Northrop Grumman Engineer Fired over participation in Charlottesville Rally

[panamaican]

Good response. And yes the preschool letters of rec do sound insane.

And yet not as crazy as the personal essays I had to write explaining the strengths and weaknesses of my to-be-4 year old and how he would be a valuable contributor to their community if he should be granted admission to their facilities (which he was).

I could do a whole separate thread about the extreme social, cultural, financial sorting apparatus that is in effect starting at kindergarten and pre-k in this country.

It would tie back to the other threads about Ivy League admissions but would be a derail here.

 

[nac386]

And yet not as crazy as the personal essays I had to write explaining the strengths and weaknesses of my to-be-4 year old and how he would be a valuable contributor to their community if he should be granted admission to their facilities (which he was).

I could do a whole separate thread about the extreme social, cultural, financial sorting apparatus that is in effect starting at kindergarten and pre-k in this country.

It would tie back to the other threads about Ivy League admissions but would be a derail here.

Why did you decide to enroll your 4-year old in a prep school?

 

[Lord Coke]

Why did you decide to enroll your 4-year old in a prep school?

One of the guys I work with pays about 25k a year so his kid can go to punahou school which is where Obama went. If you go there your kid is guaranteed to make it in Hawaii. The governor went there as did most of the top business leaders in Hawaii. You future is set.

 

[panamaican]

Why did you decide to enroll your 4-year old in a prep school?

Short answer? My wife.

Mid-length answer: After doing significant research on prep school outcomes, I came to realization that education meritocracy isn't what is really being judged when it comes to admission to elite colleges or access to the boardroom later in one's career.

There are 3 things that you need to succeed in this country - financial resources, social resources and cultural resources. Everyone can obtain financial resources just by working hard and being diligent with their money but there's a limit on where that will take you. Social resources are your network and you need a network with people in positions of power to ease your own path there.

Cultural resources are the hardest to define and the hardest to acquire. They're all of the little things that mark you as part of an inner circle. The same way lawyers have their special language and doctors have their special language, the powered elite do as well. And without those cultural cues, you will always be an outsider, regardless of how much money you make or how many people you know.

Well, where do you learn them? Ivy League schools to some degree. But elite college prep schools is where it actually originates. Elite college prep schools collate the social networks that eventually make up the future elite and it teaches them the behaviors and expectations that the previous ruling class already embraced. You come out of those schools with all of the markers of part of that group so that when you run into them at the type of activities that they attend and others do not, they recognize a similar soul and open doors that otherwise would remain closed.

Obama gets a lot of attention for his Ivy League background but it's college prep school background that created the framework that marked him for the future.

It might sound far fetched or hyperbolic but I've read enough research papers on the general subject that my opinion has completely changed. You'll get the same education and general outcomes whether you go public vs. private. But you won't get access to the same networks and that access is being dictated by the elite prep schools, even more than by the elite colleges.

 

[MicroBrew]

She plays to the lowest group of her supporters as bad if not worse than folks say Trump does . . .

Harris is establishment. She is the safe Dem bet. Tulsi Gabbard is the outsider / rebel in the Dem party. She won't get the nod cause she was opposed to US intervention in Syria and met with Assad.

 

[spamking]

Short answer? My wife.

Mid-length answer: After doing significant research on prep school outcomes, I came to realization that education meritocracy isn't what is really being judged when it comes to admission to elite colleges or access to the boardroom later in one's career.

There are 3 things that you need to succeed in this country - financial resources, social resources and cultural resources. Everyone can obtain financial resources just by working hard and being diligent with their money but there's a limit on where that will take you. Social resources are your network and you need a network with people in positions of power to ease your own path there.

Cultural resources are the hardest to define and the hardest to acquire. They're all of the little things that mark you as part of an inner circle. The same way lawyers have their special language and doctors have their special language, the powered elite do as well. And without those cultural cues, you will always be an outsider, regardless of how much money you make or how many people you know.

