Who do you believe UFC or USADA?

[Kohelet]

neither
but the ufc is less trustable

 

[CC27]

LOL, the controversy is that USADA dumped The UFC and is accusing them of trying to break the rules with Conor. That event already went down, I didn't invent it. You're trying to make this whole shit show sound like something that might happen in the future. Bro, this is past tense...

hahaha usada dumped them? Fuck you talking about? UFC told them they are dumping them and the ceo of usada is throwing a hissy fit cause he just lost 30 percent of his revenue.

that dude would be on his knees in front of dana to sign a new deal.

 

[jsbx45]

hahaha usada dumped them? Fuck you talking about? UFC told them they are dumping them and the ceo of usada is throwing a hissy fit cause he just lost 30 percent of his revenue.

that dude would be on his knees in front of dana to sign a new deal.

Sorry not gonna to buy into that narrative. Not saying that USADA is good at their job or anything, but the UFC is totally, unapolegetically, disgustingly, wrong here and the reasons are BEYOND obvious. We have seen this movie before, regardless of what the UFC spinmeisters are coming up with. Dana was asked 6-8 months ago why Conor wasn't in the pool and his answer was "I don't know". WTF you don't know what your biggest star's drug testing holdup is when the drug testing agency you hire to spell the rules (and deadlines) out for you is literally spelling out the rules? What an absolute fucking load of fucking bollocks. No one is making the UFC look worse here than the UFC themselves. Getting fucking tired of this stupid conversation at this point.

 

[TheMadHatter]

danawhitedontbelievehisliesmemento.gif

 

[WokeWarrior]

#JUSTICE_4_JONJONES

Real fans know the truth...

 

[mmacrisis]

They are both to blame. USADA knew what was going on but decided to make this move. The UFC agreed to the USADA testing and policies but have played with them like a child to suit their promotional needs.

We don't need testing to know Conor is juiced, it is obvious.

 

[fzoid4454]

We know they do seeing as Grant Dawson and Muslim Salikhov's tests were waived away under the same pulsing excuse.

The only one they fucked over was Mir who they maintained the suspension over and which nobody seems to know why.

Mir was popped for using Turinabol, in 2016. Jones was popped in 2017. Mir got a 2 year suspension, Jones a 15 month, which was later reduced for cooperation (whatever that was). It was 2018 when they granted Jones the pass on the long-term tertiary metabolite, because, while taking Turinabol, at all, warranted a suspension, the "pulsing" meant they coudn't determine whether there was a subsequent use, afterwards, and the steady stream of passed tests led to them granting that exemption.

By time they came to understand that, better, Mir's suspension would have been over, and, like with Jones, the first suspension for Turinabol use would still have been handed down, regardless of pulsing, since that does establish the original use. Plus Mir got his release from the UFC while under suspension, so it's not really the same as Jones' pulsing "pass" on potential subsequent use, since Mir was popped for an initial use, just like Jones was.

IMO.

 

[fzoid4454]

Non profit stills pays peoples salaries so whats your point? That they dont have a reason to throw a fit losing 30% of their revenue?

Most of that revenue is pass-through, though. They don't have their own labs where they do the testing, they administer the programs, and use accredited labs around the world, paying those labs for services.

So, while they lose 30% of their revenue, since they don't maintain any kind of infrastructure overhead for the actual testing, which is the bulk of the expenses, they also see a significant drop in operating costs, as well.

So, no, as a not-for-profit enterprise that isn't taking a significant hit to their required administrative revenue stream, they don't throw a hissy fit over losing that major customer.

 

[fzoid4454]

They dont need USADAs approval for the exception. You didnt listen to the conference.

Correct, they don't need USADAs approval, but the criteria for an exemption isn't "when it's convenient and the UFC feels like it" - the specific, agreed-to criteria is supposed to be if the waiting period is deemed to be somehow onerous or exceptionally unfair to the athlete.

That's ultimately UFC's call to make, but USADA, certainly, has a say if they feel the legal, contractual criteria isn't being applied, and it does impact their reputation.

 

[fzoid4454]

I think if you fully believe what either are saying publicly you're probably on the wrong track.

