The Official Dragon Ball (Z, GT, S, etc.) Franchise Discussion Thread v5

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TheLastEmperorReurns said:
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Goku can use the Hakai
 
I enjoyed the episode a lot, the animation was just amazing and I was actually getting hyped as the fight went on. Was stoked when 17 actually came back, even if it was a bit of an ass pull. And seeing Frieza actually save Goku was a nifty way of showing how Frieza knows he is woefully outmatched and Goku was still the best shot.

Still, I have the feeling the next episode is going to be one HELL of a cliffhanger, as I don't see how they can wrap up the story and give a decent ending in 30 minutes. Can't wait to see the next power up asspull they give Goku to finish the job though. Although judging by the title in the NEP, Goku may not fare so will in his final push for the win. Kinda hoping it's a real group effort this time instead of ROF v2.0 where he just comes out of nowhere and blasts him for the win.
 
This episode was insane.

First did anyone else love how irritated Jiren was fighting Goku? That cool, calm and collected demeanor went out the window as he was screaming and shouting while getting battered, amazing writing.

I love the fact that Goku has surpassed him and Jiren accepted he had been defeated, i'm surprised this hasn't been discussed more here? Goku is king after all.

Jiren fully powered is awesome and intimidating.

Mastered Ultra Instinct Vegito would be angel level and defeat Jiren without even moving, we can confirm this now.

I wish it ended with Goku refusing to defeat Jiren and the timer ends and they both win, I said before it seems wrong to choose a winner between god level characters and both have given so much and have gone so far.

Also I wish Frieza betrayed Goku in the end and eliminated him and came back as his true pure evil form and Jiren was to beaten and hurt to stop him taking over, end it with the bad guy on top. I thought he had actually cheap shotted Goku and took him out.
 
129 was way more hype, however 130 had amazing animation, especially the part where UI Goku zoomed towards Jiren.

Im really tired of the "friendship overcomes all and gives me power" trope in anime. Its tired and old, and I was annoyed they actually snuck that into this episode some more, if they wanted downtime, they shouldve atleast had Jiren monologue some more about him mentally breaking.

Man the end was amazing though, I thought Goku was gonna give Jiren a little of energy so they could battle it some more like he did back when Frieza and Goku fought on Namek, and then I thought Frieza backstabbed him, shit was pretty intense.

As for 17 still being alive, there were clues he was alive as we didnt see Zeno tap him out and the head angel guy said "assume 17 is dead" or something similar.

I guess next episode is 17/Frieza/Goku trying to not get destroyed by Jiren and hanging on.
 
jojoRed said:
129 was way more hype, however 130 had amazing animation, especially the part where UI Goku zoomed towards Jiren.

Im really tired of the "friendship overcomes all and gives me power" trope in anime. Its tired and old, and I was annoyed they actually snuck that into this episode some more, if they wanted downtime, they shouldve atleast had Jiren monologue some more about him mentally breaking.

Man the end was amazing though, I thought Goku was gonna give Jiren a little of energy so they could battle it some more like he did back when Frieza and Goku fought on Namek, and then I thought Frieza backstabbed him, shit was pretty intense.

As for 17 still being alive, there were clues he was alive as we didnt see Zeno tap him out and the head angel guy said "assume 17 is dead" or something similar.

I guess next episode is 17/Frieza/Goku trying to not get destroyed by Jiren and hanging on.
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They should have had Frieza defeat Goku in that moment, hell it would have been good if he actually killed him and Goku was dead at Jirens feet and Frieza was hiding his power this whole time.

That would have been twist of the century.
 
Hidden_Hand said:
They should have had Frieza defeat Goku in that moment, hell it would have been good if he actually killed him and Goku was dead at Jirens feet and Frieza was hiding his power this whole time.

That would have been twist of the century.
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Wouldve been cheap, how the hell would Frieza be anywhere near Goku in terms of power level in SSB form let alone UI form. Also he'd have 17 and Jiren to deal with, he wouldnt win.

Besides if they win Goku said he'd revive Frieza. Frieza literally gets 0 from killing Goku.
 
jojoRed said:
Wouldve been cheap, how the hell would Frieza be anywhere near Goku in terms of power level in SSB form let alone UI form. Also he'd have 17 and Jiren to deal with, he wouldnt win.

Besides if they win Goku said he'd revive Frieza. Frieza literally gets 0 from killing Goku.
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Well he caught up with SSB with 4 months of training in a cocoon.

Having the three of them against Jiren is going backwards imo, we've seen it already. Unless they give Goku one last UI at the very last minute.
 
Hidden_Hand said:
Well he caught up with SSB with 4 months of training in a cocoon.
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Didnt realise they already fought (? I dont remember), and we know when Goku is in SSB form, we never really know if he's going hard or not. Hell Krillin was able to match Goku's kamehameha in SSB form, so we know the % level of power he uses in this form varies. Golden Freiza couldnt beat that egg looking dude with the massive hands, no way in hell can he beat Goku in SSB form.