Well, where do you learn them? Ivy League schools to some degree. But elite college prep schools is where it actually originates. Elite college prep schools collate the social networks that eventually make up the future elite and it teaches them the behaviors and expectations that the previous ruling class already embraced. You come out of those schools with all of the markers of part of that group so that when you run into them at the type of activities that they attend and others do not, they recognize a similar soul and open doors that otherwise would remain closed.

Obama gets a lot of attention for his Ivy League background but it's college prep school background that created the framework that marked him for the future.

It might sound far fetched or hyperbolic but I've read enough research papers on the general subject that my opinion has completely changed. You'll get the same education and general outcomes whether you go public vs. private. But you won't get access to the same networks and that access is being dictated by the elite prep schools, even more than by the elite colleges.

College has always been more about networking and meeting the right people to help you later on in your career than about the actual education . . . if your chosen field has a limited number of accredited programs that offer the degree it makes the most sense to attend the college with a significant number of graduates in that field who work for the company or organization you hope to work for later in life. My advisor during my sophomore year made this abundantly clear to me and was instrumental in introducing me to the right folks who would help me meet my career goals.

 

[Quipling]

It might sound far fetched or hyperbolic but I've read enough research papers on the general subject that my opinion has completely changed. You'll get the same education and general outcomes whether you go public vs. private. But you won't get access to the same networks and that access is being dictated by the elite prep schools, even more than by the elite colleges.

Yeah, I remember learning a lesson like that during law school. There were on-campus interviews where those cues were definitely a factor. Career services tried to helped prepare us, but there's only so much they could do against a lifetime. One particular firm was clearly disinterested within the first minute.

 

[nac386]

Short answer? My wife.

Mid-length answer: After doing significant research on prep school outcomes, I came to realization that education meritocracy isn't what is really being judged when it comes to admission to elite colleges or access to the boardroom later in one's career.

There are 3 things that you need to succeed in this country - financial resources, social resources and cultural resources. Everyone can obtain financial resources just by working hard and being diligent with their money but there's a limit on where that will take you. Social resources are your network and you need a network with people in positions of power to ease your own path there.

Cultural resources are the hardest to define and the hardest to acquire. They're all of the little things that mark you as part of an inner circle. The same way lawyers have their special language and doctors have their special language, the powered elite do as well. And without those cultural cues, you will always be an outsider, regardless of how much money you make or how many people you know.

Well, where do you learn them? Ivy League schools to some degree. But elite college prep schools is where it actually originates. Elite college prep schools collate the social networks that eventually make up the future elite and it teaches them the behaviors and expectations that the previous ruling class already embraced. You come out of those schools with all of the markers of part of that group so that when you run into them at the type of activities that they attend and others do not, they recognize a similar soul and open doors that otherwise would remain closed.

Obama gets a lot of attention for his Ivy League background but it's college prep school background that created the framework that marked him for the future.

It might sound far fetched or hyperbolic but I've read enough research papers on the general subject that my opinion has completely changed. You'll get the same education and general outcomes whether you go public vs. private. But you won't get access to the same networks and that access is being dictated by the elite prep schools, even more than by the elite colleges.

Thanks for the thorough answer. I'm likely going to be making some of the same decisions in 5 or 6 years. I think it's going to depend on where we live at that point and what schools are nearby. There's not a lack of quality schooling in MD, private or public. But I'm sure being across the street from a top school could pull us in that direction.

 

[Lord Coke]

Harris is establishment. She is the safe Dem bet. Tulsi Gabbard is the outsider / rebel in the Dem party. She won't get the nod cause she was opposed to US intervention in Syria and met with Assad.

Tulsi Gabbard won't get the nod because she is in a actual cult
I know this for a fact. I have friend that have had dealings with her cult

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/16/tulsi-gabbard-krishna-cult-rumors_n_6879588.html

 

[panamaican]

College has always been more about networking and meeting the right people to help you later on in your career than about the actual education . . . if your chosen field has a limited number of accredited programs that offer the degree it makes the most sense to attend the college with a significant number of graduates in that field who work for the company or organization you hope to work for later in life. My advisor during my sophomore year made this abundantly clear to me and was instrumental in introducing me to the right folks who would help me meet my career goals.

