care not for any one country and who have these agents embedded within many governments including ours. This is what this thread is really about. They are no more loyal to Russia or Israel or anywhere than they are to their own power. These nations' figureheads are merely actors on a stage for us, owned by these men, to have us eat their crap up faster than they can vomit it out. It's the ultimate kayfabe. They go out for cocktails after.

Your real conspiracy was in the mishandling and misrepresentation of American intelligence that was used to steer the Americans into war with Iraq, but that just isn't sexy enough when your life mission is to gas the Jews.
LOL, I did a whole post on this that you (or a like-minded mod) actually dumped, but I was then allowed to repost it. And ftr, it did involve people who call themselves Jewish, but clearly they were neoconservative zionists, who are really one in the same.

Because this is so relevant, I have found that post and present it for you here where it is COMPLETELY APPROPRIATE when discussing zionist power in America.

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Anthrax is what connected 9/11 and the war on terror/Al Qaeda with going to war in Iraq. No one cared that Saddam and Al Qaeda were bitter enemies.

The claim was that Iraqis passed anthrax to Al Qaeda through Mohamed Atta in Prague at some meeting. This was after the anthrax attack. We saw the notes that said “death to Israel" and “death to America." The notes were sent from New Jersey and Florida where the terror cells were. The official story blamed Bruce Ivins who 'committed suicide' before his trial. After his death it was shown he couldn’t have done it because his lab was not even capable of making it. There was also no way for him to have been in NJ, Florida and Maryland in the time span required. And it definitely was not he who came up with the Prague story.

The Prague meeting lies began from James Woolsey who was getting his information from the Office of Special plans. This was literally an office within an office at the pentagon. The office was for neocon/zionists, Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith and was set up by Donald Rumsfeld; all of them with the infamous PNAC who in their great wisdom actually called for "A new Pearl Harbor" before 9/11, but that's another thread.

The Senate Intelligence committee admitted that these men were fabricating a tale and not collecting evidence. The whole thing was done behind the back of our intelligence community in this office that most in the intelligence community did NOT KNOW EXISTED.

Woolsey passed the lies along to Gary Schmitt and Robert Kagan of PNAC fame who wrote about it in their ‘Weekly Standard.'

This is about them declaring that senior Iraqi officials met with the leader of the 9/11 hijackers which connected Iraq to 9/11.

Then, after the first letters were opened, Israeli security claimed it was at that meeting where they witnessed anthrax being passed to Atta. Now, how could Israelis witness this at a meeting that never happened? Even the Senate Intelligence Committee claimed that that meeting never happened.

But, we still had notes reading 9/11, death to Israel and death to America, and Allah is great? And nothing happened? No investigation into these liars?

Then Colin Powell goes to the UN with the anthrax lie.

ac7948b360357c1b1c0f6a70670090e0.jpg


We had claims of WsMD, but this was the legal reason for war. This, if true would have violated UN resolution 1441 regarding Iraq having WsMD.

http://www.un.org/Depts/unmovic/documents/1441.pdf

And we heard about mobile weapons labs from Judith Miller at the NY Times. Previously, she had blamed the 1993 WTC bombing and the Oklahoma City bombing on Iraq, so why not push this lie along with the mobile weapons lab story? They had no actual pictures, but they showed us this:

Trailer-slides.gif


Her source was Ahmed Chalabi who was also connected to the PNAC and who founded the INC, which would have been Iraq’s new government if they were attacked. This was her source and when the lies came out it didn’t matter. Judith Miller was with Powell’s speech writer, Lewis ‘Scooter’ Libby, they were a couple. Libby was an adviser for VP Cheney and a lawyer for the Mossad who represented Marc Rich, the Marc Rich pardoned by Bill Clinton. His wife financed Hillary’s Senate campaign, but I ramble.

As the story goes she gets sent fake anthrax from Al Qaeda, but why would she get the fake stuff from terrorists? A copycat attack? With identical notes to the real anthrax letters received by Patrick Lahey, Tom Daschle and others? And also sent from the hijackers location in New Jersey and Florida? Even though these letters came after, the first ones had not been opened (or reported on) so there was no way to know what those letters would have said. The letters came from the same people.