Hidden_Hand said:
Having the three of them against Jiren is going backwards imo, we've seen it already. Unless they give Goku one last UI at the very last minute.
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What else are they gonna do to keep the intensity/tension and intrigue. Having Goku in UI form when he's already whooped Jiren would be boring in that we know Jiren cant win. Having the three of them fight Jiren for the last 20 seconds or so increases tension. W dont know if U7 is doomed or not. In that sense the writing team has done well imo, in a sea of shit writing.
 
jojoRed said:
Didnt realise they already fought (? I dont remember), and we know when Goku is in SSB form, we never really know if he's going hard or not. Hell Krillin was able to match Goku's kamehameha in SSB form, so we know the % level of power he uses in this form varies. Golden Freiza couldnt beat that egg looking dude with the massive hands, no way in hell can he beat Goku in SSB form.



What else are they gonna do to keep the intensity/tension and intrigue. Having Goku in UI form when he's already whooped Jiren would be boring in that we know Jiren cant win. Having the three of them fight Jiren for the last 20 seconds or so increases tension. W dont know if U7 is doomed or not. In that sense the writing team has done well imo, in a sea of shit writing.
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Golden Frieza Saga? Obviosuly alot has changed since then but we know Frieza is a prodigy.

As I see it, they are in big trouble but maybe Jiren is exhausted? He has had a brutal fight with Goku and was beaten quite bad so with Golden Frieza and 17 having unlimited energy they may be able to give him some trouble.

Interested and sad to see this end either way.
 
I agree with @jojoRed. I hate that "my power comes from my friends" horseshit which is in every shounen anime ever.

One big reason I, along with many fans, like Goku is because he's not the typical protagonist. He fights because he's a fighting junkie, not for his friends.

I don't know why they shoehorned that trope into this episode when it's not consistent with his character.
 
Hidden_Hand said:
Golden Frieza Saga? Obviosuly alot has changed since then but we know Frieza is a prodigy.
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Damn I forgot about that saga, did anyone actually like that saga, so damn forgetable and rehashed. They severely downgraded Goku etc just for that bullshit. Pretty terrible writing, SSG1 and Beereus nearly wiped out the universes with their punches and yet he's struggling with Freiza?
I honestly cant remember much abut that saga, pretty boring imo.

Hidden_Hand said:
As I see it, they are in big trouble but maybe Jiren is exhausted? He has had a brutal fight with Goku and was beaten quite bad so with Golden Frieza and 17 having unlimited energy they may be able to give him some trouble.

Interested and sad to see this end either way.
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Glad you agree here. Yeah itll be fun to watch. More intense/tension this watch.

Horse Style said:
I agree with @jojoRed. I hate that "my power comes from my friends" horseshit which is in every shounen anime ever.

One big reason I, along with many fans, like Goku is because he's not the typical protagonist. He fights because he's a fighting junkie, not for his friends.

I don't know why they shoehorned that trope into this episode when it's not consistent with his character.
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Exactly, Goku fights because he wants to be the strongest, he's the type of dude to wait for his opponent to power up so he challenge himself.
 
The power scaling is completely broken at this point so I have no expectations for this last episode. Even a worn down and beaten Jiren should immediately mop the floor with Frieza and 17.

I thought they were going to go in another direction with a Goku gifting Jiren energy and Jiren realizing the power of friends/family. Not saying that’s a good outcome, but it would have made more sense than Frieza and 17 putting up any resistance what so ever at this point.
 
RJ43 said:
The power scaling is completely broken at this point so I have no expectations for this last episode. Even a worn down and beaten Jiren should immediately mop the floor with Frieza and 17.

I thought they were going to go in another direction with a Goku gifting Jiren energy and Jiren realizing the power of friends/family. Not saying that’s a good outcome, but it would have made more sense than Frieza and 17 putting up any resistance what so ever at this point.
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This is Frieza arc retold

At this point in time Goku is laying in lava and Gohan is distracting Frieza to give Goku time to recover in contrast to Frieza and 17 trying to distract Jiren while Goku recovers

The parallels are everywhere
 
1. I'm ready for the series to be over.

2. I wish that U7 would understand the rules of the tournament. Less fighting, more hiding.

3. "Speaking Jiren" is an annoying little bitch.
 
Ikuza said:
I wish that U7 would understand the rules of the tournament. Less fighting, more hiding.
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This! If they wanted to they could've let Jiren knock Goku off the Stage and came out of hiding in the last 3-5 seconds. Or a less risky option would've been Frieza emerging to save Goku the way he did and 17 remain hiding either until the final seconds or to keep Frieza (and I guess stupid ass Goku) from being knocked off the Stage by Jiren.

"Speaking Jiren" is an annoying little bitch.
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Agreed. He sounds like one of those scorned single mothers with 6 kids trying to get revenge on all of her baby daddies.
 
When goku was standing victorious over jiren. I was expecting a cheap shot from frieza and when goku got damaged I was like " yup there it is" then I was super happy to be wrong.
 
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