Agreed but what intrigued me is the extent to which these networks are actually formed prior to college.

Everyone talks about the importance of networking in college. And it's true, it is important. But very few people talk about how there's a pre-existing network running through these prep schools that translates to college and continues afterwards.

There's an interesting book called "Preparing for Power: America's Elite Boarding Schools" which gets into the most exclusive side of this conversation, the 16 or so extremely exclusive boarding schools in this country. One of the points the authors make which I find interesting is how these schools (and it's applicable to many of the high end day schools as well) forge a collective identity for their attendees. That by virtue of attending said school, you are brought into a separate lifestyle that carries on into college and on into the world. And that this isn't happenstance, the schools craft these outcomes by structuring repeated social situations and encounters that make these things 2nd nature.

So, while your sophomore college counselor is explaining this to you, there are a set of kids who have been doing exactly that since the 9th grade. And they are part of a network of other kids who have also been doing it since the 9th grade. And, by virtue of the cost of attending extremely expensive private schools, they happen to be the children of people who can open those doors at the corporations and organizations that you are talking about.

They are 6 years ahead of you in terms of understanding what they're doing and 6 years ahead of you in experience doing it plus they're already friends with the people you're looking to create relationships with. It's a helluva headstart. Not insurmountable obviously but it is there.

I have my own misgivings about the whole thing but I have black and hispanic friends who've been through it and they reassured me regarding my one real fear which is that a minority child can get lost in this world that is primarily about advancing the interests of generationally well-connected white kids.

 

[panamaican]

Yeah, I remember learning a lesson like that during law school. There were on-campus interviews where those cues were definitely a factor. Career services tried to helped prepare us, but there's only so much they could do against a lifetime. One particular firm was clearly disinterested within the first minute.

Definitely. Years later, I find myself noticing all the little things that I was oblivious to when I was a student. I noticed the ease with which some students slid into conversations with hiring partners and such and just assumed they were better networkers than I was, now I know that some part of that is also that they might have had a shared language that I hadn't learned yet.

 

[Deleted member 457759]

I think there is a difference between “leaning right” and harboring racist views and assaulting folks. Sheesh. The implications of your post are damning.
Most folks who “lean right” aren’t racist, don’t participate in white supremacist rallies, and don’t assault people.

People at those rallies are being assaulted by radically left fascists. So you're narrative that they're initiating violence isn't true. It wasn't true during the campaign either when Trump supporters were quite tame and having to run through gauntlets.

 

[MicroBrew]

Tulsi Gabbard won't get the nod because she is in a actual cult
I know this for a fact. I have friend that have had dealings with her cult

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/16/tulsi-gabbard-krishna-cult-rumors_n_6879588.html

The article states:

A Civil Beat review of decades’ worth of records and Internet postings, as well as interviews with the Butler group’s insiders and observers alike, found that, as with Gabbard, there is no evidence that either of the men adheres to Butler’s teachings.

 

[Lord Coke]

The article states:

A Civil Beat review of decades’ worth of records and Internet postings, as well as interviews with the Butler group’s insiders and observers alike, found that, as with Gabbard, there is no evidence that either of the men adheres to Butler’s teachings.

I just googled for an article just so people know what I am talking about.
I know this for a fact that she is part of this cult through personal contacts.

 

[kickboxjh]

Of course you don't. You're an idiot.

I'm not American.

 

[kickboxjh]

Stop your pretense at being a a tolerant rational guy looking for debate.

And stop making stupid ASSumptions to make yourself look clever.

Tolerance for you means people agreeing with your viewpoints and having the status in society that YOU believe the should have.

But you will never directly and openly say so.

The fool that got fired at Northam got what he deserved.

You're embarrassing yourself.

When have I been irrational? Your post however...

 

[spamking]

Agreed but what intrigued me is the extent to which these networks are actually formed prior to college.

Everyone talks about the importance of networking in college. And it's true, it is important. But very few people talk about how there's a pre-existing network running through these prep schools that translates to college and continues afterwards.