They're both slinging shit with a purpose.

Also please stop with "USADA is non profit they don't care about money" - they don't exist without money, they very much care about money and they're losing a ton (~7mil annual, I've seen) with UFC leaving. That isn't to say I believe UFC, just pointing out that American non-profits have been known to be shady lol, and the term itself is a semi-misnomer.

USADA contracts out almost all of their operations. The sample collectors are not USADA employees. The testing labs and lab employees are not USADA owned or run. Losing the revenue comes with losing nearly that much in operations costs, as well. There is administrative overhead, but that's a tiny fraction of their overall budget.

 

[fzoid4454]

UFC: We want to use special exemption (which is most likely built into contract) for Connor to fight in December.
USADA: No that’s unfair
UFC: Follow the contract or we’ll look for a new organization to work with
USADA: No
UFC: Decides not to renew contract
USADA: Cries on social media.

It's built into the contract, including the specific reason and conditions under which the UFC can justify it's use.

So, to correct the start of your hypothetical dialogue -

"UFC: We want to use special exemption for Connor to fight in December, even though the specified reason for the exemption, as written in the contract, does not apply."

 

[fzoid4454]

Well, although the US government has no publicly stated or tangential input or influence over USADA, but since it was created out of government need, I have zero doubt that it is horribly inefficient and corrupt.

That's the beauty of being completely ignorant and making assumptions with no kind of factual support or logic - one is never hindered by completely justified doubts.

 

[fzoid4454]

And that didn't happen and now the UFC's saying Conor isn't fighting until April when he's done his 6 months of testing. Exactly as USADA claimed to want.

So here we are with you being a conspiracy nut.

Yes, NOW, that is the case. How many earlier fights, with Conor not being in the pool, at all, were considered and fell through? And now that it's out there in the public, sure, Conor won't fight until UFC 300.

If you think USADA digging in its heels and basically blowing the whistle has nothing to do with the UFC, now, following those guidelines, I have some valuable swamp land to sell you.

USADA has no reason to lie. Organizations that use their sanctioning come and go. Their operations are almost entirely farmed out. Their existence isn't threatened in any way by this.

 

[TheBulletwithWings]

Most of that revenue is pass-through, though. They don't have their own labs where they do the testing, they administer the programs, and use accredited labs around the world, paying those labs for services.

So, while they lose 30% of their revenue, since they don't maintain any kind of infrastructure overhead for the actual testing, which is the bulk of the expenses, they also see a significant drop in operating costs, as well.

So, no, as a not-for-profit enterprise that isn't taking a significant hit to their required administrative revenue stream, they don't throw a hissy fit over losing that major customer.

Then if they parting ways there should have been no reason to try and blame it on a possible Conor situation. However, not the case.

 

[markg171]

Yes, NOW, that is the case. How many earlier fights, with Conor not being in the pool, at all, were considered and fell through? And now that it's out there in the public, sure, Conor won't fight until UFC 300.

If you think USADA digging in its heels and basically blowing the whistle has nothing to do with the UFC, now, following those guidelines, I have some valuable swamp land to sell you.

USADA has no reason to lie. Organizations that use their sanctioning come and go. Their operations are almost entirely farmed out. Their existence isn't threatened in any way by this.

Conor had literally already re-entered the pool before any of this happened so I have no idea what you're talking about.

USADA only complained after they found out they weren't being renewed and their CEO found out he'd bungled 30% of their revenue (which would get anybody else fired). It doesn't take a genius to figure out what the actual issue they're pissed about is. Complaining about Conor is the deflection to pretend it's completely normal for a business to suffer such a loss and to not ask any other questions about what USADA was also doing that triggered it.

You're accepting their Conor narrative even though it doesn't make any sense considering Conor had already re-entered the pool by then and is now stuck in it if he wants to compete. You should actually be asking whether or not USADA was running things completely above board and not that the UFC might've had legitimate concerns about their billings and practices and decided to cut them out for those reasons instead. As the UFC themselves are complaining about and as the fighters also have complained about.