At the end of the day:

The anthrax came from Fort Detrick in Maryland, not Iraq.

There was no meeting in Prague so there is no way that Israel's agents could have witnessed it.

Without that 'evidence' (LIE), the Iraq war could not have started.

Iraq had nothing to do with WsMD, Saddam and Al Qaeda were bitter enemies, and there was nothing connecting Iraq to 9/11.

And the fake evidence that sent us to war was from the neocon/zionists at the PNAC. I have named names. It isn't like we don't know who these people are.
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...s-what-did-not-happen.3679969/#post-136926943

Peace, dude, please don't ban me. ;)
 
So do the Brits, French, Germans, Japanese, and every other one of our friends. They all lobby for their causes, to some degree, and they all "intervene" in our plans via diplomacy in order to influence our policy.

Please. Israel is a client state that is literally dependent on US political protection and US military aid. Without it they'd be sanctioned up their eyeballs.

Israel gets a free pass for so much shit. In the UK one of their attache's was literally plotting to take down one of our MP's. In the US it's far worse and far in excess of what Russia does. They've got a motivated and extremely effective political lobby that has advocated for actions that has left thousands of US soldiers dead and tens of thousands injured. If they have their way they'd have done or will do the same with Iran.

Ted Cruz literally has a guy who worked for theIsraelProject as his national security advisor. Similarly, other congressmen have foreign policy advisors who are barely concealed Israel firsters. FDD, one of the most influential think tanks on foreign policy, literally was set-up to advocate for Israeli foreign policy.

Chomsky is right. Nobody talks about the pernicious influence of Israeli lobbying on US foreign policy.
 
Nope, AIPAC is actually a domestic organization comprised of American citizens with pro-Israeli bias.

Even still, they don't contribute as much as other foreign governments.



Sheldon Adelson is a US Citizen with a pro-Israeli bias.
Through which the nation of Israel has huge political pull in the US
 
The Sephardi Jews were from Europe too on the Iberian Peninsula. These were the Jews expelled from Spain and Portugal. While slightly darker than the Khazars from the Caucuses who represent nearly everyone in the history of Israel's highest government positions, you are confusing them with the Mizrahi Jews. These Jews made up the small percentage of the Jewish Palestinian population when the Europeans arrived. These Jews would be the offspring of Jesus, just like the Arab-Christians and the Arab-Muslims of that region.

These darker skinned Jews are treated almost as poorly as the darker Palestinians and the Africans that Israel first took in to increase their "Jewish" population. These are also the ones who serve the IDF as Palestinian infiltrators as they can pass easily. Generally speaking, Palestinians have peaceful protests that dissolve into madness when an infiltrator throws that first stone.

It's a racist, apartheid shithole at the end of the day, but go there yourself and come back with some demographic information for us. You will be shocked.


Uh, no, not even close. Hitler was actually well aware of European and Russian Jews and the power they held. Hitler fed off of what was already perceived by the German people as nothing short of a conspiracy to destroy Germany and the fallout from WWI was all they needed to see. By the time that the powers behind what was then known as "international Jewery" declared their fucking "HOLY" war on Germany, there was really no going back.

Furthermore, the zionists worked directly with Hitler and there are several documents that PROVE this. A history book would be good for you.

Zionism is literally the antithesis of Judaism.



Then why are you even on here making such clearly ridiculous claims? Is it not clear to you why you won't say?
Khazar, Zionists are the real nazis, sure, I need a history book.
Jews were "europeans" because they lived in Europe but their ancestors came from the middle east, that's why they are jews and look like jews and not like europeans and were forced to live in ghettos and were then expelled.
 
Let's get something straight. You are never going to pull a fast on me where you play your little reality denial games in order to justify something. You are attempting to rationalize Chomsky's position by pretending that Israel is not an ally. That is a disqualifying breach of logic and adulthood.

I am not here to rewrite America's foreign policy, and further, I am not interested in doing it with you. If you want to take up our Israel policy, which is worthy of remaking in light of the last 20 years, go for it. In the meantime, it is factually true that they are an ally, and I won't allow you to try to play around that fact. If you don't like it, eat me.
The USA treats Israel as an ally because of the lobbying. It's a one way relationship and it's no different than what Trump is doing with Russia. Russia is lobbying him and he is treating them as allies.
 
