Ngannou vs Prime Cro Cop in a ring | Page 5

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by wrestlefan, Dec 7, 2017.

  1. moreorless87 Gold Belt

    moreorless87
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    I would say that size tends to become more important in an era with lesser skill levels, there was certainly no lack of big men back in the day yet the three smaller HW's were at the top of the heap.

    Kickboxing is I would say similar, Rico for me clearly does not represent a increase in talent from the days of Aerts/Hoost/Hug. He's a big guy who fights fairly conservatively against less skilled opposition than that era.
     
    #81
  2. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    I don't remember the Werdum vs Kharitonov fight so i can't comment on that.

    There were a lot of sub wrestlers in mma at the time because a lot of mma fighters were invited to ADCC, but that's a big difference.
    Today very few mma fighters get invited and even fewer want to compete in ADCC, because the sport evolved so much it's a different ball game.
    99% of the competitors in ADCC are full time jiu jitsu athletes, the mma fighters can't compete at that level.

    Citing John Danaher, GSP and Weidman jiu jitsu coach, but also the coach of the team that is wreaking every no gi grappling competition in the world.

    "ADCC is almost twenty years in existence. If you look at early ADCC competition it often looks amateurish compared with contemporary events."





    Currently in mma we a lot of jiu jitsu champions, you don't know them because not everybody is world class in mma.
    In 2017 if you are world champion in jiu jitsu doesn't mean you will have success into mma, the competition is a lot harder.
    Augusto Mendes, Gilbert Burns, Sergio Moraes, i bet you never heard them before, but they are as good as you can be in jiu itsu.
     
    #82
  3. Ol'Ironhead Brown Belt

    Ol'Ironhead
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    You have no idea what the fuck you are talking about lol. Hoost was easily 240lbs in 2000, aerts too and bonjasky was close to that. They are all tall men. Again , you have no idea what you're talking about
     
    #83
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  4. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    Proof?
    Find me a video because i can't find any.
     
    #84
  5. Ol'Ironhead Brown Belt

    Ol'Ironhead
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    Go watch hoost vs le banner in 1999. Hoost is easily 240 plus. Fuck you are stupid if you can't clearly see that.
     
    #85
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  6. crystallake Green Belt

    crystallake
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    Crocop all day.
     
    #86
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  7. Ol'Ironhead Brown Belt

    Ol'Ironhead
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    Hoost, and Remy are 6 foot 4 plus. Aerts is 6 foot 3. None of these guys fought under 230lbs in their primes. They are all large men. Like I said, if you think otherwise you clearly have no clue what the fuck you are talking about
     
    #87
  8. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    In this fight he was announced 97.8 kilograms, that's 215 pounds.
    Who is the idiot now?
     
    #88
  9. Ol'Ironhead Brown Belt

    Ol'Ironhead
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    Ernesto hoost was the lightest out of them. Even then though he was generally around 220 but got heavier post 2000. But to say any of these guys are small is idiotic.
     
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  10. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    He was smaller then all of them... Andy Hug in the same video was announced 96.9 kilograms, smaller than Hoost.

    Peter Aerts and Bonjansky were smaller than 240 in the early 2000, how do i know that?
    Because they were 240 in the later part of their career when they were a lot bigger.
    Go find me a video that says they were 240, if you are so sure.
     
    #90
  11. Ol'Ironhead Brown Belt

    Ol'Ironhead
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    I said smaller of the 3, I'm not talking about anyone else. Im not goin to waste my time looking for videos. Those guys weren't small period, I dont know where you are trying to go with this so I'm leaving this thread.
     
    #91
  12. HomerThompson President-elect

    HomerThompson
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    That's not true. The entire demolition would be very interesting to me.
     
    #92
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  13. bigconan Red Belt

    bigconan
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    Archie moore and jersey joe walcotte were many many years past their prime...and moore was a light heavyweight...considered the best of all time, by many...and he even knocked rocky down...but those guys were way past their prime...and against jersey joe...rocky was losing the entire fight, till I believe the very last round, when he caught walcotte with a punch and ko'd him...
     
    #93
  14. crystallake Green Belt

    crystallake
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    Well marciano wasnt a big HW either but I get your point. And yeah jersey joe was winning that fight until that punch near the end of the fight. Was an awesome performance to watch by walcott.
     
    #94
  15. Pepy I have made a huge mistake

    Pepy
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    fighting pros in my head...
    Ngannou going full Bitcoin these days
     
    #95
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  16. jono83 White Belt

    jono83
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    Exactly! Tried to explain that as well.. and Lebanner was already 260-265 by then and jacked!
     
    #96
  17. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    I am watching videos for you guys, i like watching fights.



    Crocop vs Bonjansky in 2002, Bonjansky was billed 103 kilos and Crocop was billed 102 kilos, that's 227 lbs and 224 pounds respectively.
    Bonjansky was NOT 240 pounds in the early 2000.
     
    #97
  18. Money509 Clutchell Wilson MVP

    Money509
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  19. moreorless87 Gold Belt

    moreorless87
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    If your talking about the very early days of ADCC(the Kerr era) yes that's true but I'm talking more about the mid 00's.

    What I think were definitely seeing more of is BJJ fighters merely dipping a toe into MMA are not committing fully, Roger Gracie being an obvious example. Were not though seeing talent on the level of Werdum, Maia and Jacare switching nearly as often as we did back in the day, again I suspect because BJJ is paying ever better and MMA is paying worse with few orgs ready to give out good paydays right off the bat based on someone's BJJ background.

    At HW especially I think theres simply no doubt that elite sub grappling ability has declined massively, back in the day we had, Nog, Fedor, Barnett, Werdum, Sergei and Mir, these days we only have an old Werdum who can rarely get fights down anymore and honestly even on the ground doesn't look nearly as good to me, Werdum of a decade ago wouldn't have let Tybura escape like that, he would have had his back.
     
    #99
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  20. Bubblun Brown Belt

    Bubblun
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    BJJ isn't paying nothing and never payed, you need to pay to sign up to IBJJF competitions.

    Today there are new competitions that are paying jiu jitsu fighters like real athletes, like EBI, Polaris, Metamoris, Submission Underground, Absolute Berkut, but they aren't even close to what mma fighters are payed.
    You can't live doing jiu jitsu competitions, every top competitor has also a gym with thousands of students, do seminars around the world or has a online subscription site like MGinAction.
    That's how jiu itsu fighters get their money.


    Trust me, most of the top dogs in jiu jitsu today, not everybody obviously, are into mma or plan to get into mma.
    Rodolfo Viera and Bruno Malfacine are full time into mma, they left jiu jitsu.
    Buchecha has been years he said he plasn to do mma and will train at AKA.
    Dillon Danis is signed with Bellator, Gary Tonon and Gordon Ryan just announced to start training mma and said that will be their main focus going on.
    Vagner Rocha after being cut by the UFC he is collecting medals in every competition that pays money, got third at ADCC, won recently the Eddie Bravo's Combat Jiu Jitsu, but he is still active in mma.
     
    #100

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