There's an interesting book called "Preparing for Power: America's Elite Boarding Schools" which gets into the most exclusive side of this conversation, the 16 or so extremely exclusive boarding schools in this country. One of the points the authors make which I find interesting is how these schools (and it's applicable to many of the high end day schools as well) forge a collective identity for their attendees. That by virtue of attending said school, you are brought into a separate lifestyle that carries on into college and on into the world. And that this isn't happenstance, the schools craft these outcomes by structuring repeated social situations and encounters that make these things 2nd nature.

I've known of this existing in the various AAU basketball leagues as well as the competitive volleyball clubs, etc. Never really considered it being something common in academic prep schools. I mean I knew the private school alums would take care of their own, but nothing on the scale you're describing.

So, while your sophomore college counselor is explaining this to you, there are a set of kids who have been doing exactly that since the 9th grade. And they are part of a network of other kids who have also been doing it since the 9th grade. And, by virtue of the cost of attending extremely expensive private schools, they happen to be the children of people who can open those doors at the corporations and organizations that you are talking about.

They are 6 years ahead of you in terms of understanding what they're doing and 6 years ahead of you in experience doing it plus they're already friends with the people you're looking to create relationships with. It's a helluva headstart. Not insurmountable obviously but it is there.

I have my own misgivings about the whole thing but I have black and hispanic friends who've been through it and they reassured me regarding my one real fear which is that a minority child can get lost in this world that is primarily about advancing the interests of generationally well-connected white kids.

Seems like a quick way to get burnt out on "life" if you ask me . . . and realistically, they're only ahead of me if we're going into the same field and looking to do the same things in our future careers.

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

He should move to China.

I just have a hard time reconciling the belief that it is difficult to change IQ through environmental factors and the notion IQ points have gone up.
I don't have any desire to study the issue in depth enough to really get an answer but Sam Harris and Jordan Peterson make the argument that IQ is largely inherited. A proposition that is easily observable. All their critiques point to the Flynn effect as a rebuttal. I just have a hard time accepting that your average 19th century man was functionally retarded. That does not feel right. I know this isn't good evidence but have you ever seen civil war letters. Those were regular guys and they would write beautiful letters home. Letters that no one with a 70 iq could write. I just don't understand how they are gauging this.

Bad IQ tests and undernourished people. There were more retarded people back then due to nutritional deficiencies so the average was lower, but once you exclude these the average would be roughly similar. Many IQ tests were heavily culturally loaded back then too and immigrants would be especially bad but also rural people(a much larger percentage at the time).
From wikipedia:
Some studies have found the gains of the Flynn effect to be particularly concentrated at the lower end of the distribution. Teasdale and Owen (1989), for example, found the effect primarily reduced the number of low-end scores, resulting in an increased number of moderately high scores, with no increase in very high scores.[11] In another study, two large samples of Spanish children were assessed with a 30-year gap. Comparison of the IQ distributions indicated that the mean IQ-scores on the test had increased by 9.7 points (the Flynn effect), the gains were concentrated in the lower half of the distribution and negligible in the top half, and the gains gradually decreased as the IQ of the individuals increased.[12]

So, let's say the median american has an IQ of 100 as of 2018. The median(the middle point in a distribution) IQ of 1800 was probably the same, but you had a larger number of people with very low IQs dragging the average down.
If there were only 3 people:
IQs in 1800: 60, 100, 110. Median=100. Average=90
IQs in 2018: 80, 100, 110. Median=100. Average=96.7

Not nearly as simple but it's something in that direction.

 

[PainIsLIfe]

All those other groups are protected. Being a bigoted inbred is not. In fact it is the reason those other protected groups are protected in the first place.

It was an example - the etc could extend to political affiliation, club memberships, pretty much anything. Ex: You voted for Trump then you're fired.

And the other part of the post is that union members are only canned if their actions happen at work or started at work.

 

[AndroidRage]

It was an example - the etc could extend to political affiliation, club memberships, pretty much anything. Ex: You voted for Trump then you're fired.

And the other part of the post is that union members are only canned if their actions happen at work or started at work.

This is nothing like that tho. This is a hate group, spewing hate speech, and looking to spread violence. They obviously train mma specifically for this reason. There is no comparison.