You've got fighters telling stories about USADA sending agents all the way from Singapore to drug test fighters in Thailand, without providing for the Singapore dude's expensive work visa and instead just flying them in without one, instead of just hiring a local Thai officer to do it. The UFC complaining that USADA never kept fighters samples for back testing or other innovative practices as the science improved like promised. But sure I'm sure the differences totally wasn't going to executive salaries and USADA just liked to be really expensive and un-improving for no reason.

Based on the press conference people should be happy the UFC switched partners. They outlined plenty of new and improved steps they're going to do that's on top of what USADA had already been providing. It's an improvement if they actually do all this, which none of you complaining have yet seen isn't actually happening. The fact you're complaining shows you're just anti-UFC / Conor which is par the course for Sherdog. But you guys could at least wait and see if they break their promises before complaining about it.

 

[markg171]

Then if they parting ways there should have been no reason to try and blame it on a possible Conor situation. However, not the case.

It doesn't take a forensic auditor to realize that USADA were either enormously incompetent or ramping up "testing costs" to the UFC for totally unrelated executive salaries.

 

[fzoid4454]

Then if they parting ways there should have been no reason to try and blame it on a possible Conor situation. However, not the case.

Given that they are an organization dedicated to competitive integrity in sports, there's no reason not to tell why, either.

 

[fzoid4454]

Conor had literally already re-entered the pool before any of this happened so I have no idea what you're talking about.

USADA only complained after they found out they weren't being renewed and their CEO found out he'd bungled 30% of their revenue (which would get anybody else fired). It doesn't take a genius to figure out what the actual issue they're pissed about is. Complaining about Conor is the deflection to pretend it's completely normal for a business to suffer such a loss and to not ask any other questions about what USADA was also doing that triggered it.

You're accepting their Conor narrative even though it doesn't make any sense considering Conor had already re-entered the pool by then and is now stuck in it if he wants to compete. You should actually be asking whether or not USADA was running things completely above board and not that the UFC might've had legitimate concerns about their billings and practices and decided to cut them out for those reasons instead. As the UFC themselves are complaining about and as the fighters also have complained about.

You've got fighters telling stories about USADA sending agents all the way from Singapore to drug test fighters in Thailand, without providing for the Singapore dude's expensive work visa and instead just flying them in without one, instead of just hiring a local Thai officer to do it. The UFC complaining that USADA never kept fighters samples for back testing or other innovative practices as the science improved like promised. But sure I'm sure the differences totally wasn't going to executive salaries and USADA just liked to be really expensive and un-improving for no reason.

Based on the press conference people should be happy the UFC switched partners. They outlined plenty of new and improved steps they're going to do that's on top of what USADA had already been providing. It's an improvement if they actually do all this, which none of you complaining have yet seen isn't actually happening. The fact you're complaining shows you're just anti-UFC / Conor which is par the course for Sherdog. But you guys could at least wait and see if they break their promises before complaining about it.

Dana's and Conor have both been talking about him coming back, for months now. Back at the very end of August, less than six weeks ago, there was a leak that Conor and Chandler would be on the UFC 296 card, December 16. That's 3 1/2 months from the date that leaked, and Conor was still not in the pool. Dana was clearly planning this matchup, that's why they were opposing coaches on TUF.

It's hilarious that you think nothing was happening at any time before USADA made their announcement, or that USADA suddenly decided, on the spur of the moment and a whim to do that, and that nothing was going on before.

 

[jjjjjjjjjjohnny]

it is interesting, but i can also see the issues about testing that interferes with the fight or weigh in or how often they are tested....

 

[markg171]

Dana's and Conor have both been talking about him coming back, for months now. Back at the very end of August, less than six weeks ago, there was a leak that Conor and Chandler would be on the UFC 296 card, December 16. That's 3 1/2 months from the date that leaked, and Conor was still not in the pool. Dana was clearly planning this matchup, that's why they were opposing coaches on TUF.

It's hilarious that you think nothing was happening at any time before USADA made their announcement, or that USADA suddenly decided, on the spur of the moment and a whim to do that, and that nothing was going on before.

And then none of that ever happened.

But please do continue living in the past.