Do you agree with Chomsky's assessment? Israel can bypass the US President altogether and speak with congress to push pro-Israeli legislation. The only country that has the power to do this

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ussia-noam-chomsky-donald-trump-a8470481.html
Of course its true but at the same time it misses the point. The problem people have with the alleged Russian meddling in the 2016 election is that it was done covertly and illegally. Israel interferes in American politics but it does so openly and legally. I would prefer neither interfering but there is a distinction to be made.
that could have just been a result of Obama being clearly far and away the least supportive of Israel of any US President since it's inception
So what? Obama has a duty to the American people and not Israel. We don't owe them anything and our support or lack thereof does not justify what Bibi did in bypassing the POTUS to speak to Congress. All the GOP members who applauded Bibi and supported that stunt should be ashamed to call themselves American.
 
It is for people who don't know any better. When was "Palestine" established? What is/was "Palestine's" borders? What makes someone "Palestinian?"
Legally it was established in 1923 by the British as the Mandate of Palestine though of course it people recognized that there existed a land known as Palestine before that. It wasn't just "Ottoman" land, it was the holy land.
 
Legally it was established in 1923 by the British as the Mandate of Palestine

So Palestine was founded in 1923? Who was Palestine's first head of state? Who is the current head of state? What are its boundaries?

though of course it people recognized that there existed a land known as Palestine before that. It wasn't just "Ottoman" land, it was the holy land.

What makes a person "Palestinian?"
 
So Palestine was founded in 1923? Who was Palestine's first head of state? Who is the current head of state? What are its boundaries?
So because it didn't exist on a map the people who have lived on the land for generations have no right to self determination? What an inhuman way to consider the matter.
What makes a person "Palestinian?"
Being born in Palestine or descended from someone who was.
 
So because it didn't exist on a map the people who have lived on the land for generations have no right to self determination? What an inhuman way to consider the matter.

I didn't say that. I asked you when it was founded, and by whom? Who was its first head of state, who is the head of state now, and what are its borders/boundaries? These should be relatively simple questions to answer about any country on Earth.

Being born in Palestine or descended from someone who was.

You are using circular logic. You cannot say anyone whose parents are Palestinian are Palestinians, most especially when you have failed to set the parameters for what makes someone a Palestinian. Is it a race? Is it a religion? Is it a nationality? Where is Palestine, what are its boundaries, and what makes one a Palestinian? These are not difficult questions to understand.
 
I didn't say that. I asked you when it was founded, and by whom? Who was its first head of state, who is the head of state now, and what are its borders/boundaries? These should be relatively simple questions to answer about any country on Earth.
You're talking about a state, I'm talking about a nation which are two different things. Under your logic Ukraine did not exist until it popped up on a map after the fall of the Soviet Union. But did Ukraine truly not exist before then? Of course not. People in Palestine were politically a part of the Ottoman Empire but they did not see themselves at Ottoman nor did they speak Ottoman Turkish nor did they see their lands as Turkish lands. They were well aware of the unique religious significance of the land they lived on as were their neighbors.

But since you are so obsessed with the state angle know that a century before Zionism ever started a Palestinian Arab by the name of Zahir al-Umar tried to revolt and separate Northern Palestine from the Ottoman Empire and nearly succeeded. So there's your head of state.
549px-Zahir_al-Umar_maximum_extent_map.svg.png

You are using circular logic. You cannot say anyone whose parents are Palestinian are Palestinians, most especially when you have failed to set the parameters for what makes someone a Palestinian. Is it a race? Is it a religion? Is it a nationality? Where is Palestine, what are its boundaries, and what makes one a Palestinian? These are not difficult questions to understand.
Its a nationality as is obvious to anyone who knows anything about the issue. Palestine can refer to historic Palestine, the land currently making up Israel and the occupied territories, or merely the occupied territories. Anyone who has familial roots in that region that predate the arrival of the Zionists is a Palestinian which includes Christians and Jews on top of the Muslim majority.
 
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